Computer controled racing?

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byronbb
byronbb
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Joined: 07 Aug 2010, 06:52

Computer controled racing?

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In a qualifying situation where a car is set out on track by itself could a computer navigate a car around a track? How well? The track would be known to the computer to the most detailed degree possibly attainable.

Avto
Avto
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Joined: 20 Jan 2009, 17:41

Re: Computer controled racing?

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"navigate a car around a track?" I am quite sure with some testing and debugging you can write a program that would easily beat an F1 pilot around the track, driving always on the very limit. Sure some drivers Like Hamilton, Michael of old and Kimi can still outrun it on a good day, for a number of laps, but over the course of the race it will be in the league of its own.

PNSD
PNSD
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Joined: 03 Apr 2006, 18:10

Re: Computer controled racing?

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Im not so sure.

The limit isnt a number or defined figure the computer can read.

You could maybe write a program that could combine tyre slipe in a given direction with a steering input (ie, counter steer?). I dont know much about the tyres or the work they do but imo, the limit of adhesion is something on a human touch can feel.

What happens at the limit or over the limit physically though? Could you write a program to detect these things and react accordingly?

I guess this is a simple problem with maybe a simple solution but I find the AI cars in rFactor often take strange lines... Another thing is on some tracks where they curb hop you find they get loose yet still try power out of it. Example being Monza, watch an AI driver drive the Monza track that is made by ISI. Watch them through the second chicane, how they jump the kurbs, get loose on exit and try to power out yet get more sideways. I gain about 0.7 - 1 second on them in that section. I know it's only rFactor but still...

Likewise with autopilots. However, when an aircraft is at the limit, I believe it is easier to recognize and respond too. For instance stability augmentation systems keep aircraft with in desired flight parameters, but could then be easily altered to allow for more aggresive movment yet within the airframes limits.

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mep
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Joined: 11 Oct 2003, 15:48
Location: Germany

Re: Computer controled racing?

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I have seen this once on a docu.
They had a computer steered road car and made a track with some pilons.
A driver made some laps meanwhile the computer was recording the track.
Then the computer was allowed to race and after some laps he could do better than the human and more reliable.

G37Sam
G37Sam
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Joined: 02 Aug 2010, 21:50
Location: Dubai, UAE

Re: Computer controled racing?

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But that would take away from the fun the human errors introduce

Dragonfly
Dragonfly
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Joined: 17 Mar 2008, 21:48
Location: Bulgaria

Re: Computer controled racing?

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Not only the errors, I became attracted by the kind of awe I feel for the ability of a human creature to master the brute power of the machine and make it obey his will.
F1PitRadio ‏@F1PitRadio : MSC, "Sorry guys, there's not more in it"
Spa 2012

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Tim.Wright
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Joined: 13 Feb 2009, 06:29

Re: Computer controled racing?

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No doubt it would be infinitely boring to watch but its an interesting control problem.

I'm dubious as to weather a computer driver could drive better than a person. I have been using a few driver models at work and they struggle to give acceptable limit performance on a simulation model. And that is with the driver model knowing things like optimum slip ratio/angles for tyres and other things a real driver doesn't know objectively.

Currently the problem with development of race driver models is there is no market willing to pay for the development of a good one. The F1 teams all make their own and I doubt any other series would be willing to foot the development bill.

It might ultimately be possible, but the amount of equipment and sensors required would really be ridiculous.
Not the engineer at Force India

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WhiteBlue
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Joined: 14 Apr 2008, 20:58
Location: WhiteBlue Country

Re: Computer controled racing?

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I think that the experiments with robotic cross country rallies by DARPA showed that robots are not up to humans in traffic situations. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DARPA_Grand_Challenge

While a robot driver would probably be quick in static conditions on an empty track it would be different for variable track conditions in traffic.
Formula One's fundamental ethos is about success coming to those with the most ingenious engineering and best .............................. organization, not to those with the biggest budget. (Dave Richards)

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Pandamasque
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Joined: 09 Nov 2009, 17:28
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine

Re: Computer controled racing?

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@PNSD
I get your point but rFactor AI is a very very bad example :)