Mercedes GP MGP W01

[ggajic]

No two mechanical parts are the same. So, although in theory Michael`s and Nico`s car are same - in fact they are not. If engine consists of lets say ~ 5000 parts, it is enought to have one faulty part and have significant difference in term of performance. Perhaps, Malaysia trouble with wheel nut triggered something at the already faulty chassis.

[marcush.]

No two mechanical parts are the same. So, although in theory Michael`s and Nico`s car are same - in fact they are not. If engine consists of lets say ~ 5000 parts, it is enought to have one faulty part and have significant difference in term of performance. Perhaps, Malaysia trouble with wheel nut triggered something at the already faulty chassis.

I doubt a lot of parts have found their way back to a race chassis uninspected after
performing a race distance.
As far as i know suspension components all get a thorough non destructive testing after each race ,also overseas races...
Next racce we will know as he will receive an all new car .If they are able to close the gap to RB will be seen ,but surely we will se if Michael is a match for Nico .If not I´d guess Nick Heidfeld is soon to be found in the No.3 car.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

To assume which part is wrong with the car is plain speculation.

We should go on hard evidence here. There is a Balance problem with the car and it understeers like a pig. Nico Rosberg can deal with the problem alot better than Schumacher, so Kudos too him.

However if it oversteered Schumacher would be able to deal with the problem alot better than Rosberg. This is not to say that one is better than the other, but that when issues relating to the balance and nature of the car arise (understeer vs oversteer)that the driver with the preffered style can adapt more easily. This is logical. Schumcher tried to dial in oversteer into the W01 chassis in china and it didnt work, the car was almost as bad as a New team through the slow corners.
This is not indicative of a poor driver, it is indicative of a poor setup and/or very poor mechnical grip - somthing Schumcher has already spoken of in his press statements.

So the issue will continue until Mercedes can address the issue with the car. Again this is happening and the W01 is set for a big change in Barcelona, I will wait and see what will happen after this before making judgement unlike alot of trash papers and fans.

[Hangaku]

To assume which part is wrong with the car is plain speculation.

We should go on hard evidence here. There is a Balance problem with the car and it understeers like a pig. Nico Rosberg can deal with the problem alot better than Schumacher, so Kudos too him.

However if it oversteered Schumacher would be able to deal with the problem alot better than Rosberg. This is not to say that one is better than the other, but that when issues relating to the balance and nature of the car arise (understeer vs oversteer)that the driver with the preffered style can adapt more easily. This is logical. Schumcher tried to dial in oversteer into the W01 chassis in china and it didnt work, the car was almost as bad as a New team through the slow corners.
This is not indicative of a poor driver, it is indicative of a poor setup and/or very poor mechnical grip - somthing Schumcher has already spoken of in his press statements.

So the issue will continue until Mercedes can address the issue with the car. Again this is happening and the W01 is set for a big change in Barcelona, I will wait and see what will happen after this before making judgement unlike alot of trash papers and fans.

Perhaps it's going to be a better exercise to compare the last F1 car that Schumacher drove competitively, with this years Mercedes.

Putting engines aside, how would these cars be different to drive? Do they naturally lend themselves to oversteering more? Is there significantly less or more downforce than the F2006? What is the single biggest difference between the two cars, and is that the biggest factor? Assuming that there is actually nothing wrong with the W01, that is. Nico's performance suggests that there isn't.

I suspect that this is for a different thread (sorry), but maybe everyone is putting too much emphasis on the car being at fault?

[Giblet]

I had spoken about how much of Schumacher's speed might have come down not just to him, but to him AND his engineers at Ferrari. He doesn't have that same team anymore, and I think he needs someone who understands his needs, and gets them done.

His engineer who also engineered JV if I remember correctly, often got lost setting up JV's car as well, and JV was also a driver who liked his car a very particular way, independent of track.

He always wanted a car that was "skateboard stiff".

MS is a great driver, but how much greater was he because of his wrenchers?

[ggajic]

To see Nick instead of Michael is something that is not going to happen. I suppose Bernie would rather find way to swap Michael and Button, having in mind how it would impact interest in F1. Prove:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/ ... 103534.ece

I think that many things have changed since 2006. First, winglets are banned. Car generally has less downforce, front tires are much narrower, so overall dynamics has changed if you compare W01 and F248. However, blaming just Michael or car is not right (although I prefer to believe it is W01). As Senna once said: car is just an extension to drivers body and you have to feel perfectly comfortable inside car if you want to deliver good result. It currently is not case with Michael and Mercedes, but it is in interest of F1 to change soon, very soon.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Giblet

The answer to that is probably that Micheal Schumacher is not as good as the press would and F1 ringmaster ecclestone would have us believe.
He did always have the best of the best, perhaps not at Benneton, but certainly at Ferrari.
However he did earn this, by being the best of his generation(personally I would say Hakkinen was better in the dry but would accept Schumacher as his generations best).

He did a few wonderful things and he has not lost his touch, maybe the current generation is the best F1 has ever had?

[Giblet]

That is all well and good, but I wasn't trying to derail this thread away from talk about the Mercedes car itself, and this is starting to go that way.

For whatever reason, he is not coming to terms with this car like his teammate, and I think a lot of it comes down to him and his engineer speaking different languages.

The car seems fundamentally strong, as is getting better rapidly as Nico has shown. I think there is a lot more room in this car for development than some of the others.

[marcush.]

Jock Clear is Nicos Race engineer ,
Shovlin is Michaels .Shovlin never worked with anyone else than Jenson Button as a main race engineer in F1 he made the graduation from assitant RE to main when Button was alreadyy with BAR -as far as is publicised ..
So maybe he has to adapt himself to the new Broom as well..sometimes these relationships gel instantly sometimes they do not work at all.I´m pretty sure a person like MS can be very awe inspiring so maybe he does assume too much of a leader role when it comes to setup choices or diciding wich direction to pursue.
Of course this is pure speculative .

with Michaels star depending on who was engineering him ..no actually he went through a lot of guys ..
pat symmonds at Benneton ,Luca baldisieri in Ferrari ,then Chris Dyer

a quote from Chris Dyer:

Working with a driver like Michael Schumacher is what Chris describes as "A bit of a double edged sword." He explains why. "Working with Michael is easy. He is above all a nice guy and is always calm and level headed. He has a lot of experience and can remember any little problems that may have arisen at different circuits over the years. A sort of built-in data bank that he can draw upon and he knows the car's different systems so well that he can help analyze and solve any problems that might crop up during the weekends," he explains.

"In other ways, it can be a lot tougher because there is always the pressure to perform, especially when we are having a lot more competition like this year," he adds.

[marcush.]

If I remember correctly ,the Bennettons had front bite galore to an extend that everyone else stated it was undrivable on the limit.

when Schumacher came to ferrari he lost all this and struggled to dominate until Goodyear was pursuaded to produce a wider front tire (as was already produced by Bridgestone) Schumacher dominance came with Bridgestone supplying Ferrari....

[Giblet]

Jock Clear is Nicos Race engineer ,
Shovlin is Michaels .Shovlin never worked with anyone else than Jenson Button as a main race engineer in F1 he made the graduation from assitant RE to main when Button was alreadyy with BAR -as far as is publicised ..
So maybe he has to adapt himself to the new Broom as well..sometimes these relationships gel instantly sometimes they do not work at all.I´m pretty sure a person like MS can be very awe inspiring so maybe he does assume too much of a leader role when it comes to setup choices or diciding wich direction to pursue.
Of course this is pure speculative .

with Michaels star depending on who was engineering him ..no actually he went through a lot of guys ..
pat symmonds at Benneton ,Luca baldisieri in Ferrari ,then Chris Dyer

a quote from Chris Dyer:

Working with a driver like Michael Schumacher is what Chris describes as "A bit of a double edged sword." He explains why. "Working with Michael is easy. He is above all a nice guy and is always calm and level headed. He has a lot of experience and can remember any little problems that may have arisen at different circuits over the years. A sort of built-in data bank that he can draw upon and he knows the car's different systems so well that he can help analyze and solve any problems that might crop up during the weekends," he explains.

"In other ways, it can be a lot tougher because there is always the pressure to perform, especially when we are having a lot more competition like this year," he adds.

I had read an article before the seasons started that JV's old engineer would be MS's. Either the article was wrong, or they switched?

[autogyro]

If I remember correctly ,the Bennettons had front bite galore to an extend that everyone else stated it was undrivable on the limit.

when Schumacher came to ferrari he lost all this and struggled to dominate until Goodyear was pursuaded to produce a wider front tire (as was already produced by Bridgestone) Schumacher dominance came with Bridgestone supplying Ferrari....

Interesting. It certainly looks like Ross Brawn is having problems with the front end and the other car is getting podiums, very interesting.

[marcush.]

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2010/01/t ... -mercedes/

[Giblet]

Whatever I read must have been a half-assed jouro guessing.

Thanks Marcush.

[djones]

Every artilce I have read about MS struggling reffers to understeer.

Its common knowledge he likes a car with a very strong front and slack rear end.

He is the statistically the greatest driver of all time but even he needs a car to suit him.

I doubt very much the car is faulty, it just doesn't allow his style to work.

All we can do is wait until the next race. One thing for sure it they will have spent 90% of their time trying to fix this specific problem since the very first time that car turned a wheel.

He could all of a sudden be 1 second a lap faster than NR. To be honest I would not be surprised in the slightest.

Anybody who tries to play him down (even at this age) is either a fool or just doesn't like him and its wishfull thinking!!