Mercedes AMG F1 W03 (pre-launch speculation)

[Mr.S]

The major benefit of running with the new tires will be observing how they perform between the compounds. Also observing how long they last on different fuel levels compared to last year's tires. Also finding a sweetspot for set-up.

Sweet-spot is useless as the cars are massively different. New suspension,Nose,Sidepods,new Wheelbase,New packaging.

Yea running the tyres would help. You get an idea about peak performance,difference between compounds,degradation & most of all some useful runnings for the drivers. Why waste days??? It's also like a good practise session for the drivers.

[AbulafiaF1]

I don't understand why the big furore over mercury. It's like some guys think that this system will be moving about gallons of mercury, ready to explode at any minute. In reality, this system needs minimal amounts of mercury to operate (no more than 250-300ml maximum). And, in any case, by accommodating slightly bigger pipe lines (in diameter) you can use a variety of other fluids such as gallium (as someone suggested) and its alloys (e.g. gallium-indium-tin), cesium formate, barium sulfide and sodium metatungstate. You will NOT get the same efficiency as mercury, but it will still work and provide the kind of differential pressures you need to lift the nose.

[Boost]

You can make minor changes like spring and damper settings, ride height adjustment, weight distribution (slight).

The weight distribution is still fixed for this year.

[aral]

I don't understand why the big furore over mercury. It's like some guys think that this system will be moving about gallons of mercury, ready to explode at any minute. In reality, this system needs minimal amounts of mercury to operate (no more than 250-300ml maximum). And, in any case, by accommodating slightly bigger pipe lines (in diameter) you can use a variety of other fluids such as gallium (as someone suggested) and its alloys (e.g. gallium-indium-tin), cesium formate, barium sulfide and sodium metatungstate. You will NOT get the same efficiency as mercury, but it will still work and provide the kind of differential pressures you need to lift the nose.

Any system that will lift the nose, would be illegal, as its prime effect would be aerodynamic.

[retpog55]

The major benefit of running with the new tires will be observing how they perform between the compounds. Also observing how long they last on different fuel levels compared to last year's tires. Also finding a sweetspot for set-up.

Sweet-spot is useless as the cars are massively different. New suspension,Nose,Sidepods,new Wheelbase,New packaging.

Yea running the tyres would help. You get an idea about peak performance,difference between compounds,degradation & most of all some useful runnings for the drivers. Why waste days??? It's also like a good practise session for the drivers.

This is mainly what i was referring to, the advantage of being able to measure the difference in fuel loads etc with the new tyres and comparing it to the older tyre; thus using the data to anticipate tyre behaviour to help setup the W03. If only little changes can be made however between the tests due to time etc, then like you say the running for the drivers alone will be more than beneficial. Thanks for the welcome, hoping schumy can get a few wins or podiums at least this year.

Slightly off topic i know but just out of interest, where can we be expecting the w02 to fit in lap time wise with the newer models at first testing? slower? Faster!? Similar pace? Obviously nobody will be showing their true hand early doors but i'm just wondering what kind of overall speed effect we can expect the new regs to have on the cars over last years models.

[Schulteiss]

I don't understand why the big furore over mercury. It's like some guys think that this system will be moving about gallons of mercury, ready to explode at any minute. In reality, this system needs minimal amounts of mercury to operate (no more than 250-300ml maximum). And, in any case, by accommodating slightly bigger pipe lines (in diameter) you can use a variety of other fluids such as gallium (as someone suggested) and its alloys (e.g. gallium-indium-tin), cesium formate, barium sulfide and sodium metatungstate. You will NOT get the same efficiency as mercury, but it will still work and provide the kind of differential pressures you need to lift the nose.

Any system that will lift the nose, would be illegal, as its prime effect would be aerodynamic.

I think you are wrong. There are less developed mechanical systems that do the same and are not illegal. A suspension is just that: a suspension.

[Mr.S]

The major benefit of running with the new tires will be observing how they perform between the compounds. Also observing how long they last on different fuel levels compared to last year's tires. Also finding a sweetspot for set-up.

Sweet-spot is useless as the cars are massively different. New suspension,Nose,Sidepods,new Wheelbase,New packaging.

Yea running the tyres would help. You get an idea about peak performance,difference between compounds,degradation & most of all some useful runnings for the drivers. Why waste days??? It's also like a good practise session for the drivers.

This is mainly what i was referring to, the advantage of being able to measure the difference in fuel loads etc with the new tyres and comparing it to the older tyre; thus using the data to anticipate tyre behaviour to help setup the W03. If only little changes can be made however between the tests due to time etc, then like you say the running for the drivers alone will be more than beneficial. Thanks for the welcome, hoping schumy can get a few wins or podiums at least this year.

Slightly off topic i know but just out of interest, where can we be expecting the w02 to fit in lap time wise with the newer models at first testing? slower? Faster!? Similar pace? Obviously nobody will be showing their true hand early doors but i'm just wondering what kind of overall speed effect we can expect the new regs to have on the cars over last years models.

W03 is a completely different machine. New packaging,turning vanes,sidepods,new exhausts,nose,new front wing & maybe more. It is atleast 70% CLEAN SLATE. It will be pretty useless finding a sweet spot in W02 with W03.

And they cant,different tracks,different weather all contribute. I dont believe 3-4 days of running an old can in anyway help you finding the sweet spot of a NEW CAR. Different beast all together. I am only worried about reliability issues taking a while to sort out & others getting closer to a sweet spot than Mercedes for obvious more 50 % more running with the car.

The speeds will be slower possibly. The EBD ban will make teams loose about 1-1.5 seconds but I think in general apart from the Super Softs all tyres will have more Grip too. I expect furthur developed cars with the regulations more or less at a stand-still. So maybe they will find most of the downforce lost. Who knows??? It will be very difficult to match last year's lap-times ignoring any changes in tyres.

[Joie de vivre]

Any system that will lift the nose, would be illegal, as its prime effect would be aerodynamic.

Then tell us how is it legal that RBR's flexing front wing helps to lower the nose cone which we evidently saw from videos. So nose is changing its height while moving.

[wesley123]

Any system that will lift the nose, would be illegal, as its prime effect would be aerodynamic.

Then tell us how is it legal that RBR's flexing front wing helps to lower the nose cone which we evidently saw from videos. So nose is changing its height while moving.

Please, we have been over this so many times.
The reason that doesnt get banned because there is no proof at all that it does. It passes the tests so nothing is wrong here.

[dren]

You can make minor changes like spring and damper settings, ride height adjustment, weight distribution (slight).

The weight distribution is still fixed for this year.

That's why I said slight...It is fixed within a small window.

[Mr.S]

Any system that will lift the nose, would be illegal, as its prime effect would be aerodynamic.

Then tell us how is it legal that RBR's flexing front wing helps to lower the nose cone which we evidently saw from videos. So nose is changing its height while moving.

Please, we have been over this so many times.
The reason that doesnt get banned because there is no proof at all that it does. It passes the tests so nothing is wrong here.

There is no proof of anything then & there will be no proof of this too if there is a level playing field. Tests are meaingless anyway if they cant do their job.

Ferrari's front wings were flexing all over the place in the final races & if FIA cant do anything about or RBR's then they should get newer tests which can catch it. I dont care how many newer tests they have to introduce but is obvious FW's are moving & flexing all over the place.

[AbulafiaF1]

For those who want to sink their "technical teeth" into the concept a bit more, here's a further analysis:

http://abulafiaf1.wordpress.com/2012/01 ... -analysis/

[xpensive]

So, where was it that I could get 800 to 1 on an AMG 1-2 in the first race then?

OMG.

[marcush.]

let´s wait and see ,but I got the feeling they have something going .

[Ferraripilot]

Has anyone thought that a modified W02 with this new suspension system is what is specifically being tested before W03? I could see that as possible although it throws their claims of wanting to understand tires based on a platform they understand sort of out the window.