Turkish GP 2010 - Istanbul Park

[WhiteBlue]

Vettel could be psycholgically beaten when it comes to q3. Maybe he is faster in all other sessions but q3. Looking at it another way, webber could be holding back and saving for q3.
Hamilton does this whenever he is satisfied with the car. He only pushes for q3.

ROFLMAO

[Intego]

Outisde of mechanical issues, Vettel could be psycholgically beaten when it comes to q3. Maybe he is faster in all other sessions but q3. Looking at it another way, webber could be holding back and saving for q3.
Hamilton does this whenever he is satisfied with the car. He only pushes for q3.

Sorry, but do you really believe that? Webber that confident riding with the elbow out of the car while trying to achieve the right set up and pole position? Knowing that Vettel and his crew doing their best to fight against him (and the others, of course). And knowing he is fastest (and untouchable, as Button said) Vettel gets depressed?

This is maybe Webbers last chance to become WDC. It's a similar picture to what we saw with Button: Becoming WDC and change to a top team to earn more money. Some day RBR has to announce a first driver and leaning back rather early this season can cost the leadership. Webber won't be able to make a good deal when beaten by his team-mate (see Barrichello, Massa, Kovalainen etc.).
No, Webber showed all, because this year is his last chance. And Vettel showed his pace racing to third with a broken roll-bar!

[WhiteBlue]

http://www.autoweek.com/article/20100529/F1/100529773?

It was confirmed by the team that an anti roll bar broke and that Vettel otherwise would have out qualified Webber.

A broken rollbar linkage hampered Sebastian Vettel in qualifying in Turkey as once again Red Bull struck a reliability issue, and the team is convinced that he would have beaten Mark Webber to pole.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

http://www.autoweek.com/article/20100529/F1/100529773?

It was confirmed by the team that an anti roll bar broke and that Vettel otherwise would have out qualified Webber.

A broken rollbar linkage hampered Sebastian Vettel in qualifying in Turkey as once again Red Bull struck a reliability issue, and the team is convinced that he would have beaten Mark Webber to pole.

Fair do's, but it doesnt matter how, Webber is on pole, and Vettel will be told to ride shot gun after lap 20(probably) ....And dont discount Hamilton either...

[ISLAMATRON]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't one notice a breaking roll-bar (and I mean the moment it breaks)? Wouldn't there be a sudden jerk and some noise or whatever?
And that happened to a brand new car? After the old one was sorted out because of a hardly noticeable chassis issues? And just after Vettel showed that he would again dominate the whole starting field? Before he really does?

Now that is very odd ...

I dont know how they are designed into F1 cars, but the weak link of every anti-roll bar I have installed is where it connects to the control arms.

[WhiteBlue]

Webber is on pole, and Vettel will be told to ride shot gun after lap 20(probably) ...

Not by merit though, and that was the point I was making. In the race everything can happen to all of them and I hope that the luck evens out for Vettel soon.

Hamilton is faster down the straight from turn 8 all the way to turn 10 by 6 km/h. So if he sticks like a fly to sh!t he could embarrass Webbo. It also will be interesting to see how they play the pit stop. Which team will come faster to the point where the primes are going to be faster than the old options? Difficult to say. Presumably Hamilton following Mark Webber will ruin his options quicker. But will that mean the primes will be faster at the time of change?

[D'Leh]

Oh come on WhiteBlue, don't be so superficial. Sure, Vettel looked faster most of the time today. Having seen a few more replays there was definitely something broken in the rear of the car. But that doesn't mean he would have scored pole without any doubt. It's likely but not a certainty.

Also you might want to ask how the car got damaged. It was perfect in Q1 and Q2. On autosport forums someone mentioned Vettel might have broken it himself riding the curb in turn 9 or 10 too eagerly. I haven't seen it myself and I haven't taped it either. But if that's correct it would still be his mistake. Well at least partially.

That's grand prix racing. Things can go wrong. Putting all blame on the driver is just as simple minded as putting all of it on the car. Everyone can make mistakes when they're walking the limit. Sometimes you just gotta live with it and try to do better next time. You can't get completely emotional every time it happens. That's not helping anyone especially when your teammate managed to put it together. It will make you look like a spoilt kid. Soak it up and go on.

That's what I always liked about Räikkönen. He was on fire week in week out. More often than not stuff broke and he couldn't reap his reward. But he never made excuses or put blame on anyone. He just went on and was brilliant 2 weeks later. An ice cold performer (don't get down on me for his last 15 months in Ferrari). Vettel seems to be similar, only that he and his fans make too much excuses. Talking him up wont make him better. That's my opinion.


edit: damn I'm slow. My post was in response to your 0915 post.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Vettel was unlucky, no 2 ways about it. His cars roll bar broke, this is unlucky unless he rode rough shod over a kerb like a posessed maniac.

But when we look back, it will read Webber on pole.
Not Webber on pole, but Vettel could've got it.

It does appear that Vettel is getting a crappy deal when it comes to reliabilty though, but as the above poster mentioned Raikkonen had it way worse in 2005....

[ringo]

Webber is on pole, and Vettel will be told to ride shot gun after lap 20(probably) ...

Not by merit though, and that was the point I was making. In the race everything can happen to all of them and I hope that the luck evens out for Vettel soon.

Hamilton is faster down the straight from turn 8 all the way to turn 10 by 6 km/h. So if he sticks like a fly to sh!t he could embarrass Webbo. It also will be interesting to see how they play the pit stop. Which team will come faster to the point where the primes are going to be faster than the old options? Difficult to say. Presumably Hamilton following Mark Webber will ruin his options quicker. But will that mean the primes will be faster at the time of change?

What, put it more kindly. That's like saying Button's was lucky and his wins were not by merit

Yeah the race will be interesting if the Mclaren stays ahead of Vettel. Webber will feel the pressure, especially with the heavy fuel. He already says his long runs weren't as he liked.
Pit stops now; i am not sure, how long do you think the softs will last?

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

I think the start of the race will be easier for Red Bull.
They carry 5 kilos less fuel at the start(roughly) and this is pivotal especially with soft tyres. Maybe this is another reason why Red Bull are quick over one lap?

Then as the race goes on the fuel advantage is burnt off and the last 15 or so laps both cars will ahve roughly equal fuel loads, with the McLaren appearing racey....Hamilton could prove to be the difference

[WhiteBlue]

Oh come on WhiteBlue, don't be so superficial. Sure, Vettel looked faster most of the time today. Having seen a few more replays there was definitely something broken in the rear of the car. But that doesn't mean he would have scored pole without any doubt. It's likely but not a certainty.

Also you might want to ask how the car got damaged. It was perfect in Q1 and Q2. On autosport forums someone mentioned Vettel might have broken it himself riding the curb in turn 9 or 10 too eagerly.

I'm not buying this. The team sees the traces and they said that Vettel was the faster man until his car broke. I'm also not buying that Vettel was responsible for breaking a roll bar! That is neither a driver manageable part like a tyre nor should it suffer damage from a drive that never left the track.

[D'Leh]

Yeah I'm giving it to you for free so you haven't got to buy it. --- happens. I don't know how long you have been following F1 but that's nothing new. I know it's hard to accept for you. But you're not the first fan to experience this.

[BreezyRacer]

Turn 1 will be the great coming together of Vettel and Hamilton. Who knows how it will end but this thing is a brewing .. remember Barcelona .. Vettel will not yield again.

[mkay]

Turn 1 will be the great coming together of Vettel and Hamilton. Who knows how it will end but this thing is a brewing .. remember Barcelona .. Vettel will not yield again.

... except that Hamilton is in front whereas Vettel was in front in Spain.

[BreezyRacer]

Turn 1 will be the great coming together of Vettel and Hamilton. Who knows how it will end but this thing is a brewing .. remember Barcelona .. Vettel will not yield again.

... except that Hamilton is in front whereas Vettel was in front in Spain.

Whatever .. just expect it to be messy.