2026 Scuderia Ferrari HP F1 Team

[Badger]

I have a few sources that tell me that yes, they look at peak power. If you combine multiple factors then % is a meaningless and inappropriate measure. How do you weight for multiple factors into a percentage? You cant, it would just be a score.

peak power is knuckle dragger level thinking though. An engine with a broader power curve but a slightly lower peak will almost always beat a motor with a higher peak (almost always comes with a narrow band).

A better way to do it is pick a minimum and maximum rpm range, and then integrate/calculate the area under the curve. The engine with the most area under the curve is almost always the better one.

You can do the same thing with torque curves.

they could do that across all the engine modes, and then come up with a weighting system that generates a single number. The higher the #, the better the engine is, then you calculate % difference from the engine that is currently the best.

I dont disagree about the peak power thing, however the teams should also know that, and you might expect them to design accordingly.

As I understand it the testing process is confidential to prevent teams from gaming the system. So it should fall squarely on the FIA to design a test that is representative of on track power performance. Clearly they haven't done that.

[ChrisM40]

peak power is knuckle dragger level thinking though. An engine with a broader power curve but a slightly lower peak will almost always beat a motor with a higher peak (almost always comes with a narrow band).

A better way to do it is pick a minimum and maximum rpm range, and then integrate/calculate the area under the curve. The engine with the most area under the curve is almost always the better one.

You can do the same thing with torque curves.

they could do that across all the engine modes, and then come up with a weighting system that generates a single number. The higher the #, the better the engine is, then you calculate % difference from the engine that is currently the best.

I dont disagree about the peak power thing, however the teams should also know that, and you might expect them to design accordingly.

As I understand it the testing process is confidential to prevent teams from gaming the system. So it should fall squarely on the FIA to design a test that is representative of on track power performance. Clearly they haven't done that.

That's not really what i mean. The teams should know that a peaky engine is not the ideal way to make a hybrid system regardless of any test the FIA might do. RB have simply chosen poorly, which I guess ADUO is there to help fix, but here we are.

[Venturiation]

D'Ambrosio confirms Hamilton's suspicions: the Ferrari simulator doesn't read reality as it should. The inaccuracies in the mathematical models betray the SF-26, sending it outside its operational window.

[rifrafs2kees]

Don't know the full truth but that it took Hamilton's initiative to move the needle on this issue is damning if true. How long have they known about this is issue, and isn't the solution a low hanging fruit as far as f1 tech goes?

Ferrari's failure at achieving WDC/constructor's has poor team culture as one of the key contributors.

[Luscion]

from Autoracer's livestream

The team have already identified the problem that occurred on Charles Leclerc's car during the Monaco Grand Prix. But it's unlikely that it will be made public. Starting from Barcelona, Leclerc will go in Lewis's direction by also using Carbon Industries discs. We hope this will help him, but it's not guaranteed. Another piece of information, no update was made in Canada on the brakes, so nothing has changed on that part of the SF-26.

It seems that Loïc Serra (technical director) has also been requesting the brake disc change for a long time. Coming from Mercedes, he is very familiar with Carbone Industrie's brakes discs, and the fact that this request from Loïc, combined with Lewis’ pushed Fred to agree to it.

Charles is fed up with Brembo and it seems he will no longer use Brembo discs; he wants to try these new CI brakes discs in Barcelona.

[ginobeppe]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

[Luscion]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

To add to that, regarding when they introduce the engine upgrades, the circuits of Austria, Spa, Monza, and Zandvoort are mentioned.

[PlatinumZealot]

ok you just said a whole bunch of nothing. That doesn't tell anyone how they are determining who is first second 3rd

In other words they measure the brake horsepower and an estimate of the indicated horsepower (ie before losses). That's all you can do with the ICE.

so you think they just look at the max power output?

No. Why would someone chose one peak number?

They could do something like measure the power over time as the cars exit through corners and other things. At the end of the day they will define what engine performance metrics tied to laptime and measure and compare those.

[gearboxtrouble]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

That just not possible. We're talking ~50hp assuming 575-600 for the RBPT. I don't think it is realistic that Ferrari would be that far behind. Based on the (limited) wheel to wheel action we've seen between a RBPT engined car and a Ferrari engined car the RBPT car does seem faster down the straights but its not that level of gap. Either the FIA has messed up the test in a way thats overrating the RBPT engine or RBPT are running it below its potential for reliability reasons.

[CRazyLemon]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

That just not possible. We're talking ~50hp assuming 575-600 for the RBPT. I don't think it is realistic that Ferrari would be that far behind. Based on the (limited) wheel to wheel action we've seen between a RBPT engined car and a Ferrari engined car the RBPT car does seem faster down the straights but its not that level of gap. Either the FIA has messed up the test in a way thats overrating the RBPT engine or RBPT are running it below its potential for reliability reasons.

What you see on track isn't just ICE alone, otherwise if the tests are to believed you'd see RBPT outperforming the Mercedes on the straights as well.

If you are delivering more ICE power it means you can harvest more if you so choose, that would make any pure ICE grunt advantage look like less of a difference.

Anyway Mercedes getting ADUO means RBPT must be extremely inefficient on the electrical side that they're getting trounced engine wise by Mercedes.

[CRazyLemon]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

That just not possible. We're talking ~50hp assuming 575-600 for the RBPT. I don't think it is realistic that Ferrari would be that far behind. Based on the (limited) wheel to wheel action we've seen between a RBPT engined car and a Ferrari engined car the RBPT car does seem faster down the straights but its not that level of gap. Either the FIA has messed up the test in a way thats overrating the RBPT engine or RBPT are running it below its potential for reliability reasons.

What you see on track isn't just ICE alone, otherwise if the tests are to believed you'd see RBPT outperforming the Mercedes on the straights as well.

If you are delivering more ICE power it means you can harvest more if you so choose, that would make any pure ICE grunt advantage look like less of a difference.

Anyway Mercedes getting ADUO means RBPT must be extremely inefficient on the electrical side that they're getting trounced engine wise by Mercedes.

[Badger]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

That just not possible. We're talking ~50hp assuming 575-600 for the RBPT. I don't think it is realistic that Ferrari would be that far behind. Based on the (limited) wheel to wheel action we've seen between a RBPT engined car and a Ferrari engined car the RBPT car does seem faster down the straights but its not that level of gap. Either the FIA has messed up the test in a way thats overrating the RBPT engine or RBPT are running it below its potential for reliability reasons.

Indeed. Before the ADUO was released people were saying RBPT ahead of Ferrari but not by much. That we are supposed to believe in a 40-50 HP deficit is not credible. Another reason to be skeptical of the FIA and their methodology.

[Farnborough]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

That just not possible. We're talking ~50hp assuming 575-600 for the RBPT. I don't think it is realistic that Ferrari would be that far behind. Based on the (limited) wheel to wheel action we've seen between a RBPT engined car and a Ferrari engined car the RBPT car does seem faster down the straights but its not that level of gap. Either the FIA has messed up the test in a way thats overrating the RBPT engine or RBPT are running it below its potential for reliability reasons.

Indeed. Before the ADUO was released people were saying RBPT ahead of Ferrari but not by much. That we are supposed to believe in a 40-50 HP deficit is not credible. Another reason to be skeptical of the FIA and their methodology.

Tombazis has bern quoted recently in regard to the method and measurement.

Effectively, that the teams wanted THIS current method of assessment and categorisation for PU evaluation. The FIA proposed more, I'll say "sophisticated" (as that's the broad view of it) which was refused.

We can't see either stance tight now, but likely that any method/route was going to bring this type of reaction as all judgment would appear to favour someone, that's depending which team you're standing inside.

[Badger]

That just not possible. We're talking ~50hp assuming 575-600 for the RBPT. I don't think it is realistic that Ferrari would be that far behind. Based on the (limited) wheel to wheel action we've seen between a RBPT engined car and a Ferrari engined car the RBPT car does seem faster down the straights but its not that level of gap. Either the FIA has messed up the test in a way thats overrating the RBPT engine or RBPT are running it below its potential for reliability reasons.

Indeed. Before the ADUO was released people were saying RBPT ahead of Ferrari but not by much. That we are supposed to believe in a 40-50 HP deficit is not credible. Another reason to be skeptical of the FIA and their methodology.

Tombazis has bern quoted recently in regard to the method and measurement.

Effectively, that the teams wanted THIS current method of assessment and categorisation for PU evaluation. The FIA proposed more, I'll say "sophisticated" (as that's the broad view of it) which was refused.

We can't see either stance tight now, but likely that any method/route was going to bring this type of reaction as all judgment would appear to favour someone, that's depending which team you're standing inside.

We don’t know what which team wanted, they never agree on anything so it’s too convenient to say it’s what “they” wanted. It’s also hard to say they knew what they were agreeing to when the method is confidential. I guess they put their trust in the FIA to come up with something representative.

Either way, the idea that Ferrari is 40-50 HP behind RBPT is laughable. That would be worth upwards of 1,5s per lap and Ferrari isn’t losing anything close to that. Their car is quicker and as we just saw in Monaco the RB chassis isn’t completely hopeless, so Ferrari isn’t losing much time relative to RB on the engine.

You think that any method would have brought the same reaction? That’s a bit too cynical for me. When the best engine on the grid qualifies for ADUO there’s something wrong. If Merc had not qualified for ADUO we would not have seen the same reactions, obviously. That Ferrari qualifies is expected, that they are “6-8% behind” is not believable and just speaks to the massive flaws in the methodology.

[CjC]

from autoracer live: Ferrari should be in the 6-8% category and the offical results are being held because RBPT is not happy with the results

‘Mekies did not want to talk about the verdict on Sunday night in Monaco. And although he suggested that the FIA's ADUO note to teams was 'provisional;, being a signed document means it is set in stone and will not be changed.’

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/f1-s ... sequences/

Not sure what RBPT can do about it?