Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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f1316
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Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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You may have already ready much of this, but this one had a bit more details than I had read:

http://www1.skysports.com/formula-1/new ... to-Ferrari

What do we all think about this?

For me, I couldn't agree more that things applicable to road cars are more interesting and a better use of costs than tiny aerodynamic details. Personally, I think the engine freeze was one of the worst things they did, because the development of a V8 is something Ferrari and Mercedes can easily transfer to their road cars and so the cost is mitigated.

I think the idea of short races is poor. Any time you try to do something that will appeal to kids, it usually fails because kids will like what they want to like, not what you tell them to like. Seems to me like F1 audiences are growing anyway, and the race is no longer than a game of football (soccer), which would never be shortened just to appease short attention spans.

The comment about not racing at 2pm in July/August seems very Italian - the idea that the whole of August is spent at the beach. But that's really not applicable if you live in the UK, for example, and in a lot of other parts of the world it's not 2pm. So that stikes me as a mediterranean concern that might not fly with any of the other teams.

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FrukostScones
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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"The kids can't concentrate today, we need shorter races." Ok? WTF!
"We need to improve the show. " really?
"Earlier starting time, because people are on the beach in Summer (has he never heard of beach bars)." Maybe ok, but who would then attend Porsche Cup etc.
"Kids don' watch TV they use ipads." they can watch the live timing Pauer edition.

:lol: Give me a break (but not a summerbreak).
Finishing races is important, but racing is more important.

donskar
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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I agree with de Montezemolo. For an intelligent perspective on F1, I recommend "Ruminations on change in F1" Joe Sawards blog of Sept 12.
Enzo Ferrari was a great man. But he was not a good man. -- Phil Hill

xpensive
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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When Montezemolo speaks, only fools laugh. His influence should not be underestimated, just look what he did to MrT's
original four-banger turbo for 2013, which got him so pissed-off that he sent Gilles Simon off to PURE for retaliation?
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FrukostScones
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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donskar wrote:I agree with de Montezemolo. For an intelligent perspective on F1, I recommend "Ruminations on change in F1" Joe Sawards blog of Sept 12.
Sorry, better change the rules of baseball because the show is so terrible. And youngsters can't sit down for so long.
Apart from the start time debate, the blog article is rubbish.
Finishing races is important, but racing is more important.

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Mr Alcatraz
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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FrukostScones wrote:"The kids can't concentrate today, we need shorter races." Ok? WTF!
Luca is wrong in this matter!
Of course I'm so old that I watch the first three corners (listen with my ear trumpet) and fall fast asleep.
Those who believe in telekinetics raise my hand

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FrukostScones
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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Mr Alcatraz wrote:
FrukostScones wrote:"The kids can't concentrate today, we need shorter races." Ok? WTF!
Luca is wrong in this matter!
Of course I'm so old that I watch the first three corners (listen with my ear trumpet) and fall fast asleep.
Yeah, just like my dad did while we were watching the 2008 Brazil Grand Prix. :shock:
Finishing races is important, but racing is more important.

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Mr Alcatraz
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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FrukostScones wrote:
Sorry, better change the rules of baseball
Bless you my son! I believe the last significan't rule change was "The infield fly rule" instituted in 1895. The abomination that is the designated hitter is a change, however It only aplies to "The Junior Circuit" for in-league play that is.
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Lycoming
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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Living in a GMT -5 timezone, I really wouldn't mind a later start to the races.

Jersey Tom
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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Luca has some good points - that F1 should be accessible (particularly with regard to cost) for interested teams, and that as an OEM there isn't all that much attraction as there is zero carry-over of most or all of the tech development to their consumer development.

But if Luca wants Ferrari to be in F1 "so long as F1 is F1" ... well guess what, there has never been road/consumer relevance in F1 (or any form of auto racing I can think of). Nor will there ever be. What would it even be relevant to, sportscar development? That's probably the smallest sliver of the consumer market. How many Ferraris do you see out on the road compared to mid-range sedans?

Let's break it down. F1 is motorsport. Motor. Sport. Sport. It's entertainment, not development. As such it's throwing time, money, effort, and the ever-precious carbon footprint out the window for the sake of us getting a kick out of it. What's the consumer relevance of a match between Manchester City and Man Utd? Or horse racing? The World Series? The World Cup? The Olympics? There's none! It's entertainment for crying out loud.

The Olympics really are probably the best example here... competition for the sake of competition, for the sake of being the world's best at your sport. All that training is expensive, there's surely some environmental impact of flying these athletes around the world and of building competition venues... but no one cares about that, because we embrace it for what it is!

It's purely my opinion, and I'm sure no head of an OE would be so non-PC to say this, but to think racing is ever going to be some proving grounds for R&D that's going to benefit your average Joe consumer hovers somewhere between naive and asinine.
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jdlive
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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I agree entirely on the shorter races, one on Saturday and one on Sunday would give us 2 completely separate races, with possibly different set-ups etc. to look forward to. It would also make the races itself more exciting and more active from the first few laps.

I would do a qualifying session for each race though, not the GP2 reversed order BS.
"There is a credit card with the Ferrari logo, issued by Santander, which gives the scuderia a % of purchases made with the card...

I would guess that such a serious amount of money would allow them to ignore the constant complains of a car that was nowhere near as bad as their #1 driver tried to sell throughout the season.

Heck, a car on which Massa finishes in the podium or has to lift so that his teammate finishes ahead (As we saw often in the final races of the year) is, by no means, a "bad" car."

wesley123
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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Okay my view on it;

First of all, he is talking about relevance to road cars. Has F1 ever had any relevance to road cars? No, so why should it start out of a sudden.

And about less spending, guess what is done the past 10 years already, and look what has happened. The costs have been cut drasticly so that a team like HRT could survive, yet you as Ferrari still spend more. Why? Because they have the money available. What a hypocrites there, they constantly complain about how costs should be cut, yet still spend the same amount of money. They make every effort that has done to reduce costs look like it never happened. If he wants to cut the costs that bad, why not start already? Yet he does not, so about that he seriously shouldnt say anything, but we all know it is for him to sound better to all those people who think costs should be cut everywhere, and then with this money saved he can fill his pockets a little more.
"So it's better to say we'll allow, due to the economic crisis in the world, use of a wind tunnel for example 10 days per month. If you are the best, you are the best; if you're not the best, then end...that's it.


Isnt that already the case, I mean if you arent in first you arent the best, simple as 1 2 3
"We have to look. For me Ferrari has been in Formula 1 for more than 60 years and success in Formula 1 is crucial. Ferrari will remain in Formula 1 if Formula 1 is Formula 1 - it's not a race for electric cars or for games.
And he wants F1 to have more relevance yet doesnt want to go electric, doesnt a lot road cars go electric? He is contradicting himself here.
"It's innovation technology and if we have to spend money, we spend money for advanced research and not to do something that has nothing to do with competition. We have a good dialogue and if we can continue like this then I have a positive opinion."
And here he suddenly wants it to have an effect on competition, but these 24hours wind tunnel jobs arent okay? Isnt that part of the competition?
"At that time BMW were there, Honda were there, Toyota were there...so it was a different moment. Today, we came out from FOTA because, to be honest, we don't want it that a lot of small teams don't permit us to look ahead. I'm the first person to say 'priority less cost' but this doesn't mean that we have all to be the same.

"In sport, it's good that if you have a Manchester United and you have a Fulham, just to make an example, you have Real Madrid and Seville. I don't want it that everybody has to spend exactly the same or you're not allowed to do testing. I want to have rules that permit us to spend less, because if I don't do that you say 'This is the limit to spend'...how can you control this?
And here he is saying how because of reduced cost an HRT could even win. Yet that is wrong? Didnt he jsut want reduced cost and competitiviness? Isnt a sport more competitive when more teams can go for the first place? also it sometimes happens that an Fulham defeats a Manchester United.

And from here on I am done. A whole article and he havent said a damn thing, he only says things people want to hear. He wants to cut costs by a large amount, but doesnt want it to give the ability for HRT to win due to the budgets. Also he wants to increase competitiviness, but doesnt want to give a lesser team the chance to win with this.

With every point he gives he contradicts himself on another. Just like a load of other articles he just says a lot of words, but in the end says absolutely nothing useful. And dont get me wrong, Withmarsh does the same, so does Horner, so does everyone.

And is a 65 year old seriously saying what would be good for the younger generation? Seriously? We all know how great that goes with the internet, where also people of this age are trying to manage something for the youth.
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bhall
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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Jersey Tom wrote:[...]

It's purely my opinion, and I'm sure no head of an OE would be so non-PC to say this, but to think racing is ever going to be some proving grounds for R&D that's going to benefit your average Joe consumer hovers somewhere between naive and asinine.
Ever is also a four-letter word, perhaps the longest one, too. You never know what might spring forth from the challenges associated with being competitive at the highest levels of motorsport, because innovation is often incidental, if not accidental. I think that's partially why Montezemolo said, "Ferrari will remain in Formula 1 if Formula 1 is Formula 1." There's still some scope for research, especially in areas of the design process.

However, the window for development within the sport is closing at a very fast rate, and, if left unabated, even the most naive followers will have little choice but to concede that "the pinnacle of motorsport" is merely the most expensive spec-series in motorsport history. That's a hard-sell to boards of directors whose only concern is increasing shareholder value.

xpensive
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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bhallg2k wrote:
Jersey Tom wrote:[...]

It's purely my opinion, and I'm sure no head of an OE would be so non-PC to say this, but to think racing is ever going to be some proving grounds for R&D that's going to benefit your average Joe consumer hovers somewhere between naive and asinine.
Ever is also a four-letter word, perhaps the longest one, too. You never know what might spring forth from the challenges associated with being competitive at the highest levels of motorsport, because innovation is often incidental, if not accidental. I think that's partially why Montezemolo said, "Ferrari will remain in Formula 1 if Formula 1 is Formula 1." There's still some scope for research, especially in areas of the design process.

However, the window for development within the sport is closing at a very fast rate, and, if left unabated, even the most naive followers will have little choice but to concede that "the pinnacle of motorsport" is merely the most expensive spec-series in motorsport history. That's a hard-sell to boards of directors whose only concern is increasing shareholder value.
Formula One used indeed to be proving ground for road car R&D, carbon fiber components, paddle-shift gearboxes, engine management and active suspension was all developed there. Not anymore however, which was Montezuma's point.
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Jersey Tom
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Re: Luca di Montezemolo on the future of F1

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xpensive wrote:Formula One used indeed to be proving ground for road car R&D, carbon fiber components, paddle-shift gearboxes, engine management and active suspension was all developed there. Not anymore however, which was Montezuma's point.
Gonna have to call BS on this, or at the very least I wholeheartedly disagree.

CFRP - Almost no application in road cars on the whole other than the small sliver sportscar market. And even then I'd question whether composite development wasn't already more prevalent in aerospace or other engineering fields.

Paddle shift gearboxes - Also, almost no application or benefit in road cars. Were sequential / drum manual transmissions already around before they became standard issue in F1?

Engine management - EFI was developed in the consumer realm well before it ever arrived in F1. From what I've been told by those working in the sport at th etime, those who really dominated when this was the new thing 'en vogue' (one name stands out in particular) were the ones who leaned heavily on what had already been done by the OEM's.

Active suspension - Similarly, not typical in road cars despite it having been around for some time and a high priority on NVH in some consumer segments. Besides it's all just controls.

I'd argue there are more examples of technology which was originated elsewhere and applied in F1 than the other way around. Micro hydraulics and Moog valves, radial tires, blah blah blah. There's just not nearly enough cash or resource in F1 to really make it much of an R&D venture, IMO. OEM operating cashflow and R&D funds make F1 look like pocket change.
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