Mercedes AMG F1 W03 (pre-launch speculation)

[Dragonfly]

Why?

There is no precedent to suggest missing a test is a bad thing. They are making their decisions based "on the ground" with intimate knowledge of what the W03 requires in terms of gestation etc etc.
So if they want an extra week to hone developments, then thats their business.

As for it being unique, Red Bull Mclaren and Brawn(Mercedes) have all done this in the last 3 seasons, didnt work out too bad for them.

I'll be very glad to admit I've been wrong. I'm not a Mercedes fan as such, but as a career long MS fan I more than anything want them to build a competitive car. But in the third year of their direct involvement I don't believe anymore in explanations about different strategic approaches. There's only one really worthy approach - you use every single minute of real track testing to test the car in real conditions and to gather real data for your simulator and wind tunnel.
Therefore I suspect they are again covering some kind of problem with the schedule.

[MercAMGF1Fans]

This whole business about the front nosecone height thing has baffled me completely, and from scarb's diagram of the rules.. its just gonna make all the f1 cars look.. ugly!

[MercAMGF1Fans]

Why?

There is no precedent to suggest missing a test is a bad thing. They are making their decisions based "on the ground" with intimate knowledge of what the W03 requires in terms of gestation etc etc.
So if they want an extra week to hone developments, then thats their business.

As for it being unique, Red Bull Mclaren and Brawn(Mercedes) have all done this in the last 3 seasons, didnt work out too bad for them.

I'll be very glad to admit I've been wrong. I'm not a Mercedes fan as such, but as a career long MS fan I more than anything want them to build a competitive car. But in the third year of their direct involvement I don't believe anymore in explanations about different strategic approaches. There's only one really worthy approach - you use every single minute of real track testing to test the car in real conditions and to gather real data for your simulator and wind tunnel.
Therefore I suspect they are again covering some kind of problem with the schedule.

Well mate, I'm a Schumi fan too yes, since 1995.. and to be honest Schumi himself went on record of saying, and i quote

"I know the team better and I am more involved... at first I was a little rusty. Things are better now and I am convinced Mercedes and I will succeed," he is quoted as saying by Gazzetta dello Sport.

It takes time to gel in to a new team, and all the time the w03 isn't on track the car is being HONED, plus, we've gotta allow for some last minute "upgrades" due to the rather late arrival of Willis and Costa, maybe they're working on a few bits that would make ALL the difference?

[Dragonfly]

More ugly than they are now you mean

[godlameroso]

The problem with that rear wing is that CFD tells you it's fine, but it needs a slight taper near the endplates. And CFD also tells you it doesn't work, and the tunnel can't really give you consistent data, so you trust the CFD because it's expensive to develop the part, and time consuming, then nothing happens. My hope is that the W03 is developed by a group of people that can see past the obvious. Every shape in the car is massively important down to the smallest detail.

Now heat causes gas to expand, which also increases it's pressure, what can you do with that pressurized air flowing through the chassis that has been heated hundreds of degrees F? You can't send it underneath the car, you can only send it above the chassis. How do wings work? Essentially they increase pressure on one end relative to the other correct? The whole car should be geared to work this way, the floor lowers the pressure relative the the pressure on the top of the car.

The problem with air is it's not a good conductor of energy, water works infinitely better. Exhaust gasses were blowing at about 900 degrees, way hotter than any radiated air could possibly be. If you could get close maybe you could take advantage of the increased viscosity of the volume you have heated. You could also have it exit so that it interacts with relatively cooler air and create vortecies.

[MercAMGF1Fans]

Nice Post godlameroso
as James Allen once said (France 2004) "Ross Brawn is a million times more cleverer than me"

But seriously, having Willis back is a big bonus, he was very innovative at then, BAR 2004 he came out with the front torque transfer device effectively a 4 wheel drive system which got instantly banned in Germany 2004 on the friday

http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/2004/725/53.html

BAR 006 - FCP system 25 July 2004


At Hockenheim BAR introduced the Front Clutch Package, a system not dissimilar to the Front Torque Transfer device tried by Benetton in 1999, designed to help the car's entry into corners under braking. The FIA ordered its removal after Friday practice, but a stripped down version with no electronic control was later accepted at Monza.

[dren]

The more I think about the W03 the more I think it will be a big departure from the W02. It will have a different nose(as per regs), Longer wheelbase and chassis, Lower mounted KERS, "radicle" cooling solutions, no EBD(rear will have changed to accomadate the non blowing regs along the reference plane of aero devices not allowed within the area of the exhaust exit).

A front pull rod set up is unlikely after viewing the nose regs for 2012. It doesnt go far enough to help with such a set up as the noses are still fairly high...only the nose tips get a step down.

It'll look like a stretched W03 with a slightly reworked nose. The exhaust will exit like the W02 they tested with non-EBD set-up. Unless they go radical with the sidepods like Mclaren, the car won't look hugely different. If the radiator layout is radical, it may mirror the MP4-26.

I still don't get why front pull rod suspensions get brought up. They are of little to no benefit in the front. A pull rod would be marginally thinner than a push rod. There is a small space to fit the dampers, springs, etc. How you actuate them may net you a little CofG bonus.

[dren]

If Mercedes get something wrong,there is no time to get in right. This is already a HUGE SETBACK. No need to sugarcoat it.

If Mercedes get something wrong, they will be set back no matter when they debut in preseason testing. We only have to look back one year to see that. By missing the first test Mercedes has a chance at closing the gap even more through development. I'd say it is a risk worth taking.

The bitching and worrying shouldn't be aimed at Mercedes missing the first test. It should be aimed at the historical fact that the team has put out two cars with fundamental design issues. Either way, a longer design process will net a better developed car. It will be quicker relative to a shorter design process. Where the W03 stands relative to the competition is the question.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

If Mercedes get something wrong, they will be set back no matter when they debut in preseason testing. We only have to look back one year to see that. By missing the first test Mercedes has a chance at closing the gap even more through development. I'd say it is a risk worth taking.

The bitching and worrying shouldn't be aimed at Mercedes missing the first test. It should be aimed at the historical fact that the team has put out two cars with fundamental design issues. Either way, a longer design process will net a better developed car. It will be quicker relative to a shorter design process. Where the W03 stands relative to the competition is the question.

+1

Re: front pullrods.

With a lower CofG the benefit may be marginal but many marginal innovations add up to alot.

[Morteza]

Willis is for sure a nice addition to the team and he might have had an influence on the design of W03 which has been discussed here before. To me W03 is the make it or break it for Mercedes. W02 had many reliability issues. They had cooling problems and their middle-positioned exhaust cooked their tires. It took them a great deal of time to sort them out. Not participating in the first test is a risk worth taking if helps you develop the car more as Dren stated. I hope the car will not have reliability problems hindering them to develop the performance of the car. Being innovative in the design is double-edged sword. You can innovate something which gives you great performance gains, but there is also the possibility of it to turn out to be something trivial which doesn't even worth the time developing it.

[Ferraripilot]

The exhaust will exit like the W02 they tested with non-EBD set-up.

Would that arrangement be legal this season? I am sure you noticed MB and Williams testing after season with the exhaust blowing between the beam wing and rear wing. I supposed they could have only been doing that to get some actual data on the system which they never had prior.

[Ganxxta]

I think the whole "missing first test" thing is mostly because of the new crashtest regs this year.
Before the first test the car has to pass the crashtest, so no change on the monocoque from this time.
So if you have 3 new guys, maybe they can find something, maybe minor, which requires a change of the homologated parts, it is in my opinion better to leave a chance to hear those opinions and crashtest the whole thing when its almost ready.

Remember they had huge problems I believe with the W01 back then because it wasn't stiff enough, if the new guys can find something like this, then its better to correct it BEFORE the season starts...

Just saying...

[dren]

The exhaust will exit like the W02 they tested with non-EBD set-up.

Would that arrangement be legal this season? I am sure you noticed MB and Williams testing after season with the exhaust blowing between the beam wing and rear wing. I supposed they could have only been doing that to get some actual data on the system which they never had prior.

That is the set-up I was refering to, the end of year young driver test. It is just speculation by me. I don't know anything for fact.

[Mr.S]

I still fail to understand how a car under development for 6 months would significantly with 2 weeks of developmental time. If they have a killer idea thanks to Willis,fine. Costa will have negligible effect. Willis joined on Oct,Costa iI seen December right. It's much easier to fight in an aero package than make big mechanical changes in a car which was conceptualized long back & is in pre-production stage.


They just had to get 1 car for testing,not even 2. Willis better have a killer idea or I see another horrible season. With 3 tests only every test in precious. I hope Merc knows what they are doing.

[xpensive]

Because Daimler probably xpressd that with amount of investment, MGP better deliver, win or bust if you like.