2026 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[Badger]

So Red Bull Powertrains engineers will be just sitting there all day doing nothing, because they're not allowed to upgrade the engine at all? Who approved this bs? This is nonsense. Outrageous rules.

Because it was written with the intention of not letting one manufacturer pull ahead like it happened in 2014 where the gap basically took 4 years to get nullified. The idea behind it is good, the execution maybe not so much.

The outrage is only happening because of this shock result where the RBPT turned out to be the ICE benchmark (according to the methodology FIA used to measure it). If it had been Mercedes, nobody would make a big fuss about it.

In any case, even if it was Mercedes, it seems like RBPT would have finished close enough to it in ICE power that it might not even have been granted ADUO regardless.

Which would have been an acceptable outcome. The outcome we got is very different and completely counter to the spirit of the ADUO mechanism.

[Badger]

They will be able to upgrade the engine for 27 even if there are no rules changes. This is only for in season development.

Yeah, except now they have to catch an opponent who has more budget, more dyno time, and two extra homologations applicable to the entire engine in the next couple of years. Meanwhile RBPT is limited to upgrading certain parts of the ICE once and nothing more. Good luck with that.

The homologation is extremely likely to be lifted because of the changes coming for 27 and certainly for 28 which will need pretty much every engine component to be modified.

It may mitigate it somewhat but those ADUO advantages still remain.

[PlatinumZealot]

So the Mercedes engineers, untethered, did produce a more powerful engine than their last company could. As to whether it is more driveable and reliable, that's another question, but those can be corrected going forward.

On a nother note, was the signs from Hadjar's engine a sign of an similar impending failure to Max's? And how many km had the Monaco engines already done?

[arunn]

What a strange "sport" there's no other sport where everyone and their mother knows who's gonna win 3 years before it happens and when they do dominate (100% poles and wins) then they get even more additional help. Grande!

[gearboxtrouble]

So the Mercedes engineers, untethered, did produce a more powerful engine than their last company could. As to whether it is more driveable and reliable, that's another question, but those can be corrected going forward.

On a nother note, was the signs from Hadjar's engine a sign of an similar impending failure to Max's? And how many km had the Monaco engines already done?

Ben Hodgkinson is a genius - Horner hired the right guy from Mercedes imo. As a counterpoint to all the doom and gloom here Red Bull and its fans should be happy and amazed - they have actually managed to climb the proverbial Everest on their very first attempt. The most difficult part of this, producing a competitive engine, has been done far ahead of schedule. The other things will fall into place as well.

Afaik Max's engine was the same one he's been using all season long and Hadjar's was his replacement one after his ICE failed in Melbourne. The Racing Bulls have taken their 2nd PUs but afaik they still have the originals available in the pool. If you look at all the Mercedes issues that everyone other than Kimi seem to have had this season, the reliability isn't that bad either.

[organic]

Well red bull are --- and max will sign with Mercedes in summer. Ben hodgkinsons ego can rest easy but everything else will suffer

[PlatinumZealot]

Well red bull are --- and max will sign with Mercedes in summer. Ben hodgkinsons ego can rest easy but everything else will suffer

Lol. Why would Toto want to hurt Antonelli's career by signing Max? Kimi is Toto's pride and legacy just as how Max is Jos and Helmut's. He doesn't need Max to win at the moment as tempting as having Max is it would just be for braggign rights and Horner is gone anyway.

[Gillian]

Well red bull are --- and max will sign with Mercedes in summer. Ben hodgkinsons ego can rest easy but everything else will suffer

I was thinking the same and with the current situation, Verstappen would be nuts not to go to Mercedes (unless he does not care about winning for a few years)

[Luscion]

[Jurgen von Diaz]

Well red bull are --- and max will sign with Mercedes in summer. Ben hodgkinsons ego can rest easy but everything else will suffer

Lol. Why would Toto want to hurt Antonelli's career by signing Max? Kimi is Toto's pride and legacy just as how Max is Jos and Helmut's. He doesn't need Max to win at the moment as tempting as having Max is it would just be for braggign rights and Horner is gone anyway.

That's the thing: Toto doesn't need Max now. But what if Merc's advantage is already gone next season, and Toto had a chance to sign Max but didn't? Are we sure Kimi and George can make a difference in a non-dominant car? If we look at Norris and Piastri now, they are vanilla without the dominant car.

As Wache and Newey have said, Max allows more freedom in design because he doesn't necessarily need a balanced car.

[Matt-A]

Well red bull are --- and max will sign with Mercedes in summer. Ben hodgkinsons ego can rest easy but everything else will suffer

Lol. Why would Toto want to hurt Antonelli's career by signing Max? Kimi is Toto's pride and legacy just as how Max is Jos and Helmut's. He doesn't need Max to win at the moment as tempting as having Max is it would just be for braggign rights and Horner is gone anyway.

That's the thing: Toto doesn't need Max now. But what if Merc's advantage is already gone next season, and Toto had a chance to sign Max but didn't? Are we sure Kimi and George can make a difference in a non-dominant car? If we look at Norris and Piastri now, they are vanilla without the dominant car.

As Wache and Newey have said, Max allows more freedom in design because he doesn't necessarily need a balanced car.

[deleted]

[organic]

Lol. Why would Toto want to hurt Antonelli's career by signing Max? Kimi is Toto's pride and legacy just as how Max is Jos and Helmut's. He doesn't need Max to win at the moment as tempting as having Max is it would just be for braggign rights and Horner is gone anyway.

That's the thing: Toto doesn't need Max now. But what if Merc's advantage is already gone next season, and Toto had a chance to sign Max but didn't? Are we sure Kimi and George can make a difference in a non-dominant car? If we look at Norris and Piastri now, they are vanilla without the dominant car.

As Wache and Newey have said, Max allows more freedom in design because he doesn't necessarily need a balanced car.

It would be a very expensive waste of money to hire Max now. Kimi is the best driver on the grid. Why spend tens of millions complicating that.

Why indeed

[pantherxxx]

Why would Max leave for mercedes? Red Bull managed to design a car that's still 8 kg overweight, and was designed using a cold war era wind tunnel, and he still almost got pole in Monaco. Next year's car with the state of the art wind tunnel, and more resources invested, could be better than Mercedes. Even this year from Austria, I expect Max winning races.

[Paa]

Why would Max leave for mercedes? Red Bull managed to design a car that's still 8 kg overweight, and was designed using a cold war era wind tunnel, and he still almost got pole in Monaco. Next year's car with the state of the art wind tunnel, and more resources invested, could be better than Mercedes. Even this year from Austria, I expect Max winning races.

Next year's car will still be developed by the old wind tunnel.
Yes, Max could win some races this year, but he would win much more with Merc right now, possibly also WDC.

With that, I'm not saying he would or should leave to Merc, but also no reason to be delusional.
Max: almost pole in Monaco
Merc: won in Monaco and all other races this season.

[Wouter]

Max and Vermeulen were today in Salzburg for an important meeting with Yoovidhya, Mateschitz, Mintzlaff, etc, etc.