So... the question everyone is thinking...

[ISLAMATRON]

How does one give 120%?... is that not against the laws of tire dynamics?

[Terrible3]

Hamilton is still unknown to me. For 2 years he's got the quickest car and this season he's got the quickest car in the last few races when the McLaren with KERS has outclassed everybody (in the last race Lewis qualified more than half a second ahead of SV).

I am sorry but if you think the Mclaren outclassed everyone in the last part of the season pass me the crack you are on. There is no way you can say that LH 0.5 second gap was down to his car having the upper hand. His quali time came down to him driving at the absolute limit. Just compare LH pace to HK all year and its night and day. LH made the best out of that car and should be commended for it.

How does one give 120%?... is that not against the laws of tire dynamics?

The point is that he will have to push himself to a whole new level of driving. I am not saying JB cant do it, in fact I hope he is able to.


I think martin brundle put it best when he said that he had the tallent to drive at the same pace as Shumi, but he was unable to do it often enough. Shumacher's natural limit was Martins extreme limit.

[nipo]

@ringo
Alonso threw away quite a few points by trying ultra aggressive on his driving and strategy... don't remember which races exactly but there were a few times the past two seasons. He is still a very capable driver and is in the top 3 of my list - just somehow these two years he is not fully performing at his level.

The personality and stuff is just personal opinion and is a side note in the message. I don't like him doesn't take away his achievements, and like you, I respect that a lot, too.

@Terrible3
I am surprised. First you took me as saying ALL of the half second is because of the car. That's clearly not true. Secondly, everyone could see the McLaren pace picking up significantly towards the end of the season. It might not be a lot, but at least they are slightly ahead of Red Bull by the end on some circuits. As to Heikki's performance, he's been trailing far behind Lewis almost all season and God knows why... My point was not to disregard Lewis' ability, it was just to say that he shone when the car was good and he wasn't exactly driving a "crap" car as some would like to believe.

[kilcoo316]

Regarding the poll... kilcoo, let's say you right eventually Lewis out-shines Jenson next year, what is so brilliant about your bias?

It is not biased, its just removing unnecessary answers.


If anyone truly believes Button will "out-shine" Hamilton next year, their knowledge of F1 is so bad that their opinion is simply not worth listening to - like listening to a stupid junkies view on the 'dangers' of nuclear power.

It is simply that obvious and clear what the outcome is going to be.

[marcush.]

still it´s a possibility.
maybe the car fits like a glove for Button ...strange things happen in life.Webber was not the first and not the last F1 driver to see his his F1 season compromised by mishaps away from the track...Berger suffered sinus infection for example,Gachot was arrested...
at the end these ifs will not count as excuses as we are only counting the points under their belts.

[Ciro Pabón]

If anyone truly believes Button will "out-shine" Hamilton next year, their knowledge of F1 is so bad that their opinion is simply not worth listening to - like listening to a stupid junkies view on the 'dangers' of nuclear power.

It is simply that obvious and clear what the outcome is going to be.

I believe Button will outshine Hamilton. I also believe apartheid will be reinstated in F1 and I'm very afraid of nuclear power. I'm also afraid of stupid junkies. I'm even more afraid of intelligent junkies.

I think it's sad that Stefan Bellof is dead, if he weren't he would beat Hamilton. And Button. And Coulthard. Heck, I think Kasey Kahne can beat Hamilton. I think Jeff Gordon is better than Graham Hill.

I also think that Mickey Mouse is better than Pluto. If you believe that Clarabella is better than Uncle Scrooge your opinion is simply not worth listening. It's clear: if Road Runner beats the Coyote, the Coyote beats Tweetie and Tweetie beats Sylvester and Sylvester beats Daffy Duck, and Clarabella beats Sylvester, then, who is your daddy? Clarabella, isn't it? By 20 points, at least.

Clarabella and me: no hard feelings.


NOTE: Please, guys, there is no need to report this thread: this thread reports itself. Any post in this thread can be reported. Mmmmmmm.... that would be a good title for this thread.

[WhiteBlue]

ROFLMAO - where is the yingyang thread?

[xpensive]

What about Gyro Gearloose, Ciro? Name sounds familiar, doesn't it?

[ringo]

@ringo
Alonso threw away quite a few points by trying ultra aggressive on his driving and strategy... don't remember which races exactly but there were a few times the past two seasons. He is still a very capable driver and is in the top 3 of my list - just somehow these two years he is not fully performing at his level.

The personality and stuff is just personal opinion and is a side note in the message. I don't like him doesn't take away his achievements, and like you, I respect that a lot, too.

@Terrible3
I am surprised. First you took me as saying ALL of the half second is because of the car. That's clearly not true. Secondly, everyone could see the McLaren pace picking up significantly towards the end of the season. It might not be a lot, but at least they are slightly ahead of Red Bull by the end on some circuits. As to Heikki's performance, he's been trailing far behind Lewis almost all season and God knows why... My point was not to disregard Lewis' ability, it was just to say that he shone when the car was good and he wasn't exactly driving a "crap" car as some would like to believe.

The car was really much better for sure. It was fast in brazil and *fastest in abudahbi but it wasn't as balanced as the Brawn of Redbull, it was compensating for its weakness at high G turns with the KERS on the straight and the good slow speed characteristics. This is why Heiki was so off, he didn't make the time in the slow corners by extreme late braking or carving the corners like Lewis.

* fast if driven phenomenally at it's strongest parts of the track to compensate for the weaker parts.

Button could find him self being separated by a redbull or 2 ferraris if the cars happen to be roughly equal to the mp4, and the 2 tenths from the driver become the deciding factor.
Alonso's 6 tenghts should allow him to use the 2009 car in qualifying to make things fair.

[PlatinumZealot]

That mclaren was only great at tracks with many slow turns like Hungary, Valencia, Monaco, Monza, Singapore etc because the funadamental mechanics worked very well and the Kers and the Benz engine would make up for the straights. The aero on the other hand pretty sucked, It was well designed but it just didn't produce enough downforce.

That makes amazing Hamilton's Podium in Suzuka where good downforce is needed. In the race Hamilton's MP4-24 was being pushed beyond it's "rated" performance in the fight against Trulli's Toyota. At one time the team asked Hamilton for a 3 second Gap to Trulli. Hamilton responded by turning up the intensity and precision and he really delivered the three second gap! Really, I wasn't expecting that! Awesome. It's like he drove the car at 100% efficiency that day. That is what teams want, just for the driver to drive the car at maximum precision for extended periods of time. Nobody can make a bad car good, but the 100% of a bad car can be more than the 95% of a really good car and that is what we saw at Suzuka.

[Richard]

The aero on the other hand pretty sucked, It was well designed but it just didn't produce enough downforce.

That's like the Titanic bulkheads - well designed, but they just weren't high enough to hold back the water?

[PlatinumZealot]

I don't know much about ships but something like that. Mclaren put so much work into the design process, but something was missing or forgotten from the beginning.

[lebesset]

what was missing was adrian newey

[ISLAMATRON]

I guess that was why the car was reliable

[marcush.]

back on topic I do not see why in the original question it was not even considered a possibility why Button -current WC -should not be able to find circumstances allowing him to score more points than Lewis.
Even a certain MS faced a defeat against Eddie Irvine at Ferrari ...