2010 cars

[machin]

Don't get me wrong; I also think banning refuelling is a great idea, but I think the posts above imply that the drivers will be trundling around the track slowly most of the time, whereas actually the drivers themselves will be trying as hard as they can to maximise the performance they have available to them... I'd also be surprised if teams decide it is better to underfuel a car, considering that a very small amount of fuel gives you a lot more power. Also remember that the drivers can still change their tyres, so its only in the first stint that manageing tyres with high fuel loads will be much different from today's racing.

(Yes, I do remember F1 racing before re-fuelling. Also I happen to watch rather a lot of other categories which don't allow refuelling, and I've never found people just trundle around for half the race because they felt they would get a better overall race pace by going light on fuel).

[BreezyRacer]

Just to keep the record straight, Schumie won his first title in the Benetton because they ran a Cosworth V8 against the V10s and were able to run lighter because of less fuel. So his rise was not due to refueling pit stop strategies, though there isn't much that Schumie did optimize during the course of his career, including fuel strategies.

[bill shoe]

There has been general discussion about pit strategies for next season given the refueling ban. Bridgestone says the tires for 2010 will have more durable compounds--

http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/ ... 010-tires/

Unfortunately, this seems to gurantee that every car will do two stints with one pit stop. (Two stints still necessary to use each of the two required specs). This seems to largely eliminate creative thinking regarding race strategy. Am I interpreting this wrong?

[WhiteBlue]

I just read the interview with Adrian Newey on the front page. After reading this I can't help thinking that the 2010 season will see very close performance between the established teams. Why is this expected?

• FOTA will attempt to equalize all engines in terms of power and fuel efficiency
• aerodynamic devices are greatly reduced in numbers so two wings and the diffusors are all they can play with
• I agree with the first poster that there will be mainly one nose/front suspension/gear box/rear suspension solution adapted by all main players
• fuel tank size will be very similar, no undersized tank philosophy likely
• no KERS

So one thing I expect is a very close grid even closer than last year.

I expect Mercedes, Red Bull, McLaren and Ferrari to be fighting for the championship for most of the season.
I expect Williams, Sauber, Renault, Toro Rosso and Force India all on the podium and perhaps with race wins.
Lotus, Virgin and Campos should all be capable of double digit point hauls while USF1 could be holding the wooden spoon with some lucky points.

The points spread between the leading teams and the mid field should be closer next season than it was this year.

[wesley123]

if im correct next year will see even less freedom in earodynamics? If thats the case then im gonna laugh really loud, I more and more understand why every manufacturer is leaving, formula1 is a joke. It is supposed to be the highest technical sport in the world, but now karting is more advanced and has more technical freedom.

[WhiteBlue]

Aero rules will remain the same. There is some impact from front tyres and fuel tank size on aero though. And naturally everyone will have triple and quadruple diffusors to the hilt, now that they are legal.

[PlatinumZealot]

I'd be surprised if I see a triple diffuser. The double diffuser pretty much takes up all the space.

[WhiteBlue]

I'd be surprised if I see a triple diffuser. The double diffuser pretty much takes up all the space.

I really meant additional channels further forward where they would suck additional air for the diffusor. That doesn't mean they would have more than two decks. The upper deck could be fed by two or three different channels though.

[scarbs]

Time to be pedantic…..

I think our definition of double\triple\quadruple diffuser will need clearing up for next year. Last year we saw a few teams with horizontal vanes inside the upper deck, as I see it this is not a triple diffuser as underneath the upper deck is fed from one entry, I guess we could call this a 2into3 set up? Unless a team creates a second entrance under the car its not a triple set up, of course we won’t see this until the cars get craned off the track.

As I understand these 2into3 vanes we saw on the Williams and Renault are simply to segregate the upper deck as it squeezes into the two allowable areas above the 1000w x 175h lower deck. The rules allow a taller but narrower section above 750w x 200h up to the rear wheel centre line and again a another taller but narrower section above it (I can’t recall the exact size).

As there’s always an exception to the rule, we did see Toyotas early 2009 season diffuser with a mini diffuser sitting below the rear crash structure, I’d also term this a triple set up as there’s three distinct diffusers. I was surprised they dropped it and no one else took advantage of the 150mm wide area below the crash structure for any sort of aero device.

Scarbs...

[PNSD]

Interesting point. From what I remember Toyotas diffuser through the season looked to me to get alot simpler and simpler, less complex with each development...

[BorisTheBlade]

@scarbs
IMHO BMW used that section for the last incarnaction of their DDD - although they didn't use the whole area in a way Toyota did it.

[roost89]

and the front tires closer

I took this quote from the R30 thread

Also with the wide front wing will we end up with a wing protruding past the front wheels?

I'm shifting the question into this thread as I hope it's more relevant here also I have a question of my own on it.

If the tyres get moved closer and the wing overlaps the tyres by a fair amount, would this allow for a similar effect to what the wheel-shields provide just now?
Could the wing be made so that it profiles the air to create a 'wall' of air that improves aero efficiency or at least will decrease the wake? I suppose a similar effect to what the sidepod turning-vanes do, if my thinking of what they do is correct.

I hope you can understand what I'm getting at.

[Fil]

the tyres won't come in closer will they?

surely teams maximise track-width allowed under regulations.

more likely would be that we will see a return to front wing endplates directing air flow to the inside of the now-narrower tyres, unlike '09 with airflow around the tyres - utilising the now-banned wheel covers.

[Shrek]

I remember that i thought up a quadruple(4) decker diffuser(i took air from outside and usedram air effect it just before the bend to go up i think Brawn had it at the begining of the season and also used the regular Triple decker diffuser that has been posted on other topics), and i think i can go up to five maybe six decks

[WhiteBlue]

I can imagine that it will be a new game in suspension design. The front suspension will be different because the slimmer and much stiffer tyres and due to the huge mass difference of the car between race start and end. The rear will probably be further optimized for the diffusors and will also have some different mass aspects.

The rear of the tubs will probably have to grow a bit to protect the much bigger fuel tanks. I wonder how that will impact on radiators and side pods.