Renault R31

[forty-two]

Whether the exhaust gases are used to seal the floor from the side or create a local low pressure zone to accelerate additional airflow under the car (or both) and assuming this has a reasonable effect on downforce, the car will be somewhat throttle dependent in high speed corners.

They can overcome it partially with ignition retardation providing somehow constant flow.

Exactly what I was thinking. Since the first car last year to run an EBD was Red Bull, the Renault engine guys were the first to look at the Q3 engine mapping. It seemed that Mercedes (in the McLaren) were the first to be able to run it during a race rather than for a banzai lap, but I guess Renault would still be a few months ahead of the others in other areas.

[Phillyred]

They can overcome it partially with ignition retardation providing somehow constant flow.

That was my question as well. I'd love to see the underside of the R31. If this exhaust solution proves to be "the next big thing" Renault may have a few races before other teams devise their own solutions. It appears a lot of the magic of this system may be occurring underneath the car which is hard to see unless Kubica or Petrov pull a "Mark Weber."

[ringo]

It would be a little more effective if the add a little turning vane under the floor, but i don't think that's legal.

[mith]

I still have pictures of Kubica's crash in 2007 before my eyes, so I'd rather not see something similar ever again! I mean really, I wasn't breathing for few minutes waiting for information, he's alive.

Going back on topic... Guy's (and girls ), someone mentioned Renault did some heavy works around exhaust. Perhaps someone has any photos?

[horse]

Hey Ringo, would it be possible for you to do some CFD to see if what you are describing works, and so we can get an idea of how this hot air is evolving?

Nice diagram, by the way.

Also, I think we might be getting into alternative thread territory...

[Boost]

I don't think that exhaust system will work well.
If they were going to do it that way it needs a few more modifications. Otherwise it should have been placed further downstream, after the widest part of the side pod and pointing backwards.

Something tells me they might scrap the idea if it costs them too many problems though.

Blowing it under the car is not the right idea. That is wrong.
High pressure air belongs on top of the floor.

The exhaust gas isn't high pressure though. Immediately beyond the end of the exhaust pipe is ambient pressure, and it is this pressure the exhaust flow will have once it's cleared the exit.

[PlatinumZealot]

It has energy in the form of speed and temperature. When you impede it's motion or diffuser it the pressure will rise. Naturally it is going to drop to atmospheric after some time outside the pipe, but for example if ones uses their hand to block the pipe and you will see the pressure can get high.

There was a pdf on a CFD analysis of the blown diffuser floating around the internet. the pressure behind the exhaust was higher. I do not know how much higher though, but it can be significant if the exhaust is impeded.

[reikorp]

"Renault has thought in the right direction. We are working on a similar solution," says Mercedes team boss Ross Brawn

Also McL and RBR guys know about the potential of that exhaust since they all work on it. So i guess there's obviously more to gain then to loose =D>


I wonder if there's anyone out there with the sound of R31? I'd love to hear it finally!

[k0zi0lek]

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On the picture from official Renault website you can see that they are covering the radiators with the tape. I wonder if they will modify the sidepod till the final test and this is conservative approach for the first test or is this definite shape of them. Right know it looks that they have more cooling ten needed.

[mcjamweasel]

That could just be down to the low temperature in Valencia. It's normal for them to open up more cooling when the ambient temperature is higher, so isn't it logical that the so the opposite too?

[i70q7m7ghw]

Teams talking about copying a system that isn't even proven to work? Sure.

It doesn't matter since I expect this will be banned for 2012. If bits of carbon fibre sitting on top of the nose get banned for safety reasons then hot exhausts running under the drivers ass definately will.

[forty-two]

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On the picture from official Renault website you can see that they are covering the radiators with the tape. I wonder if they will modify the sidepod till the final test and this is conservative approach for the first test or is this definite shape of them. Right know it looks that they have more cooling ten needed.

I imagine they are trying to simulate less cooling in order to see how well the car copes with the heat. I imagine that warmer circuits would put more stress on cooling, so covering up the inlets is a way of simulating this.

Or perhaps they're just seeing if they could afford to trim down the size of the sidepod inlets?

[reikorp]

Teams talking about copying a system that isn't even proven to work? Sure.

Im not saying they're copying since it's (extreme and brave, but still) an evolution of last years exhaust driven diffusers and i bet everyone reconed the possibilities of doing it with this year's regs. Is it that hard to believe that Brawn is working on something similiar?

No offence, but i'd rather believe Ross saying IT MAKES SENSE.

[Pup]

I don't think that exhaust system will work well.
If they were going to do it that way it needs a few more modifications. Otherwise it should have been placed further downstream, after the widest part of the side pod and pointing backwards.

Something tells me they might scrap the idea if it costs them too many problems though.

Blowing it under the car is not the right idea. That is wrong.
High pressure air belongs on top of the floor.

The exhaust gas isn't high pressure though. Immediately beyond the end of the exhaust pipe is ambient pressure, and it is this pressure the exhaust flow will have once it's cleared the exit.

Well, I think this system works much like a circulation control wing, which we discussed a great deal last year with the McLaren. In those wings, air is blown at the leading edge, creating lift by lowering the pressure over the wing via the fast-moving layer of air which helps to keep the boundary flow sticky. In this case, instead of creating lift (drawing the wing up) the low pressure zone draws more air in (since the sidepod, or 'wing', is fixed in space.) All that air is then happily deposited over the diffuser. As others have said, it's a natural development of last year's blown diffuser.

Talk of creating 'skirts' and blowing the air under the floor are wide of the mark, I think.

[cravenciak]