Speedster wrote:Raptor22 wrote:you miss the point completely. The OEM's want cheaper engines. THe OEM's want green technologies because THEY have to do the work to get people to buy their cars. Why do think some companies prefer to go to LeMans rather than F1. Why do you think Ferrari is introducing a hybrid sportscar? BEcause enthusiasts want to hear a V12? If they wanted to they'd buy an older Ferrari and then the insurance cost keeps them in the garage for most of the year.
I think F1 fans are deluding themselves as to what "people out there" really want.
To be honest I think car manufacturers are rather going to Le Mans because it is more relevant for them, not necessarily only because of engine technology. Di Montezemolo complained at the end of last season that he didn't like the current direction of F1, with all focus on aerodynamics. He compared it with space technology, brilliantly interesting perhaps, but not that relevant for motor racing and motor development in the end.
In my view, it is bordering on stupidity to have an engine freeze (apart from reliability) from 2007 to 2013, in what is supposed to be the pinnacle of motorsports. The whole concept of motorsport is based on having an on-board energy generator, whatever it may be, resulting in automatic propulsion. To just freeze that part of motorracing and focus on some carbon front and rear wing pieces instead feels very unnatural for me.
I love the fact that there will be a stir-up in the engine department in 2014. I think Formula 1 needs it. But at the same time I'm very afraid that it will just be temporary excitement, after the initial development I'm fearing another de facto or de jure engine freeze...
And most people "on the street" don't care about the development of Formula 1 either way. In Le Mans the fraction will most likely be higher, but it will still be a small fraction of the audience that is (slightly) interested in the technology behind the racers and the racing cars. Just look at the bigger Formula 1 forums on the world wide web, and usually you'll find the more fanatic fans there (as casual viewers don't bother talking about racing on an internet forum). 90% of the topics and members are only discussing the merits of drivers, and discussing who is better. Interestingly, most of the time the guy with the best car is blamed for not being good enough to win without the best car, as if it is a crime to have a good car. That tells enough about where the interest is of the fan. I think the teams know it and that is also one of the reasons why it is unnecessary to have such a high cost of development. Not because it is not sustainable, because I think it is (certainly at the current level), but because it doesn't matter, so by cutting cost they are increasing margin.
Exactly! to the people who buy the cars or the soft drink's the car itself matters very little.
Example, I was recently asked to be involved in Formula Student ( I declined due to a lack of time) but I did try and pull some sponsorship together for my alma mater. They had approached the local arm of Red Bull who were shocked / surprised that someone approached them for motorsport sponsorship. You'd think it happens all the time....
OEM's use motorsport platform for advertising their brand, expertise and raising their image. They don't actually target motorsport fans directly. They're just interested in the print articles and the story that can be told behine the success. Motorsport fans are too fickle to be a real target market because you'd need to be winnin every weekend to win them over.
Alpine, I speak as if I'm not a fan because that is the reality check. I've been a F1 fan since 1980. I've raced karts since them and looked at the higher formulae but its just too expensive to really compete and I hate loosing. The mentality of do it right or don;t do it at all...
I've participated in Formula SAE now called Formula Student, worked on a DAKAR project and a F1 project in the engineering services sector. I've been around it a lot, not as much as those who work in the area every day, but more than the average fan. I've seen and been part of what drives sponsors to invest in F1 and what pulls them out of F1. Montezemolo's chirps are not unfounded or out of the spirit of F1 but actually very true to the need for the sustainability of F1.
Car's are a commodity and people don't buy into brands as much as they used too. to be successful in using motorsport as reason to believe a brand has to be very recognisable within that branch of motorsport. The current rules do not allow for that. It's great for F1 as a brand but not for the individual OEM's. Thats why Renault pulled out as manufacturer of chassis and remain as engine supplier. Much lower cost for the same bang. Hence Mercedes have stayed around for as long as they have. Havng their own chassis they saw as an opportunity under cost capped F1 only for the goal posts to shift. That shift has everything to do with teams not wanting close scrutiny of their books by auditors (wonder why) than the concept being unworkable.
I'm all for a much simpler more innovative F1. We just don't have that today. We have a contrived show thats good for tv ratings but if you watched F1 in the 80's and early 90's it was exciting racing under much simpler rules but perhaps more complicated in your face politics.
Le Mans offes a lot of that simplicity
but i dont think the sound difference will be too great
