Mclaren revival?

[NickT]

Yeah by 6km down hangar straight, but was faster every where else, on his first set of tyres. I think you'll find he was running a touch more wing than the other two.

However, Renualt still out in front, then McLaren and Ferrari about level, given Kimi was carrying more fuel than Alonso or Schumi.

[mep]

They run much more wings which is even visible since they have
the new ones at rear and front.
That explains why they are slow in fist sector (high speed and a lot of drag) and fast in second and thirt sector (low speed and a lot of downforce)

[jgredline]

I think that its confirmed that Mclaren's lack of pace is due to its engine lack of power. Based on the british grand prix, Kimi's straight line speed was quite bad.

Yes
your quite right. Its what many of us in this forum have been saying for a long time. http://f1.racing-live.com/f1/en/headlin ... 4304.shtml
Mclaren can only hide the lack of power for so long.
JPM has complained about it since the first race and now kimi is complaining as well. and that is that Kimi does not say very much.

[kilcoo316]

I think that its confirmed that Mclaren's lack of pace is due to its engine lack of power. Based on the british grand prix, Kimi's straight line speed was quite bad.

Yes
your quite right. Its what many of us in this forum have been saying for a long time.
Mclaren can only hide the lack of power for so long.
JPM has complained about it since the first race and now kimi is complaining as well. and that is that Kimi does not say very much.

And that automatically equates to a less powerful engine how?

Might it be possible the mclaren has a higher -L/D ratio than the renault or ferrari? Or to hide mechanical grip deficencies they must load it with downforce? [admittedly, the 2nd one would mean a strong performance at monaco would seem unlikely]

[peroa]

Hmm, I would say that no other team except for Renault and Ferrari has perfected the flexiwings.

Aerodynamics is where you gain time, not engine power and you certainly don`t lose half a second or more in the 1st sector and are competitive in the next two at the same time.


You guys sound like Enzo Ferrari.

[Ciro Pabón]

You guys sound like Enzo Ferrari.

You are probably right. But then, Kimi and JPM complain of understeer. "Carrozeria anche esiste", I guess great Enzo would say (chassis also exists).

[jgredline]

Ok
Maybe this will make sense. More Hp means you can run more downforce because the engine will have the power to push the car down the straight.
We can say the Renault and Ferrari have flexi wings but the fact is they are getting through the corners faster because they have downforce and good mechanical grip. They can put more downforce in the car because they have the Hp. The Mclaren does have a push problem no dought but Kimi himself said in the interviews he was suffering from oversteer. That says to me he had a low downforce set up to get some straight line speed and was still slow. That rear wing was laid down. JPM's car had massive understeer because he had his front wing laid down. They can get rid of the understeer with the wings but then the car would be even slower in the straights. In other words. If the Mclaren had Hp it would be able to increase the downforce and get through the corners faster. In tracks Like Monaco, crank those wings for max downforce. Hp there does not matter too much and so the Mclaren goes well there. That Mclaren is going to be hating life when it gets to North America where Hp is king.
I am looking foward to going to Indy this year and perhaps Canada as well.
I will be there with my Mclaren / JPM hat, but will not be holding my breath.

[mep]

Why do you blame the engine only because they are slow at the straights
when its visible by the naked eye that McLaren is runing more
rear and front wing.
Also sector times prove this because they where slow in first sector
and fast in second and third.

If you want to drive a few km/h faster at such a high speed like
on hangar straight you achieve this much easier by reducing drag
than by increasing engine power.
Engine power is more important for acceleratin than for reaching high speed. (Don't get the last sentence wrong, what I want to say is that
you must have a lot of extra power to drive a bit faster if
your car has to much drag)

[janus]

imep is right the problem is drag and he engine maybe as a - hp than ferrari and renault i think mclaren does not have one problem it has 3 engine ,drag and maybe machanical grip ...

the problem of the flexi wwing of ferrari em renault as jgredline say is not true just remenber the mclarem was one of the five teams the has asked by fia to review the wings.

[jgredline]

Thats excatly my point. The Mclaren is running alot of wing, but no more than Renault or Ferrari. The differance is that Renault and Ferrari have the Hp to run with all that wing. Kimi himself said the car was too slow in the straights.
http://f1.racing-live.com/f1/en/headlin ... 4304.shtml
Wait until Canada and Indy. Their Hp is king.

[tetopelis]

hmmm..i honestly think its down more to power..it really shows in the first sector. they were struggling in the fast sweeping corners..but come to the low speed corners the car was glued to the gorund (sector 2 and 3..especially 3). thats the strength of the mclarens..mechanical grip..rmbr at low speed the aerodynamics hardly work cos the speed of the air traveling around is slow, there is not as much downforce application there. so it can only point that mclaren has probably the best mechanical grip of any car on the grid ever since last year.still rmbr hungary last year,how close kimi was sticking to shucmi's behind, and i was wondering he must be really riding in turbulant air, so wat on earth is keeping him from slipping and sliding,mechanical grip (even though kimi does have to ballz of steel..or shall i say ice.)..downforce and engine for 06..well interelated..so oh well..mclaren in a fix there..and yeah they are really gonna hate it in the 2 north american stints..sigh

[jgredline]

hmmm..i honestly think its down more to power..it really shows in the first sector. they were struggling in the fast sweeping corners..but come to the low speed corners the car was glued to the gorund (sector 2 and 3..especially 3). thats the strength of the mclarens..mechanical grip..rmbr at low speed the aerodynamics hardly work cos the speed of the air traveling around is slow, there is not as much downforce application there. so it can only point that mclaren has probably the best mechanical grip of any car on the grid ever since last year.still rmbr hungary last year,how close kimi was sticking to shucmi's behind, and i was wondering he must be really riding in turbulant air, so wat on earth is keeping him from slipping and sliding,mechanical grip (even though kimi does have to ballz of steel..or shall i say ice.)..downforce and engine for 06..well interelated..so oh well..mclaren in a fix there..and yeah they are really gonna hate it in the 2 north american stints..sigh

I could not agree with you more..

[jaslfc]

normally during the season they tend to bounce back quite well.. could the departure of newey be the cause of them not closing the gap?

[tetopelis]

newey, tombazias and podmerue(correct my spelling of thier names..hehehe)..the 3 who virtually designed the MP4-20 and the MP4-21 is basically not in the team anymore..so with the ppl who designed and understands best how the car works gone..everyone else is just trying to make the best guess of what might and might not work for the car..and like it or not the 3 of them are geniuses at what they do, the lost of any one of them let alone all 3 of them is really bad news..even for a team like mclaren..they are really gonna suffer with readapting this year..never the less, if we all know mclaren they are the team who knows best how to bounce back quickly..i just don't see it happening this year..but in 07' well everything is game

[jgredline]

newey, tombazias and podmerue(correct my spelling of thier names..hehehe)..the 3 who virtually designed the MP4-20 and the MP4-21 is basically not in the team anymore..so with the ppl who designed and understands best how the car works gone..everyone else is just trying to make the best guess of what might and might not work for the car..and like it or not the 3 of them are geniuses at what they do, the lost of any one of them let alone all 3 of them is really bad news..even for a team like mclaren..they are really gonna suffer with readapting this year..never the less, if we all know mclaren they are the team who knows best how to bounce back quickly..i just don't see it happening this year..but in 07' well everything is game

Wow Good points. Mclaren have lost their top guys and now they have lost their two drivers. I wonder what is going through alonso's head?