Did NASCAR steal JPM's first oval win?

[Mr Alcatraz]

Messin' with Sasquath [-X


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91i8qORU ... r_embedded#[/youtube]


[-X [-X

[Mr Alcatraz]

They just can't stop Messin' with Sasquacth

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl= ... 6sMZ2f2OwH



Once again I feel like I have to apollogise about the behavior of one of my countryman
Sorry Ciro

This can not be considered by evolved Homo Sapien's as not being a racist comment PERIOD


A lot of people (American Motor racing fans) are writing this off as an over-reaction to the situation. Even Juan was mildly amused, and had an interesting retort when questioned
about the affair:

"I don't even know who he is," Montoya said. "Somebody mentioned it to me. I don't really care to tell you the truth. I could say I spent the last three hours eating tacos, but I was actually driving the car."

This is an example of ethnic stereotyping that has over-stayed its welcome in the USA. I have to propose that the only reason the network (ESPN) meted out such a strong penalty was their concern over their Latino constituency!
BTW having been born and hale from Indiana
I'm glad that Griese isn't the illegitimate Grandson of Strom Thurmond
Have a great day,
Cheers,
The Taz

[Saribro]

So if he said "burger" instead of "taco" it would've been fine?
Seriously, what's the deal here, where's the racial reference?

[Mr Alcatraz]

So if he said "burger" instead of "taco" it would've been fine?
Seriously, what's the deal here, where's the racial reference?

Here is the distinction!
How about (I'll just pick a name, a compatriot) David Beckam was commentating a British Footy, and the network was promoting the climax of the formula 1 season. His partner says. "It's still a race between Button, Barrichello, and Vettle!! One says “Where’s Hamilton" Than Beckam ejaculates:
He's out eating Pork Chops Mashed potatoes and chitlins.
Does that shed a slightly different light on it all of a sudden?
I love it when people say they are not racist, and have no idea what it means [-X

[Saribro]

Should I now feel offended because you're calling Beckham a compatriot of mine?
Either way, 'fish and chips' would've been less of a mouthful and probably a more obvious stereotype.
I guess I just don't get it, must be me.

[Ray]

It's not that big of a deal if JPM didn't take offense. If they guy the supposed 'racial insult' was directed at didn't care about it, why should you? The announcer meant nothing by it other than he wasn't in contention. Get over it. What do you want him to do? Grovel at the feet of every person that comes from a place that eats tacos? Serve jail time? Have his tongue cut out? Lose his job for things people make good hearted jokes about to each other every single day and no one cares but the people who just want something to bitch about? How about the bullshit that's put in movies and TV shows? Or, God forbid, rap albums? Why don't those get the same amount of coverage?

You don't see me getting my panties in a knot whenever white people are blamed for --- that happened five to ten generations before mine came along do you? Or how about the things I've been accused of as a white man that happened thirty years before I was born? Don't see me insulting every Greek I've met because one Greek, when I visited Crete,literally spit in my face for being a white male like George W Bush and saying that I was just as evil as he was? I'm a white male, so I'm guilty of whatever he's done simply by association right? Where's your outrage about that?

How about when quite a few people here have made very unkind remarks how all Americans are fat and stupid and can't drive anything that turns to the right? Or that 'rednecks' hate black people and screw their cousins? Where's the outrage for that? Nowhere. Try being a white male visiting the Peace Park in Hiroshima Japan as a sign of deep respect and see how you get treated. See what insults get hurled at you when you go pay respects t people that were killed needlessly in war. Try that and then come back bitching about someone who made a stupid mistake that wasn't intended to be an insult.

It wasn't meant in anger, it was blown way out of proportion, has been given way too much biased attention, and the guy it was said in the direction of didn't care. STFU and get over yourselves. I don't bitch and complain for being blamed for --- that my ancestors did so get a grip.





EDIT: The real problem is this. People respond to these kinds of comments. If everyone let this kind of crap roll off their backs, it would die very quickly. But people are suckered into caring about what other people think and say, this crap keep perpetuating. LET IT DIE. Sooner rather than later people will stop saying things like this. I actually quit watching the show Bones because of some stupid racial --- from a subordinate that was an 'African American' to his 'White' slave owner they had in one of their shows. I almost threw my remote control at my TV because of what was said and the fact that they claim this is still going on while in fact encouraging it time and again. No different than the governments of the world. Easier way to keep that from happening again, I ignore the show. And if I find out any of the writers on that show contribute to any other show I watch, I'll quit watching them too.

[Mr Alcatraz]

As usual a very insightful post! Yes we need to get past our sensitivity about Racism in the U.s, but were a long shot from actually being close to doing it. Don't tell me that Juan doesn't care. Did you read the statement? Let me refresh!

""I don't even know who he is," Montoya said.”Somebody mentioned it to me. I don't really care to tell you the truth. I could say I spent the last three hours eating tacos, but I was actually driving the car."

He has the dignity to rise above it I'm sure all in all he will say his NASCAR experience is a positiveone.
However knowing your background a southerner that was stationed at Miramar Naval, or Marine,air station depending on when you were there,
I suggest you are an intelligent Southern Gentleman. Yet I detect that your view (like a lot of Georgians) and more pedestrian insensitive Americans is slightly skewed by Jim Crow tinted Glasses. I say slightly because you are an exception
I salute you. But these things are only opposed by degrees.
I was born in Coral Gables Fla. My Parent were transplants from New York. I've lived on the west coast since 1960. However I remember asking my mother (a new yorker) why the water fountains had white and black handles on them? Her answer was in hind sight very diplomatic yet spoken from a posture of disaproval, and I quote:
"well some people think that black people, and white people have different types of germs."
Were talking 19 freakin' 59 over 'ere
There is a key that removes these.(remnants of Jim Crow) It’s called awareness that is the job of the media. I think it is helping many ignorant compatriots. This is just more evidence that we have a very long way to go!
I’m out of here chief!
Peace

[Ray]

Tazio, I think we may have a gross misunderstanding between us. Maybe it stems from my brash way of writing, or my bad habit of contracting foot and mouth disease quite frequently . I'll have to PM you when I have the time to gather my reply in a coherent manner to keep this topic from being spoiled further than it may have been already by me. But until I get that chance let me assure you that I don't believe in 'seperate but equal' in any way,shape, or form. Not discounting those laws were abolished almost twenty years before I was even born (see the pattern of being held assumed guilty or in support for something that happened before my time?). If that were the case, I would be doing a great disservice to my Uncle Roy. Circustances in my family weren't ideal when he was born, (my Aunt Sandra wasn't married at the time to his father and his father skipped out on him and to this day he has never met him, even into his 40s) but he has been treated with the same love and affection that anyone else in the family has. Because he's exactly that. Family. And nothing will change that. This was back in the 60s, not exactly a great time for that kind of thing to happen, but it never came into the picture what the color of his skin was, he was a member of the family and everyone loved him as much. Can you imagine how hard it was not only on him, but the rest of my aunts and uncles that had to look out for him? They had to defend him from both sides!

I think I have a good reason to say the things I've said and that my opinion carries at least a little weight. I've traveled every corner of the globe, and simply having the same skin color as George W Bush, and speaking English like he does has gotten me alot of dirty looks, I've been spit on, and been threatened with death. All because of the way I look. Not one single person that treated me that way even asked me so much as what my name was. They instantly hated me for reasons I couldn't understand or control. But I can't hold a grudge and I don't. What they believe is something I can't change, certainly not with discussion. They wouldn't even talk to me. I met alot of great people around the world and I REFUSE to let those few ruin all of my experiences. It's not worth it to dwell on it and I can't change it.

Juan took the right road, he answered the question without making anything of it. He ignored the stupid comment and he's moving on. Too bad the press can't just ignore idiots like that commentator. It would go a long way if people that make inflammatory remarks were completely ignored by society, they'd see them for what they are. People of low intelligence that only want attention. Situations like that are best approached by simply ignoring the person that said them.

But back to Montoya. I cannot believe just how much talent that guy has. I knew he was a world class driver, but I'm even surprised that he was banging doors on a short track like Martinsville with the best of the best. I ould be hard pressed to say with a straight face that 5 years ago I would have believed he could have been this good on a track he's never raced on. (short tracks) I was very impressed when he got into a Dirt Late Model and did as well as he did. They guy can drive anything! The best part about it though is thumbing my nose at other NASCAR fans and rooting for the underdog. Fills me with alot of pride to be able to say 'I told you so!' His results in the last half of this season mean only one thing. He's gonna be AWESOME next year and I cannot wait!

[Mr Alcatraz]

Should I now feel offended because you're calling Beckham a compatriot of mine?
Either way, 'fish and chips' would've been less of a mouthful and probably a more obvious stereotype.
I guess I just don't get it, must be me.

I meant a compatriot of Haniltons being Beckem I think you understand my point.
And I apreciate your educating me on the code in the U.K.
Here Fried Chicken Water Mellons Butterbeans Collard Greens.Pork ribs!
BTW all fantastic fare when prepared properly.
I'm sorry if you mistook my quoting of your post as a personal attack.
It was a comentary on mine!
Peace Bro'

[Ray]

Really Tazio? Collard greens? YUCK! And I'm from Mississippi!

[Mr Alcatraz]

Tazio, I think we may have a gross misunderstanding between us. Maybe it stems from my brash way of writing, or my bad habit of contracting foot and mouth disease quite frequently . I'll have to PM you when I have the time to gather my reply in a coherent manner to keep this topic from being spoiled further than it may have been already by me. But until I get that chance let me assure you that I don't believe in 'seperate but equal' in any way,shape, or form. Not discounting those laws were abolished almost twenty years before I was even born (see the pattern of being held assumed guilty or in support for something that happened before my time?). If that were the case, I would be doing a great disservice to my Uncle Roy. Circustances in my family weren't ideal when he was born, (my Aunt Sandra wasn't married at the time to his father and his father skipped out on him and to this day he has never met him, even into his 40s) but he has been treated with the same love and affection that anyone else in the family has. Because he's exactly that. Family. And nothing will change that. This was back in the 60s, not exactly a great time for that kind of thing to happen, but it never came into the picture what the color of his skin was, he was a member of the family and everyone loved him as much. Can you imagine how hard it was not only on him, but the rest of my aunts and uncles that had to look out for him? They had to defend him from both sides!

I think I have a good reason to say the things I've said and that my opinion carries at least a little weight. I've traveled every corner of the globe, and simply having the same skin color as George W Bush, and speaking English like he does has gotten me alot of dirty looks, I've been spit on, and been threatened with death. All because of the way I look. Not one single person that treated me that way even asked me so much as what my name was. They instantly hated me for reasons I couldn't understand or control. But I can't hold a grudge and I don't. What they believe is something I can't change, certainly not with discussion. They wouldn't even talk to me. I met alot of great people around the world and I REFUSE to let those few ruin all of my experiences. It's not worth it to dwell on it and I can't change it.

Juan took the right road, he answered the question without making anything of it. He ignored the stupid comment and he's moving on. Too bad the press can't just ignore idiots like that commentator. It would go a long way if people that make inflammatory remarks were completely ignored by society, they'd see them for what they are. People of low intelligence that only want attention. Situations like that are best approached by simply ignoring the person that said them.

But back to Montoya. I cannot believe just how much talent that guy has. I knew he was a world class driver, but I'm even surprised that he was banging doors on a short track like Martinsville with the best of the best. I ould be hard pressed to say with a straight face that 5 years ago I would have believed he could have been this good on a track he's never raced on. (short tracks) I was very impressed when he got into a Dirt Late Model and did as well as he did. They guy can drive anything! The best part about it though is thumbing my nose at other NASCAR fans and rooting for the underdog. Fills me with alot of pride to be able to say 'I told you so!' His results in the last half of this season mean only one thing. He's gonna be AWESOME next year and I cannot wait!

Great info Ray!
Yes I was raised for lack of a more politically correct term by a "Mammy" until I was 6 yrs old, as both my parents were pursuing their teaching credentials at U of Miami. This was for the most part a very positive experience.
My father already had a degree in Nautical Navigation from Kings Point.
My mother had a bachelor’s degree of science from St Joseph College for Women in Brooklyn N.Y.
I don't remember all the detail But I can tell you without fear of recrimination:
1) This woman, Dorothy used to walk my older brother and me into Coral Gables proper set out a picnic blanket and go to the rear door of Shorty's Ribs and we had a picnic

2) When I was very young my mother told me that she came home and was very concerned about the bruising around my ears. When Dorothy pressed said in a very apologetic way:
“I guess I just loved him too much”!
3) Out of the clear blue she asked my father if she could borrow $200.00
A lot of money in the 50's. My father and this was always his style said:
“I can loan you the money but I need to know that it is for a legitimate reason.”
She had to explain to my father that her husband was found in bed with another man's wife, shot dead on the spot, and the money was for a dignified burial!
I bet it never made the papers back then or my parents would have known!

[Mr Alcatraz]

Really Tazio? Collard greens? YUCK! And I'm from Mississippi!

You have to cook them slowly all day with quality Ham hocks! =D>

[Mr Alcatraz]

Juan goes off like a Neutron Bomb in the finale.
Great theatre
I Laughed MAO
Like I've said all along;
"Don't mess with Sasquatch" [-X

[PNSD]

Stewart had it coming! He didnt give JPM the room then tried to ram him off road!

Kinda like Hamlins move in the nationwide race

[Shrek]

you could definetly see Tony ram Juan on the backstretch and Juan was less abrupt when he faught back and yet NASCAR still penalised Juan 2 laps. NASCAR again making it up as it goes