2026 Aston Martin Aramco Formula One Team

[collindsilva]

Andrew Benson said that “more than half Aston Martin’s deficit to the front was caused by the chassis”, based on Suzuka race report information and GPS data. He added that Aston Martin was about 2.3 s off the pace with most of that due to chassis performance, and that even with a Mercedes engine the car would likely only be around the level of Alpine or Haas.

How reliable is Andrew Benson.
In Suzuka, AMR ran the car with detuned engine just to finish the race and overcome the vibrations.
2.3s seems to be long shot on the pace deficit.
If all issues are resolved next race should give us a realistic order

[Tommy Cookers]

A permanent magnets machine spinning at high speeds under non electrical load produces very high voltages, and that can put multiple elements under risk.
Put it in other way, with permanent magnets you have to recover or deploy, but not spinning at zero current.

fwiw I totally disagree

I'll be more than happy to be factually corrected (as with some explanation / link / whatelse). I assume I can be wrong, but I don't like to be left in the dark.

a wound field machine could develop excessive open circuit voltage if the field becomes too weak (ie excess voltage constant)
eg if the field energisation fails there is likely a weak residual field

ok a permanent field can become temporarily or permanently weakened by excess current/magnetism or temperature
this is relatively unlikely ie a fixed field (permanent magnet) is much safer (than a wound field) in this regard

road 'electric' cars often have a combination (hybrid) field to economise on PM material

[Jambier]

even with a Mercedes engine the car would likely only be around the level of Alpine or Haas.

So basically fighting for best of the rest, back to 2024.
Which is not so bad, considering a very overweight car with several months of dev missing compare to those teams

[CHT]

From the screen grab you can see how deep the MGU-K it place inside the survival cell in front of the ICE and how close the battery is attached to the ICE. I believe the base of the MGU-K is also mounted to the survival cell, which may also contribute to vibration. And where are the electric cable linking the MGU-K to the battery? Perhaps MGU-K and Battery are integrated?
Honda PU 2, on Flickr


@ 0.30


Looking at how the MGU-K electronic box is stack above the battery cell, it may also be difficult to move the battery further from the ICE due to the height touching back of driver seat.

[PlatinumZealot]

The battery doesn't have to be moved at all. I interpret the reports from Honda to mean that they added additional bracing to Astons chassis where the batter and MGUK is but had to remove it because it is not their place to be adding stuff to the customer's chassis.

This bracing would have shifted the natural frequency of things a bit higher so that they can pinpoint the source a bit better. And then try apply vibration prevention in a more targeted way.. Whether it is by engine dampers, combustion tuning, counterweights, new timing gears, redesign of MGUK stator etc whatever it is that's reaquired.

[CHT]

The battery doesn't have to be moved at all. I interpret the reports from Honda to mean that they added additional bracing to Astons chassis where the batter and MGUK is but had to remove it because it is not their place to be adding stuff to the customer's chassis.

This bracing would have shifted the natural frequency of things a bit higher so that they can pinpoint the source a bit better. And then try apply vibration prevention in a more targeted way.. Whether it is by engine dampers, combustion tuning, counterweights, new timing gears, redesign of MGUK stator etc whatever it is that's reaquired.

Taken from some earlier article, it mentioned the battery vibration issue is due to what is was mounted to.
From the earlier post, we can see that both MGU-K and battery are mechanically mounted to the survival cell,
When the MGU-K is the vibrating, it will transmit the vibration to the cell and to the battery and the driver,

To solve the vibration issue on the battery would have been easy by damping mounting, but I suspect the problem could be much more and the battery and MGU-K could be mechanically attached to each other to avoid the need of running cables.

And why is the MGU-K vibrating so much that is affecting the driver? that is the main problem Honda is trying to solve. And its very likely that they will end up detaching the MGU-K from the survival cell. which mean new engine and new battery pack.


The problem identified in testing was that the battery pack was being aggressively shaken because of the severe vibrations running through what it was mounted to. This was then causing damage to the battery system.

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/ever ... -briefing/

[Tommy Cookers]

... And where are the electric cable linking the MGU-K to the battery? .....

there is no such cable

the MGU-K is energised and energises by the so-called CE not by the battery

[CHT]

... And where are the electric cable linking the MGU-K to the battery? .....

there is no such cable

the MGU-K is energised and energises by the so-called CE not by the battery

You can see the cable connecting the MGU-K to battery

[PlatinumZealot]

Tommy is right from an electrical circuit point of view. From a visual point of view though it may only appear like the whole thing is connected to the battery so I see why some people think so. Practically we know what each other mean.

[diffuser]

... And where are the electric cable linking the MGU-K to the battery? .....

there is no such cable

the MGU-K is energised and energises by the so-called CE not by the battery

You can see the cable connecting the MGU-K to battery

https://global.honda/en/tech/motorsport ... es/04.webp

He means the CE is in the middle,it is connected to both the battery and the MGU-K. In your picture of the old Honda PU, CE isn't obvious there. The old Honda PU had a separate box for the CE, maybe we're just losing it in the gray. That's the box they now stack on the batteries in the 2026 PU. Maybe it's just not in the picture cause it's a standard Part across all teams?

[Tommy Cookers]

'... He means the CE ....
Maybe it's just not in the picture cause it's a standard Part across all teams? ...

afaik
it wouldn't be a standard part unless the MG is a standard part

the so-called CE is functionally a part of the MG like the cylinder head is functionally a part of the ICE
each revolution of the MG is timed and logged for monitoring & control purposes

the CE makes the MG go like the cams, valves, injection, ignition etc make the ICE go
the battery is just a fuel tank

[diffuser]

'... He means the CE ....
Maybe it's just not in the picture cause it's a standard Part across all teams? ...

afaik
it wouldn't be a standard part unless the MG is a standard part

the so-called CE is functionally a part of the MG like the cylinder head is functionally a part of the ICE
each revolution of the MG is timed and logged for monitoring & control purposes

the CE makes the MG go like the cams, valves, injection, ignition etc make the ICE go
the battery is just a fuel tank

Thought it was a standard part like a PC that runs an OS. The maps and shiit are apps that run on it are different. Isn't it made by McLaren?

[collindsilva]

Not sure it is related to this tread, but saw some video on reddit of Aston Martin testing some Frankenstein car a clone of Valkyrie and F1, not sure the purpose behind it

[GoranF1]

Not sure it is related to this tread, but saw some video on reddit of Aston Martin testing some Frankenstein car a clone of Valkyrie and F1, not sure the purpose behind it

Testing PU?

[collindsilva]

Not sure it is related to this tread, but saw some video on reddit of Aston Martin testing some Frankenstein car a clone of Valkyrie and F1, not sure the purpose behind it

Testing PU?

Is it allowed ..