2026 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[Badger]

Engine is not second best. It’s 3rd. Both Merc and Ferrari are ahead. No one at RBPT and RB are under any illusions. There will be problems (durability) on PU side. We just haven’t seen them yet.

It’s somewhat dissapointing that they don’t make any progress in low and medium speed corners, as if these deficiencies are baked into their design know-how.

If Red Bull couldn’t figure out how to turn a medium speed corner over the last 2 years, regulations changed, and they still are no good in medium speed…

I disagree, their deployment is superior to Ferrari on the long run data and there is no indication of a meaningful ICE deficit. We should not sell them short just because they are new.

[AR3-GP]

Are you sure about the medium speed performance? I find it difficult to judge at this moment.

According to Wache, yes

“We clearly see some weaknesses in our car, and we relate it to these weaknesses and the feedback that we have from Max and Isack [Hadjar] on the car, based on where we lose time to the others.
"And that is why I'm saying this. Clearly, traction at low speed and medium-speed corners – that was not our strength already last year – and they are still stronger than us there," Wache concluded.

https://www.grandprix247.com/formula-1- ... ull-racing

[Badger]

Part of that traction issue may be PU related. As I said in another thread the Merc looks buttery smooth on power delivery. The few laps I saw of the RB driven in anger it was spinning up the rears. Learning how you bring in the K power will be crucial for single lap and especially long runs.

[Cassius]

So traction low speed, performance medium-speed, top speed low fuel runs, and overweight (although improving weight might improve some of the weaknesses).

Doesn't sound very promising. Let's see how much they can improve with the initial upgrades.

[AR3-GP]

I disagree, their deployment is superior to Ferrari on the long run data and there is no indication of a meaningful ICE deficit. We should not sell them short just because they are new.

It is consistent with what Wache says: https://www.grandprix247.com/formula-1- ... ull-racing

Wache said of the competition. "Some straight-line speeds are also interesting from Ferrari and Mercedes, especially on low fuel.

He also believes that Ferrari and Mercedes recovered any deployment deficit by the 3rd day.

Wache nuanced that during his media session in the paddock: yes, Red Bull started well in terms of energy management over a longer run, but according to him that advantage has now disappeared. Wache’s assessment is that Red Bull simply figured out certain solutions slightly earlier than other teams.

“It’s true that especially during the first day, we were a little bit closer to what we should have,” the Frenchman said. “Then you start to see the tendency of the others going into the same direction, and now even, I would say, a little bit better than us.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/all- ... /10797897/

At face value, he believes Ferrari/Merc PU are in front. The current PU homologation rules are just as bad as the previous token system so any real revisions to the PU hardware will have to wait until 2027.

[Valeo]

I miss Helmut, as I guess we would have already a better idea what's really up when he once again talked about things he shouldn't have

[Badger]

I disagree, their deployment is superior to Ferrari on the long run data and there is no indication of a meaningful ICE deficit. We should not sell them short just because they are new.

It is consistent with what Wache says: https://www.grandprix247.com/formula-1- ... ull-racing

Wache said of the competition. "Some straight-line speeds are also interesting from Ferrari and Mercedes, especially on low fuel.

He also believes that Ferrari and Mercedes recovered any deployment deficit by the 3rd day.

Wache nuanced that during his media session in the paddock: yes, Red Bull started well in terms of energy management over a longer run, but according to him that advantage has now disappeared. Wache’s assessment is that Red Bull simply figured out certain solutions slightly earlier than other teams.

“It’s true that especially during the first day, we were a little bit closer to what we should have,” the Frenchman said. “Then you start to see the tendency of the others going into the same direction, and now even, I would say, a little bit better than us.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/all- ... /10797897/

At face value, he believes Ferrari/Merc PU are in front. The current PU homologation rules are just as bad as the previous token system so any real revisions to the PU hardware will have to wait until 2027.

I think it's mostly nonsense tbh, Waché firing back in the political game of "no one wants to be fast". This was all said in the context of Wolff crowning them the champions of testing and the benchmark on the engine by like a second per lap, which is obviously ridiculous.

Let's look at the data. This is the fastest laps from both teams respectively, Max on day 1, Lewis on day 3.
There's nothing here that suggests a major power difference. They deploy slightly differently, Max early in the lap, Lewis saves some for the end. But in the other zones it's all very similar. Max's lap is worse, he locked up in T10 for example, had a bad exit T13, and T15 too. But the power looks similar and this is Ferrari with more optimisation on day 3.

Now let's look at some race running. This is a lap from one of VER's long runs on day 1, vs a lap from HAM's race run (final stint) on the last day.The Ferrari deploys a bit more on the main straight, but from there on in it's all RB. Overall RB gains significant time on deployment across the whole lap. The laps chosen are consistent with other laps in the same stints, you can check for yourself on GP-Tempo. Hamilton is on low fuel, Verstappen unknown (but assumed to be mid to low).

[pantherxxx]

If car would be so bad Hadjar would not have said he will win a race this year. Wache and Mekies are intentionally downplaying things. At the livery reveal Ford's CEO Jim Farley told us that people love underdog stories. They have to play the underdog, the small energy drink company against the big manufacturers. But Toto, Russell, Sainz and Norris said the same thing, that Red Bull have clear and big advantage in energy management. And Leclerc also said that he thinks that Red Bull is ahead of Ferrari.

[Badger]

Btw, and interesting theory on why Mercedes may not be able to replicate the aggressive down shifting to enhance recovery same as RB. No idea if it's technically valid.

During aggressive downshifts, sudden RPM increases frequently trigger knocking as the air-fuel mixture partially detonates despite minimal injector opening.

Engines with higher compression ratios face more acute knocking thresholds, creating additional stresses on cylinder heads, valves and piston crowns whilst reducing reliability margins. This technical reality explains Mercedes' reluctance to adopt aggressive downshift-based energy recovery methods.

https://racingnews365.com/max-verstappe ... que-change

[Henk_v]

What strikes me is that RB and MB were the 2 manufacturers that exploited a grey area and now it's MB who is under the guillotine.

Could it be both have a trick, but RB's trick is more refined and not threatened by more stringent tests?

By now the kind of new test will be sort of known.

Would be quite a situation if MB is caught by new testst and RB keept it's avantage.

[f1isgood]

What strikes me is that RB and MB were the 2 manufacturers that exploited a grey area and now it's MB who is under the guillotine.

Could it be both have a trick, but RB's trick is more refined and not threatened by more stringent tests?

By now the kind of new test will be sort of known.

Would be quite a situation if MB is caught by new testst and RB keept it's avantage.

I think "reported rumors" say that Red Bull has a working engine that did not rely on the trick and learnt of Mercedes' trick at some point last year. They tried to replicate it but it lacked in certain aspects (unsure what exactly).

To me, if someone believes the rumors, it makes sense that Red Bull flipping sides is simply them electing to nerf Mercedes rather than waste resources on something that may get banned at any point.

[f1isgood]

If car would be so bad Hadjar would not have said he will win a race this year. Wache and Mekies are intentionally downplaying things. At the livery reveal Ford's CEO Jim Farley told us that people love underdog stories. They have to play the underdog, the small energy drink company against the big manufacturers. But Toto, Russell, Sainz and Norris said the same thing, that Red Bull have clear and big advantage in energy management. And Leclerc also said that he thinks that Red Bull is ahead of Ferrari.

Red Bull is the underdog regardless of what happens. They didn't win the last two titles with a dominant car. They are a start-up engine manufacturer without years of institutional knowledge present at Mercedes and Ferrari.

If Red Bull actually outdid the other powerhouses, the other powerhouses have to just take another loss and admit that there's nothing special about them, even with all that institutional knowledge.

[AR3-GP]

If car would be so bad Hadjar would not have said he will win a race this year. Wache and Mekies are intentionally downplaying things. At the livery reveal Ford's CEO Jim Farley told us that people love underdog stories. They have to play the underdog, the small energy drink company against the big manufacturers. But Toto, Russell, Sainz and Norris said the same thing, that Red Bull have clear and big advantage in energy management. And Leclerc also said that he thinks that Red Bull is ahead of Ferrari.

Red Bull is the underdog regardless of what happens. They didn't win the last two titles with a dominant car. They are a start-up engine manufacturer without years of institutional knowledge present at Mercedes and Ferrari.

If Red Bull actually outdid the other powerhouses, the other powerhouses have to just take another loss and admit that there's nothing special about them, even with all that institutional knowledge.

Institutional knowledge can be a hindrance. You have to keep using technology and methodology that you invested in a long time ago. The RB project had no inertia. They could setup the factory in an ideal way for the 2026 PU regs. There was not holding on to old ideas simply because that's how things are done at the company. It can be a benefit.

[ME4ME]

Institutional knowledge can be a hindrance. You have to keep using technology and methodology that you invested in a long time ago. The RB project had no inertia. They could setup the factory in an ideal way for the 2026 PU regs. There was not holding on to old ideas simply because that's how things are done at the company. It can be a benefit.

"We've always done it that way" - the eternal echo in the corridor at work

[dialtone]

If car would be so bad Hadjar would not have said he will win a race this year. Wache and Mekies are intentionally downplaying things. At the livery reveal Ford's CEO Jim Farley told us that people love underdog stories. They have to play the underdog, the small energy drink company against the big manufacturers. But Toto, Russell, Sainz and Norris said the same thing, that Red Bull have clear and big advantage in energy management. And Leclerc also said that he thinks that Red Bull is ahead of Ferrari.

Red Bull is the underdog regardless of what happens. They didn't win the last two titles with a dominant car. They are a start-up engine manufacturer without years of institutional knowledge present at Mercedes and Ferrari.

If Red Bull actually outdid the other powerhouses, the other powerhouses have to just take another loss and admit that there's nothing special about them, even with all that institutional knowledge.

RedBull will be strong as usual. Top 4 cars are close to one another. Ferrari, from the lewis v max lap here, seems to show Ferrari has worse recovery, it could also be because the car is lighter which needs less braking power, but that RBPT engine looks great.

That being said, RBPT hired hundreds of people off of Mercedes. They are not really a startup like Audi that are literally starting from scratch with their own people. Horner did an incredible job on this.