2025 McLaren F1 Team

[venkyhere]

You say Lando lost Qatar 2024 while having the fastest car. What exactly makes you say that? He didn't get pole, he didn't inherit the lead of the race at any point and he didn't have a faster average pace than Max in the race either. Why is McLaren evaluated as the fastest car there, when every piece of data has RedBull/Max ahead?

Piastri qualified with more than a quarter of a second delta over Max in his Redbull (a driver who can't be accused of not 'committing' to a corner) , on a track with no hard braking or slow traction zones. The McL39 was clearly superior over the RB21, why even have doubts over that ? We saw in race pace (Piastri) as well, the same thing. Norris didn't clearly 'commit' himself as much as the two of them did. Simple. Show me the data comparison between Piastri and Max, to prove which was the faster car.

[AR3-GP]

2024

[Farnborough]

You say Lando lost Qatar 2024 while having the fastest car. What exactly makes you say that? He didn't get pole, he didn't inherit the lead of the race at any point and he didn't have a faster average pace than Max in the race either. Why is McLaren evaluated as the fastest car there, when every piece of data has RedBull/Max ahead?

Piastri qualified with more than a quarter of a second delta over Max in his Redbull (a driver who can't be accused of not 'committing' to a corner) , on a track with no hard braking or slow traction zones. The McL39 was clearly superior over the RB21, why even have doubts over that ? We saw in race pace (Piastri) as well, the same thing. Norris didn't clearly 'commit' himself as much as the two of them did. Simple. Show me the data comparison between Piastri and Max, to prove which was the faster car.

While a can see both points of view here, there is i believe nuance that distorts conventional evaluation, for this track and specifically its surface characteristics.
In Moto-GP (for which it was designed, i believe) it often "floats" to the surface an unusual winner, that may be uncompetitive almost anywhere else in the year. Its quite peculiar in its grip properties that seem to enhance some specific attributes in different riders/drivers the nuance of which Piastri appears very at home within.

To me it seems that Piastri, on this occasion, just got it to give that scenario of relative easy pace delivery. It just appeared to make significant difference on this weekend, over and above the others. Relaxed and potent from the outset, the harder the others tried for pace, the more aggressive they were, the more they diminished their chance of matching that absolute balance in delivering , on this occasion.

[FittingMechanics]

You cannot talk about Qatar 2025 without taking into account that Norris was in "bring this home" mode. He took less risks, drove more conservatively knowing he has a good margin.

[mwillems]

We've had 24 races. On a wide variety of tracks at various different temperatures in the day and in the evening.

No one car will be the master of all of them, which means its reliant on if they have another team to challenge.

We knew from the start the Mclaren was on average the best race car, but straight away it was looking close in qualifying, and not just because drivers made errors.

We know both drivers could have done better at times but I'm sure that could be the same for every driver out there

I suppose they're trying to figure out how to draw the line and say what makes a car fast enough that it is harder to finish second than win. As the conversation suggests, it is highly subjective and there is plenty of grey areas.

[Emag]

You say Lando lost Qatar 2024 while having the fastest car. What exactly makes you say that? He didn't get pole, he didn't inherit the lead of the race at any point and he didn't have a faster average pace than Max in the race either. Why is McLaren evaluated as the fastest car there, when every piece of data has RedBull/Max ahead?

Piastri qualified with more than a quarter of a second delta over Max in his Redbull (a driver who can't be accused of not 'committing' to a corner) , on a track with no hard braking or slow traction zones. The McL39 was clearly superior over the RB21, why even have doubts over that ? We saw in race pace (Piastri) as well, the same thing. Norris didn't clearly 'commit' himself as much as the two of them did. Simple. Show me the data comparison between Piastri and Max, to prove which was the faster car.

Was talking about *2024,

There was no contest in 2025. Oscar wins that race 100% if McLaren pits with the rest in lap 7.

[mzso]

It's impossible to have proof. Discussions at the cafè are impossible to regulate, and they do happen, especially were money is involved. Thinking otherwise is naive. RedBull should be forced to sell the second team.

It's in no way against regulations. Sharing designs is. Maybe data as well, that's unclear.

On another note, I'm surprised that yesterday's McLaren masterclass strategy has been largely unremarked. So many are quick to poo on them when they mess up, but they even outsmarted the famed RedBull strategy team. Yesterday was pure class from them.

Masterclass? In patheticness? They made sure, if anything happened to Norris, Verstappen would win. That was their strategy...
An obvious strategy would have been Norris trying to hinder Verstappen as much as possible at the start to let Piastri through, or give Piastri a strategy that gives him the potential to overtake him if that failed. That way even fifth would have been enough for Norris to win. And if he crashed or had a failure, or was just slow, Piastri would have been the champion insead of Verstappen.

Their strategy was as pathetic as ever.

[mzso]

Let's not forget, when will Will Courtenay, RBR Head of Race Strategy, join McLaren???

I read that he was working till the end of the season and now gardening leave to mid 2026. Not sure if that is fully accurate.

Who knows what will happen next year, we may be midfield again. Let's enjoy this.

Was there an exact date ever mentioned? Mid 2026 is meaningless. It could be anything from March to September.

[Balalu]

It's impossible to have proof. Discussions at the cafè are impossible to regulate, and they do happen, especially were money is involved. Thinking otherwise is naive. RedBull should be forced to sell the second team.

It's in no way against regulations. Sharing designs is. Maybe data as well, that's unclear.

On another note, I'm surprised that yesterday's McLaren masterclass strategy has been largely unremarked. So many are quick to poo on them when they mess up, but they even outsmarted the famed RedBull strategy team. Yesterday was pure class from them.

Masterclass? In patheticness? They made sure, if anything happened to Norris, Verstappen would win. That was their strategy...
An obvious strategy would have been Norris trying to hinder Verstappen as much as possible at the start to let Piastri through, or give Piastri a strategy that gives him the potential to overtake him if that failed. That way even fifth would have been enough for Norris to win. And if he crashed or had a failure, or was just slow, Piastri would have been the champion insead of Verstappen.

Their strategy was as pathetic as ever.

1) It is not fair nor right in a sport that is famed as the pinnacle of motorsport, and were every tiny little bit counts.

2) Thank God you are not a McLaren strategist....

[mzso]

1) It is not fair nor right in a sport that is famed as the pinnacle of motorsport, and were every tiny little bit counts.

You don't get to decide what's fair. It's not regulated and that's what matters.

2) Thank God you are not a McLaren strategist....

Yeah, the they would have won races ago. But that's true to every average person, they actively suck, just like Ferrari.

[Darth-Piekus]

The strategy team of Mclaren was average I would say. They made some blunders throughout the year costing the team and drivers valuable points. After Monza however they have dropped the ball with over 5 sec pit stops, a Disqualification, not taking the sensible strategy in Qatar and one or two more occasions. While the engineering team was a 10/10, Norris and Piastri did a 8/10 I would say, the strategy team was a 5/10 at best. The team managed to bring Max into the game by losing 60 points on each driver but all well that ends well and Norris is the rightful champion despite some fans feeling disturbed by it.

But what about 2026. I would love to hear opinions about 2026. We have the biggest rule overhaul. Active Aeros with Z Position used in every single straight and X Position for turns. New tyres and I hope they may never use these crappy covers again not to mention Pirelli getting their act together and create tyres who are able to manage a full lap without getting shredded. What else. A V6 Turbo Hybrid Engine with 560 HP and a Battery for an extra 13 seconds 560 HP charged in turns and braking. That is gonna show us who is the complete driver. Now you have to strategise when to use the battery and when to charge it as it makes a huge difference. Also bye bye crappy Ground Effect. You were dangerous in the 80s and you were hazardous for drivers now. Welcome back 90s bargeboards and a simpler floor with smaller cars and hoping we can see some impressive battles.

[Slitch-nl]

Well I do believe that because McLaren had 2 good drivers, the domination in points would never happen.
However, when Max, Lewis (and Rosberg) or Michael had the best car; they would drive off in the distance, literally showing their domination. Especially in wet races where car performance isn't that important.
I think a lot of people don't feel its the same for McLaren. Like last year's Singapore; they called it domination by Lando but he nearly binned it 2 times.

I'm not hating on any of them. It just doesn't feel the same as when other great drivers/cars dominated.
This is obviously subjective. But thats how sport is; emotions not all logic.

[Darth-Piekus]

Yes but as you said Michael and Max dominated in points because they had no equal teammates and both garages around them not to mention a car that had double the difference from the rest than Mclaren ever had in 2024 and 2025.

[Quantum]

It's in no way against regulations. Sharing designs is. Maybe data as well, that's unclear.

Sharing data and even telemetry related to car performance with other teams is clearly against the regulations. Per FIA

[Macklaren]

Well I do believe that because McLaren had 2 good drivers, the domination in points would never happen.
However, when Max, Lewis (and Rosberg) or Michael had the best car; they would drive off in the distance, literally showing their domination. Especially in wet races where car performance isn't that important.
I think a lot of people don't feel its the same for McLaren. Like last year's Singapore; they called it domination by Lando but he nearly binned it 2 times.

I'm not hating on any of them. It just doesn't feel the same as when other great drivers/cars dominated.
This is obviously subjective. But thats how sport is; emotions not all logic.

No other GOAT driver has "dominated" in their first year fighting for a championship. Max made tons of mistakes in 2021 as did Lewis in 2007 and 2008 and let's not talk about how Michael won his first title. Once you are champion though, your mindset completely changes...which will be interesting to see with Lando in 2026