Fact vs. Opinion on F1Technical.net

[Conceptual]

Thanks for the replies. From what I have read on this thread, it seems that several would prefer terms like "I think/feel/believe" to be included more often, and the voting seems to show that several members believe that it is the readers' job to wring understanding from misleading and unclear posts.

While I don't agree with that, and the fact that the voting may be skewed by the same negative people that have been mentioned a few times here, that is what the numbers show. I am sure that there are several votes in opposition to this question simply because I am the one that posted it, but what can you expect from those types.

I must say however, that the IGNORE button that was mentioned a few posts ago would be a godsend on these forums. From ad-bots to bigots, it would certainly give the members the ability to clean up what they feel is trash without affecting any other member.

TOMBA, can we get a vote on adding the IGNORE button? [-o<

[cooper-climax]

"The function of the human conscienceness is not to "create" realities (Plato), which is mysticism, but to identify and integrate the one and only reality as it resides anchored in existance (Aristotle). Identifying objective reality is the survival mechanism of conscious beings. For those identifications are the basis of rational judgements, beneficial actions, and rational successes." -Neo-Tech Advantage #93

For someone who choses to quote Neo-tech in his signature, I'm a little surprised at your views of truth and opinion.

When Dr Wallace Ward* was sent down for tax evasion. He refused to take the "Truth, whole truth, and nothing but the truth" oath. but insisted on "Do you affirm to speak with fully integrated Honesty, only with fully integrated Honesty and nothing but fully integrated Honesty?"
His point being that he could not know the truth, just give his honest opinion.



*For those who don't know, Dr Wallace Ward AKA Frank Wallace is the originator of the Neo-Tech Self help "philosophy", a convicted felon, and according to the Australian government, a con-man.

[Conceptual]

"The function of the human conscienceness is not to "create" realities (Plato), which is mysticism, but to identify and integrate the one and only reality as it resides anchored in existance (Aristotle). Identifying objective reality is the survival mechanism of conscious beings. For those identifications are the basis of rational judgements, beneficial actions, and rational successes." -Neo-Tech Advantage #93

For someone who choses to quote Neo-tech in his signature, I'm a little surprised at your views of truth and opinion.

When Dr Wallace Ward* was sent down for tax evasion. He refused to take the "Truth, whole truth, and nothing but the truth" oath. but insisted on "Do you affirm to speak with fully integrated Honesty, only with fully integrated Honesty and nothing but fully integrated Honesty?"
His point being that he could not know the truth, just give his honest opinion.



*For those who don't know, Dr Wallace Ward AKA Frank Wallace is the originator of the Neo-Tech Self help "philosophy", a convicted felon, and according to the Australian government, a con-man.

The point was more about clear definition between what people think, and what has evidence or scientific methods to prove. The terms fact and opinion were simply the easiest vocab to get the point across.

And about Wallace. There are convicted criminals, and unconvicted criminals in all aspects of life, ESPECIALLY in the govts of the world. What ever he may have been convicted of really has no impact on Neo-Tech as a body of literature, since the majority of it has to do with how we view ourselves, and how we teach others.

And rule #1 in Neo-Tech is that those with the most to lose by its integration into society are those that claim authority over sentient beings with free will.

Whatever tho. There are those that matter in life, and those that don't. The ones that don't are obvious because they become posers on internet forums, rack up huge post counts in a very short time, and think that they are the Kings of the internet.

As long as they are occupied here, it keeps them out of the way of the productive people of society, and they matter less by their absence. Nature has its own way of draining the shallow end of the gene pool.

It is so sad, it's funny actually.

[ISLAMATRON]

does that mean you will finally be leaving?

[Scotracer]

I didn't get a name-drop

Chris, you are far too sensitive to stuff that you either don't like or don't agree with. Instead of wanting an ignore button...why not just ignore it? You can't expect it to be 100% Technical, 100% of the time - that may be your fantasy forum but it ain't going to happen on an open, public one.

[safeaschuck]

If the active topics on the front page were not updated every time they were changed, but on an hourly or some other basis, then people might be less inclined to jump into a thread that they were not part of already just to argue, or just to fire back at that name in all caps that just popped in to opinionate all over the place.

Or if the messages on the front page were arranged by category, then technical threads that might not have a lot of chatter and pith very quickly put the active technical topics that seem to go to go on longer but with more intellect, would remain on the front page longer, enticing more users into these threads. This would give the most active topics in categories other than general equal eyeball time, and if anything the front page posts should be skewed towards the technical, at the expense of the non.

Best idea to come out of this thread (in my opinion). Aggregate the ranking on the front page somehow, Although I do enjoy seeing the up to the moment stuff...Hmm!

I'm sure I have confused fact and opinion (and belief) in my own head and therefor in my post's. Can't apologise for this though, I am as guilty of this sort of sham conversation in life as I am on here. Shame on me! (I'm not so bad once you know me, haha).
Conceptual and some of the others who would really be able to grasp the high level technical stuff on here, you have the intelligence and language skills to decode a lot of what is being said here. Loosing the tone of one's voice, facial expressions and what-not does make it a little more dificult to spot B.S. but if you are on here regularly and know the posters it's the same as getting to know someone's lie threshold in real life.

For anyone else unable to spot a regular dissemenator of B.S. on here, with all the counter arguments available to you I suggest you never buy a newspaper or watch television commercials. In fact, best to retire from life, You are in over your head. It is a shame there is some flotsam, but you do need to come up for air between some of these posts. Also I am quite happy working with information that may be wrong as long as it happens to be the best information I can find. Another trait which we all employ in life. (I hope all those politicians in Copenhagen are employing this sentiment at the moment).

If you moved, partitioned or otherwise flagged everything but fact from a forum it would no longer be a forum, it would be a series of technical articles, as already found elsewhere on this website.

[xpensive]

does that mean you will finally be leaving?

But seriously, what is this, a discussion and poll about ethics on F1T, initiated by someone who just a day ago reverted to the lowest form of personal mudslinging, literally, only because his national pride was hurt?

[Richard]

There are those that matter in life, and those that don't.

meeeooow

Eugenics-r-us ?

[gibells]

And rule #1 in Neo-Tech is that those with the most to lose by its integration into society are those that claim authority over sentient beings with free will. IE: A govt that is made up of the decendants of criminals that now rule the ex-prison colony that is now Australlia.
...
As long as they are occupied here, it keeps them out of the way of the productive people of society, and they matter less by their absence. Nature has its own way of draining the shallow end of the gene pool, and it is now safe to conclude that this forum is just a place for these worthless bigots to shout their way to self-percieved importance.

Mate, I have just watched from the sidelines and your whole argument is flawed. Firstly, where do you get off bashing an entire nation in one statement. That is one seriously BIGOTED statement. From what I have seen of the Australian Government as an outsider, they rule with justice and are a good example of democracy. Painting a nation with one brush, Neo-Tech or not, is a very small minded thing to do. I am a white South African. Do you consider me to be a racist based on my demographic code, or do you want to get to know me and make a more educated judgement.

Secondly, judging by the amount of time you spend on this forum, complaining hugely about other people when all I can see from your arguments is just a lot of gnashing of teeth, and not a lot of fact. You sound like a HYPOCRITE as well.

I am relatively new to this forum, and I have learnt a great deal from it. My posts may have not added technically to the forum, but have generally been based on my enthusiasm for the sport(?)/business. Do you want me to produce an engineering degree certificate before I can make a post? Most of the discussions are based on interpretation of news/photographs/analysis anyway. You'd be better to be a journalist than an engineer here.

Yes there are quite a few- shall we say 'characters' on board, but hey, that's life. I for one enjoy the discussions that take place, because out of all the chaff that blows about you may just pick up a of nuggets here and there. And I do really appreciate the masters around, because there comments are very educational and mostly spot on.

You come across as a highly ranked member of the Thought Police. Give it a rest man.

[Chaparral]

Conceptual wrote And rule #1 in Neo-Tech is that those with the most to lose by its integration into society are those that claim authority over sentient beings with free will. IE: A govt that is made up of the decendants of criminals that now rule the ex-prison colony that is now Australlia.

I find that statement extremely offensive full stop - yes Im Australian from British/Scot convict stock but proud of my lineage and proud of my family and my own achievements - and a very democratic society we have strived for here in this wonderful country and I can tell you right now your a total --- wanker - I dont mince words and if I met you in person I would kick you from here to eternity for that remark you offensive prick!!

[xpensive]

Thank you Chap, I called the individual in question a "Schmuck" on another thread recently, but your comments will perhaps make Ciro forgive me for that? Or we both be xcommunicated?

[RH1300S]

Sticks head right above the parapet..........

There are a few people who seem to inhabit this forum purely to argue at anything and everything. They contribute nothing, apart from making threads long and tedious reads.

I'm not suggesting anyone in the posts immediately above me - look a little higher.

Respectfully I would suggest that bans (permanent or temporary) would go a long way towards making this a pleasant and informative place to be.

[Belatti]

Fact: Conceptual and Islamatron fights bores me to death.
Opinion: i dont like the 95% of their aggresive posting.
Fact: when Im reading a thread and I see one of their posts I skip it.
Opinion: if they actually post something interesting usually somebody quotes of refer about it.
Opinion: the bashing the Australian thing was way too wrong, Conceptual should beg his pardon AND get a big ban. I like Australia.
Opinion: there are other forumers equally constructive like the couple I mentioned -that would be 0.0001- but at least they are funnier. I like funny.

[xpensive]

What I find rather tireing with certain posts, is that even if the poster drops the courteous "I think" in there, sometimes said poster takes himself and his/hers own opinion so serious that the reading becomes almost unbearable.

[Rod_in_Chile]

I'm am Aussie and also found Conceptuals post offensive, though ironically enough I am not of convict stock, a fact ( this is fact as my lineage has been studied as by an Aunt) that I find most disappointing

I would recommend that Conceptual avoid contradictory phrases such as " It is a fact that maybe..." if I may paraphrase