2026 Aston Martin Aramco Formula One Team

[zoroastar]

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There have only been two championship winning engines manufacturers in the last decade. Ferrari and Renault could not in 10 years. It took Honda 5 years. Give it time.

Renault was always underfunded and never intended to win. Ferrari got nerfed by the FIA.

It took Honda 6 seasons and 8 years since the announced return to F1 to win. They were still the second best PU manufacturer that season, even if it was by a small margin (as per Japanese sources: https://f1-motorsports-gp.com/honda/hon ... 1h-1014hp/). That championship was won because of Redbull's aero. Had Honda partnered with any other team they would not have won any championships either.

Honda can absolutely repeat the scenario and become competitive with the benchmark set by Mercedes. But not anytime soon. It also doesnt excuse the fact that they have come to the grid with a shambolic PU twice now which is comically noncompetitive.

I'm not including the lost years with McLaren. Honda was allowed to develop their PU with Toro Rosso. AMR should take note. Why do you think the Racing Bulls cars was even a podium contender last year?

The championship was won by Redbull's Hero, Max Verstappen. And he credited the Honda engine and that's why Honda backed him. His feedback was impeccable, and in turn, Honda worked on drivability.

Your usage of the word "shambolic" and twice simply demonstrates a lack of understanding and appreciation for the actual challenge Honda has joined F1 for. So you'll never get it.

there are 4 other engine suppliers that have thoroughly outdone them at that challenge. including 2 that had never built an f1 engine before. this total and utter allegiance to a company, regardless of the fruits of their labor is kinda lost on me. it is what it is though. dont you just wish theyd do a better job sometimes though?

[Honda Porsche fan]

What is preventing Honda from studying and learning from how Mercedes runs their F1 engine program ? I'm not saying Honda has to copy Mercedes 100% but, learn how Mercedes has continuity and consistency.

[CHT]

Considering what is happening on and off track, I think AMR is actually in a very bad shape right now.

When LS sign a deal with Honda back in May 2023, their sole aim was to become a works team and top team in F1 like Red Bull. For this reason LS manage to convince investors to pump in hundreds of millions into their new factory and followed by recruiting Newey joining the team on 10th Sep 2024.

Obviously everyone at AMR were all excited about 2026 because Newey is known to be able to outsmart others when it comes to exploiting new technical regulation. So to start 2026 at backfoot with potential prolong engine problem this is a mega setback. And to make matter worst, the cancellation of Jeddah GP (home race for Aramco) and Bahrain will means significant losses in revenue and sponsorship money.

And with high fuel price and shortage of supply, this entire F1 circus flying around the world will make less sense for fans, and also for AMR to send their team to fly around the world just to complete race.

In nutshell, what can possible go wrong at AMR is happening and the arrival of Alonso Jr could also make it harder on Alonso. I think the overall morale within the team must be hitting rock bottom. It will take sometime to recover for sure.

[erikejw]

It's more likely a way to take a step back from the Honda accusations and start to work united as one team with a common goal.

Focus on solving the problems instead of public arguments.

[
quote=Bill post_id=1337786 time=1774460401 user_id=39046]
According to indications emerging from Japan , the source of the vibrations may not be exclusively linked to the power unit. Attention has also shifted to the transmission, an area on which the team has changed its approach compared to the past.
[/quote]

[Honda Porsche fan]

It's more likely a way to take a step back from the Honda accusations and start to work united as one team with a common goal.

Focus on solving the problems instead of public arguments.

[
quote=Bill post_id=1337786 time=1774460401 user_id=39046]
According to indications emerging from Japan , the source of the vibrations may not be exclusively linked to the power unit. Attention has also shifted to the transmission, an area on which the team has changed its approach compared to the past.

This is not good P.R. for either Aston Martin or Honda if they start blaming each other publicly in the media. But, it needs to be known where exactly this vibration originates from, engine? mgu-k? transmission ?

But, Honda and Aston Martin should NOT be in this position and predicament to begin with. All of this should have been figured out during testing last year. They can fix the vibration issues and eventually develop a strong engine but, it might not happen till the 2nd half of this season or by next year and Aston Martin's season is over for any chance of winning the driver's title or constructor's title...

I don't care if Honda or Aston Martin fixes the vibration problem "this time" because, going by Honda's pattern in F1 they'll be back to square one in 6 to 8 years from now. This could be a systemic problem internally within Honda Corporation.

What is being done at Honda Japan within their corporation to make sure these extreme cycles of highs and lows does not happen again?

Judging by history this cycle will happen again to Aston Martin or to another team that signs up with Honda. Honda needs to make sure when they first put an engine on the grid it is reliable and competitive from the first race. In order to do that the FIA needs to reform the rules and regulate the automakers and teams. There needs to be a lot more on track testing allowed too.

I can't remember the last time Mercedes, Ferrari, Renault, BMW or Toyota showed up with such a bad engine when you look at their history in F1. Audi and Red Bull's first year in-house engine is stronger than Honda's this year.

[dren]

Perhaps Honda doesn't see this as a 'systemic problem'? Honda does seem to yo yo quite a bit depending on leadership, but they also seem to enjoy engineering problems.

This partnership was certainly rushed unlike other makes. And the RB PU was created by people who've been creating F1 PUs. It's not like they hired a bunch of new grads and said have at it.

Yeah, it sucks. Honda will get there if given time and support. AM needs to work with them and it sounds like they are.

[Honda Porsche fan]

Perhaps Honda doesn't see this as a 'systemic problem'? Honda does seem to yo yo quite a bit depending on leadership, but they also seem to enjoy engineering problems.

This partnership was certainly rushed unlike other makes. And the RB PU was created by people who've been creating F1 PUs. It's not like they hired a bunch of new grads and said have at it.

Yeah, it sucks. Honda will get there if given time and support. AM needs to work with them and it sounds like they are.

Honda has been competing in F1 off and on since the 1960's. Honda recently won 4 straight driver's titles and almost won 5 straight.

[WardenOfTheNorth]

Perhaps Honda doesn't see this as a 'systemic problem'? Honda does seem to yo yo quite a bit depending on leadership, but they also seem to enjoy engineering problems.

This partnership was certainly rushed unlike other makes. And the RB PU was created by people who've been creating F1 PUs. It's not like they hired a bunch of new grads and said have at it.

Yeah, it sucks. Honda will get there if given time and support. AM needs to work with them and it sounds like they are.

Honda has been competing in F1 off and on since the 1960's. Honda recently won 4 straight driver's titles and almost won 5 straight.

And where do a lot of the staff who built those PU work now? I'll give you a clue, it's not the current Honda PU department.

OTOH RBPT recruited former Honda staff, former Mercedes staff, former Renault staff, former Illmore staff....

[diffuser]

Perhaps Honda doesn't see this as a 'systemic problem'? Honda does seem to yo yo quite a bit depending on leadership, but they also seem to enjoy engineering problems.

This partnership was certainly rushed unlike other makes. And the RB PU was created by people who've been creating F1 PUs. It's not like they hired a bunch of new grads and said have at it.

Yeah, it sucks. Honda will get there if given time and support. AM needs to work with them and it sounds like they are.

Honda has been competing in F1 off and on since the 1960's. Honda recently won 4 straight driver's titles and almost won 5 straight.

And where do a lot of the staff who built those PU work now? I'll give you a clue, it's not the current Honda PU department.

OTOH RBPT recruited former Honda staff, former Mercedes staff, former Renault staff, former Illmore staff....

Getting tired of repeating myself.

Nobody RBPT hired from Honda designed anything. The staff they took was all UK staff that did ZERO designing. They were just mechanics kind of employees.

[diffuser]

F1 weekend warm up say AMF1/Honda have implemented counter measures in the steering to offset the vibrations. The goal is to complete the race with atleast one car.

[mzso]

According to indications emerging from Japan , the source of the vibrations may not be exclusively linked to the power unit. Attention has also shifted to the transmission, an area on which the team has changed its approach compared to the past.

Wouldn't that be something if they find out it's been the AM transmission all along ?

And how do you think a gearbox would generate such intense vibrations that it rattles the entire car? Something so messed up would destroy itself almost instantly and never leave the lab.

[mzso]

Can we forget the Ferrari sob-story already? They didn't win because they didn't build good enough cars, and lost years because of engine cheating.

The difference between cheating and clever engineering loophole is simply whether FIA wants to favor you or not. The pattern is very clear since 2014.

Ugh... More sob fairy tails... Because it can't be that they constantly fail, like they obviously do...
Maybe they're coming down on Mercedes, because they banned DAS and reduced the floor in a way that hindered Mercedes the most...

[bigblue]

And how do you think a gearbox would generate such intense vibrations that it rattles the entire car? Something so messed up would destroy itself almost instantly and never leave the lab.

And how do you think an engine would generate such intense vibrations that it rattles the entire car? Something so messed up would destroy itself almost instantly and never leave the lab.

And yet, here we are. Clearly something very odd has happened in integration of the whole (engine / gearbox / chassis), that made some expected vibrations (?) a whole lot worse. Bear in mind Aston engineers have been over in Japan for some time as well, working on this, and it seems that there's no easy solution.

The only other explanation I can think of is that one of the parties (probably Honda-side) is playing down their problems and not fully admitting to how bad things were, but I don't think that's the case.

[CHT]

And how do you think a gearbox would generate such intense vibrations that it rattles the entire car? Something so messed up would destroy itself almost instantly and never leave the lab.

And how do you think an engine would generate such intense vibrations that it rattles the entire car? Something so messed up would destroy itself almost instantly and never leave the lab.

And yet, here we are. Clearly something very odd has happened in integration of the whole (engine / gearbox / chassis), that made some expected vibrations (?) a whole lot worse. Bear in mind Aston engineers have been over in Japan for some time as well, working on this, and it seems that there's no easy solution.

The only other explanation I can think of is that one of the parties (probably Honda-side) is playing down their problems and not fully admitting to how bad things were, but I don't think that's the case.

Aramco fuel?

[mzso]

Who was stopping them from developing with Mclaren? All Toro Rosso did was relax the dimensional requirements. This was also their 4th season upon return and they had changed their top level management as well engine architecture in those years.

For the first year regulations prevented them from developing. Which was subsequently changed.
On the other hand it still took them until the middle of third/last year to look decent. At which point it seemed pretty lame from McLaren to claim they had the best chassis and are bogged down by the engine...
By the time they reached Toro Rosso I don't think Renault had any advantage on them.