World Cup Football

[Ciro Pabón]

Well, Brazil won recently against Argentina the America Cup (with an agonic last minute goal, I concede, they suffered) and the Confederation Cup (they "danced" Argentina as we say here). I think Tévez and Messi are really good, but, you know, we all have the "fear of Brazil" around here. The 2006 World Cup qualys results were:

Code: Select all

P Team     	PT	 G	 W	T	 L	GF	GA		
1 Brasil   	34	18	 9	7	 2	35	17		
2 Argentina	34	18	10	4	 4	29	17

The legend says that argentinians have the "big ego problem". We make a lot of jokes about it, but I cannot tell you...

[Spencifer_Murphy]

Not too sure about Argentina.

Okay the 6-0 win was quite straggering, but they only won 1-0 against the Ivory Coast (who are no mugs I'll admit, but who shouldn't a team supoosedly capable of winning this quite so much trouble) and last night they came across some real opposition in the form of the dutch. Where they drew 0-0 in a frustrating game.

Their results seems a little inconsistent to me...much like that of the Spanish, who mullered the Ukraine 4-0....then JUST win against the Saudi's (okay it was 3-1, but until late in the ast half it was 1-0, and the Spanish goals were lucky...including one penalty which they did deserve)

My analysis is flawed though - seeing as the Argentinian's have NEVER, ever beaten the dutch within 90minutes. The last time they did was in thier last world cup win, where they beat them in extra time.

[Principessa]

...and last night they came across some real opposition in the form of the dutch. Where they drew 0-0 in a frustrating game.

This is rubbish Spencifer. Both team played with a B-team and Argentina was the better team, just not scorring! Both teams where happy with a draw. The Netherlands weren't good at all!

[Ciro Pabón]

Both team played with a B-team and Argentina was the better team, just not scorring! Both teams where happy with a draw. The Netherlands weren't good at all!

You made me do it: this is an "argentinian" joke. Brazil and Argentina tie 0-0. The argentinian commentator says: Brazil zero, Argentina also zero, but what a great zero it was!

I have seen Argentina play a lot, as you can imagine. And I see they are playing without the centerforward they normally use, a guy that can manage the penalty area, normally a short, strong guy like Maradona (sigh... they do not abound). Tévez and Messi are guys that "do not let play any other people, not even when they are playing chess...". "El Ratón" (The Mouse) Ayala played a great game.

I was totally mesmerized by this match, one of the best I have seen, even if I only see negative comments around. Probably some of you are saturated after seeing to much of the style of game of Netherland, but for me it was a revelation. Argentina can be neutralized! I am sorry we could not seen this match before the south american eliminations. I had to say the opposite of my lame joke: Argentina 0 - Netherland 0, but Nederland won!

England, on the other hand, used to be a team that ran up the wings and centered. Now they seem to be playing like Colombia itself: a lot of short passes. What has happened there? Maybe new coaches? I do not get it.

BTW, what do you think of Wayne Rooney Nike's campaign? Highly controversial, as I see it.

[Principessa]

BTW, what do you think of Wayne Rooney Nike's campaign? Highly controversial, as I see it.

Which campaign? Haven't seen it! You have a little video of it?

[Ciro Pabón]

Which campaign? Haven't seen it! You have a little video of it?

No, Princesa, it is not a video, just billboards. Now I cannot find the argentinian newspaper where I read it (it had several photos of the ads on the street) even after I combed my history cache for it. I may have read about a hundred argentinian newspapers this morning for comments on the match.

After googling and bouncing from a couple of weblogs, I found a different comment at El Mundo, in spanish. The photo they are using is this:



The text says (I am translating fast, do not have much time, sorry for the "hispanisms"): "The Advertising Standards Authority, the group that rules on advertising in the country (England), received five complaints from religious groups few hours after the ad was shown in the streets last Tuesday. Seen as a cry for battle, taken from the Crusades dark ages, it unfortunately coincided with the first act of violence between followers of the British and German teams on Monday night"

It continues at the end with several comments. The last one says: "Stephen Pound (labor) said that the ad "is really horrible". "It is a horrible image and so horribly bellicose that the only thing you can say about Nike's campaign is that is rude, offensive and insensitive by trying to hook poor Rooney on his commercial caravan".

I guess you can argue it is the cross of Saint George, but I do not like it either. It seems like blood, and the expression on his face and his totally white, pale, dead-looking body does not help... they should have tried the St. Andrew cross, don't you think, Tom?

[Spencifer_Murphy]

...and last night they came across some real opposition in the form of the dutch. Where they drew 0-0 in a frustrating game.

This is rubbish Spencifer. Both team played with a B-team and Argentina was the better team, just not scorring! Both teams where happy with a draw. The Netherlands weren't good at all!

I fail to see your point. If the argentinians were the better team for the whole match, and failed to score, surely something is missing? Either that or the Dutch defense was just too good. Which raises questions as to say "Is the Argentine attack really good enough at penetrating a world class defense?" To say the dutch werent good at all seems a bit out of the blue seeing as when watching the match I saw about an equal amount of REAL scoring oppertunities from both teams.

Further more if both teams fielded a B-Team they should surely be at a relative competitiveness against eachother. What I mean is, if Argentina had a B-Team on and the dutch did not then I'd be agreeing with you, seeing as both teams had a less than top starting 11, then the teams would be "fair" so-to-speak.

At the end of the day, to win the world cup, you must win your matches. To win matches you must score more goals than the opposition. And if Argentina can't score against Holland, whats gonna heppen when they face teams like Brazil (who FINALLY showed some form against Japan - albeit in the 2nd half) Germany and Portugal?

Unless the Argentinians play well at a consistant level they will not win this competition. However, IF they play like they did against serbia in every game, they will win it.

I'm not saying "Argentina is no good" I'm saying that their performances have been inconsistent, and you can't be inconsistent in the knock-out phases of the world cup!

At the end of the day the Argentines have beaten Serbia & Montenego (lets face it, a C-List team at best) 6-0, then all of a sudden everybody is convinced they will win the competition. Where as their other two matches have been relatively poor results, 1-0 against the Ivory Coast and a goal-less draw against Holland.

So far no team in this world cup has been convincing. I acuse Brazil of the same as the Argentines. They have performed poorly all competition with the exception of ONE match. This one match does not make them the best team. England have been equally as poor. As have Spain who managed only one impressive result (4-0 against the Ukraine), so too have Sweden who only managed a 0-0 draw against a trinidad side with only 10men in the 2nd half.

In fact the only team who have been consistently impressive have been Germany. But when teams like Argentina/Brazil/Portugal are playing at their best, I just cant see Germany beating them.

I will agree that Argentina will win this world cup if they perform like they did against serbia on a regular basis (fluid passing, cohesion, communication, teamwork, a high work-rate and superior creativity)

But that all hinges on IF they perform like that regularly.

[johny]

they both were playing a very conservative game so you can't compare both teams, i.e. People are going crazy here with spain and we've just played with crap teams. the true tournament begins tomorrow, there we'll see top teams playing great football

[Principessa]

If the argentinians were the better team for the whole match, and failed to score, surely something is missing? Either that or the Dutch defense was just too good.

The Dutch their defence wasn't that good (if you noticed the very sordid tackles of guys like Van Der Vaart and especially Van Persie! They couldn't stop them in any other way! And the most stupid thing is that Van Persie deserved 2 yellow cards and got none!) but they still have a great goalie. Van Der Sar is an old man but he's still the best the Dutch have to offer. And I know what I'm talking about because I watch the Dutch competition every week!

The Netherlands have a good team and they will get far in this World Cup, but in the end, I don't think that they'll be able to reach the finals.

The match against Argentina, Argentina was just much much better. The amazing passes of Messi, the great opportunities for Tevez that landed on the ended on the framework! It was spectacle and the Dutch admitted after the match that they weren't good enough! Though none of the teams HAD to win, I saw great football of Argentina!


Another thing: ITALIAAAAAAA ITALIAAAAAA!!!!

[Spencifer_Murphy]

If the argentinians were the better team for the whole match, and failed to score, surely something is missing? Either that or the Dutch defense was just too good.

The Dutch their defence wasn't that good (if you noticed the very sordid tackles of guys like Van Der Vaart and especially Van Persie! They couldn't stop them in any other way! And the most stupid thing is that Van Persie deserved 2 yellow cards and got none!) but they still have a great goalie. Van Der Sar is an old man but he's still the best the Dutch have to offer. And I know what I'm talking about because I watch the Dutch competition every week!

The Netherlands have a good team and they will get far in this World Cup, but in the end, I don't think that they'll be able to reach the finals.

The match against Argentina, Argentina was just much much better. The amazing passes of Messi, the great opportunities for Tevez that landed on the ended on the framework! It was spectacle and the Dutch admitted after the match that they weren't good enough! Though none of the teams HAD to win, I saw great football of Argentina!


Another thing: ITALIAAAAAAA ITALIAAAAAA!!!!

THAT is my point. The dutch defense WASNT good, and the Argentines created great oppertunities, but neeted none. Now as far as the match is concerned hitting the post or crossbar is just as useless as a miss (unless it hits and goes in). A miss is a miss and thats regardless of how close it was.

The fact remains that the Argentines had so many oppertunities to score, great ones due to some really good play, but their end product was lacking. And unless that changes they wont win the world cup.

With regards Van Der Sarr, yes he is old, but I agree with you 100%, he's not only the best the dutch have to offer, but he's also one of the best the world has to offer. Taken he's not one of the elite, he's no Buffon, Dida or Cheh, but he's better than Ricardo, Robinson and Lehmann in my oppinion.

I'm not saying the Argentines wreent the better team (they were, clearly) but a performance like like matters nothing when you don't score. Their midfield was amazing, dominant, and that transition from midfield to attack was also awesome, but the end product, their goal scoring ability, was lacking. Without that they wont win matches, and without that they wont win the world cup.

IF they fix it...Argentina are as good a bet for winning the World Cup as ANY team.

[Ciro Pabón]

Spencifer_Murphy, I think Principessa agrees with you: Argentina had the ball and was ineffective. This was a very tactical match, so I guess the "boredom" is up to the coachs. From my point of view, as I think you tried to say, this was an "semifinal game" in advance.

It was not easy for the Dutchs: Tévez is extraordinaire, they love him in Brazil. If you understand spanish, you can check here. I translate a little: "From here - says Ademir (note: a "very brazilian" name), with an autograph in his biceps - I am going straight to the tattoo parlor, I want to have his autograph my whole life..."

The part I am glad about is that, up to date, is hard to pick a dominant team! And, hey, "Princesa", thanks for participating so much in an "out of forum" thread.

NOTE: oops, sorry, Spence, I severely edited my post while you were answering, for brevity... hope I did not confuse you.

[Spencifer_Murphy]

The part I am glad about is that, up to date, is hard to pick a dominant team!

I have to agree. Its so hard to call who's going to be in the semi's, let a alone the final, its impossible to tell who's looking like winning so far. Its great!!!

[Spencifer_Murphy]

Wow, the French just qualified. Close call.

Looking at the final 16 Switzerland have to play Ukraine...who would have thought going into this World Cup that either of them would get to the quarter finals? One of them will...and they'll have to play either Italy or Australia in the quarters.

Looking more short term though:

Germany v Sweden
Spain v France
Portugal v Holland

We've got some good matches to come.

And spare a thought for Ghana, after all that effort to qualify they end up having to play Brazil! Poor sods.

Cant quite believe the Cezchs are out!

Let the madness begin!

[Ciro Pabón]

I have here my guessings of a month ago:

Missed with Paraguay, USA and Japan, now substituted by Sweden, Ghana and Australia, respectively. Switched places for France-Switzerland group.

My guesses for quarter finals:

Germany vs Argentina
England vs Holland
Italy vs France
Brazil vs Spain

Semis:

Argentina (this is a tough one) vs Italy

Holland (another though one from the heart, in reality it will be England) vs Brazil

Final:

Argentina vs Brazil

The best is yet to come! What are your guessings?

[Crabbia]

My guess is rather simple, in 15 days a bunch of italians will be holding the most recognisable lump of gold in the world above their heads.

maybe more from the heart than from the head but life'd be borin if it was always the other way around...