2026 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[Badger]

What are the software update rules for the engine? Can RBPT update it at any point during the season? Feels to me that they have a lot of work to do there to get some laptime.

You see the difference between Merc and its customers, that's obviously software that can be changed. Some of it I suspect is tied to how Merc's chassis allows them to program their software. If you have more grip you can simply harvest more aggressively.

But there's cause for optimism, Ferrari in the race was almost equal with Merc in terms of deployment in the final stint. And there was a massive difference between Ferrari and Haas in terms of deployment. This to me is more evidence of that connection between a great chassis and a lot of deployment. So as you improve the chassis the deployment should improve as well.

[bluechris]

What are the software update rules for the engine? Can RBPT update it at any point during the season? Feels to me that they have a lot of work to do there to get some laptime.

You see the difference between Merc and its customers, that's obviously software that can be changed. Some of it I suspect is tied to how Merc's chassis allows them to program their software. If you have more grip you can simply harvest more aggressively.

But there's cause for optimism, Ferrari in the race was almost equal with Merc in terms of deployment in the final stint. And there was a massive difference between Ferrari and Haas in terms of deployment. This to me is more evidence of that connection between a great chassis and a lot of deployment. So as you improve the chassis the deployment should improve as well.

I repeat, you cannot compare MB with Ferrari in the last stind because MB was cruising.

[AR3-GP]

I repeat, you cannot compare MB with Ferrari in the last stind because MB was cruising.

Agree.

[Badger]

What are the software update rules for the engine? Can RBPT update it at any point during the season? Feels to me that they have a lot of work to do there to get some laptime.

You see the difference between Merc and its customers, that's obviously software that can be changed. Some of it I suspect is tied to how Merc's chassis allows them to program their software. If you have more grip you can simply harvest more aggressively.

But there's cause for optimism, Ferrari in the race was almost equal with Merc in terms of deployment in the final stint. And there was a massive difference between Ferrari and Haas in terms of deployment. This to me is more evidence of that connection between a great chassis and a lot of deployment. So as you improve the chassis the deployment should improve as well.

I repeat, you cannot compare MB with Ferrari in the last stind because MB was cruising.

No evidence of this, just people pushing a narrative instead of doing the work and looking at the data. It's lazy and boring.

[Badger]

I repeat, you cannot compare MB with Ferrari in the last stind because MB was cruising.

Agree.

You don't "cruise" when another car comes out 7s behind you with 15 lap younger tyres. If there was a noticeable change in Merc's deployment at the end of the race you may have a case, but there really wasn't. If they were cruising it wasn't on the deployment side.

[AR3-GP]

No evidence of this, just people pushing a narrative instead of doing the work and looking at the data. It's lazy and boring.

The Mercedes were on 13 and 16 lap older tires. Since there is an influence of grip level on the harvesting (as you've also mentioned in a previous post), then it's not really an apples to apples comparison. Mercedes would be able to harvest more efficiently with fresher tires (more in brake zone, less in super clip or lico).

[Cassius]

No evidence of this, just people pushing a narrative instead of doing the work and looking at the data. It's lazy and boring.

The Mercedes were on 13 and 16 lap older tires. Since there is an influence of grip level on the harvesting (as you've also mentioned in a previous post), then it's not really an apples to apples comparison. Mercedes would be able to harvest more efficiently with fresher tires (more in brake zone, less in super clip or lico).

Can you explain how that works? With older tires you have to break earlier and with less power to slow down the car more vs when you have fresher tires. How does that lead to lower level of harvesting vs fresher tires?

Or is it it because of the lower cornering speeds you have to deploy more in the traction phase?

I am trying to understand why Max couldn't deploy in t8-t11 anymore from lap 53. What is due to older, graining tyres requiring more deployment in the traction phase which overall was more optimal than using the <lap 52 deployment in t8-t11?

[Sieper]

maybe they had not brought enough fuel? Max was chasing almost all race.

[Badger]

No evidence of this, just people pushing a narrative instead of doing the work and looking at the data. It's lazy and boring.

The Mercedes were on 13 and 16 lap older tires. Since there is an influence of grip level on the harvesting (as you've also mentioned in a previous post), then it's not really an apples to apples comparison. Mercedes would be able to harvest more efficiently with fresher tires (more in brake zone, less in super clip or lico).

It would have an impact, but deg was fairly low. Merc does have a PU advantage but its extent is exaggerated due to the chassis. Ferrari was able to achieve something quite close on a very power sensitive circuit once they began finding their rhythm, and it's no coincidence because their chassis is right up there.

[Badger]

Btw, is it a coincidence that the two teams with essentially the same sidepod-diffuser concept have the highest cornering speeds? Are we about to see a convergence like in 2022 with RB's concept?

[Vettel165]

Red Bull are 40 seconds behind Ferrari, Engine and Chassis have messed up against a team that couldn't fight its way out of a wet paper bag

Yeah, starting from last.

Max would probably be fighting for P3 if he started higher. Lets take some positive things from this race and move on. Lose some weight and then we can fight,"its a marathon not a sprint".

[euv2]

Btw, is it a coincidence that the two teams with essentially the same sidepod-diffuser concept have the highest cornering speeds? Are we about to see a convergence like in 2022 with RB's concept?https://pbs.twimg.com/media/HC52mUnWwAA ... =4096x4096

It will depend on how much ground Red bull can make up with the current concept for this year, if they get close to Mercedes, they will stick with the concept for RB23.

But the lower end teams will surely be making the jump. This is the scary prospect for Red bull, because there will be move innovation based on this concept and the top teams will adopt the neat ideas.

[AR3-GP]

Btw, is it a coincidence that the two teams with essentially the same sidepod-diffuser concept have the highest cornering speeds? Are we about to see a convergence like in 2022 with RB's concept?https://pbs.twimg.com/media/HC52mUnWwAA ... =4096x4096

We can't determine if Mercedes and Ferrari have more downforce because their concepts are more developed (shifted earlier to 2026, more WT and CFD runs) or because the concept itself has a higher basic potential. Ferrari has a blown exhaust system as well. It's too early to connect anything to the sidepod shape.

[Paa]

Is there any news about what happened to Hadjar's engine? Or was that even engine related? Maybe I missed it, but did not see anything regarding this.

[AR3-GP]

It would have an impact, but deg was fairly low. Merc does have a PU advantage but its extent is exaggerated due to the chassis. Ferrari was able to achieve something quite close on a very power sensitive circuit once they began finding their rhythmk, and it's no coincidence because their chassis is right up there.

I know we use the "no deg" terminology a lot, but what we are seeing is the loss of tire grip being perfectly counterbalanced by the weight reduction from the fuel burn when we see constant lap times ( i know that you know that already). So those tires have less grip after 16 laps than they do when new. As a result, Merc is going to have to back off the MGU-K braking towards end of stint to prevent lockups.

It's telling that RB is showing to be one of the deployment standouts while clearly running a car with a more limited chassis (lower rear axle grip limit, and overweight). If the chassis was on par with Mercedes (weight and aero), I doubt there would be any perceptible differences in the PU performance on the track.

For that reason, I think a 1 second a lap gap in 2026 is a lot different to a 1 second gap in the previous regulations. The harvesting efficiency is a lot more sensitive to the chassis in these regs than it was in the previous regs. Chassis improvements will have a snowball effect for both cornering speed, and deployment.