The Psychology behind pole position = speed

[raymondu999]

Just something that has been bugging me really.

Why do people assume that the finishing order of qualifying, equals the cars’ speeds? Or that their qualifying speed even equals their race speed for that matter.

There is absolutely no way to prove that the Williams wasn’t 2 seconds quicker than the McLaren yesterday, but Maldonado was 2.5s slower (making the final gap of 0.5s slower). There is nothing to say that Hamilton’s car wasn’t 2s slower than the field but he was the quicker driver by 2.5s.

I don’t understand why everyone points to a pole as a sign of “the fastest car, at least in qualifying trim.” If that were true, then race wins would be a sign of “the fastest car, at least in race trim” – in which logic dictates that everyone in F1 is an equal driver in terms of speed, and we go back to square 1 anyways.

For example - the McLaren right now (with their 4th pole on the trot) is hailed as the quickest car. The Red Bull was hailed as the quickest car of 2010/2011.

I must point out right now that I do NOT dispute these decisions - just don't understand why it's always seen as the pecking order for speed, in the sense that "oh, he has pole - his car must be the quickest!"

What are your reasons?

[Joie de vivre]

Qualifying shows what car/driver combo is the fastest in one lap stint. Of course you cannot know for sure what will happen on race (great example is Alonso/Massa). If Massa had other co-driver (let's say Senna) one would say Ferrari is a shitty car. But it's not, thanks to Alonso. The car just needs a proper driver to show what certain car is capable of.

Currently I think the best car is McLaren, they are consistent, fast, specially a combo with Lewis.

Why qualifying ... well every one in Q3 fit option tires on their car and pedal to the metal, go for the pole. Race is all about strategy, specially with this quick degredating tires.

[bhall]

A car will never do what it's incapable of doing. It's as simple as that.

[Nando]

If the car doesn´t have traits like severe tire wear or some other issue then if the car is fast it will usually be fast regardless of weight, fuel load and ride height.

Sure you can do like Perez in Monza but when Peter Sauber says they had the fastest car it´s BS.
He was on fresh rubber while everyone else was nurturing their cars.
He seemed to forget Hamilton passing Perez in the race like he stood still.

[Tim.Wright]

I think its quite simple... qualifying results are less affected by strategy, traffic, mechanical failures, yellow flags, weather conditions, penalties, tyre degredation and track evolution.

Theoretically you have all the cars running in clean air, on the same track, same fuel load without mechanical failures or stretagy decisions to cloud the results. Therefore the only real varaible from car to car is the speed and the driver.

Tim

[Cam]

Most people in marketing understand the psychology behind such situations. It's used against the general population to separate their money from their wallets. For example; look in your fridge or pantry and notice how many 'brand name' products you have. Why? Are they really any better than any other product? It's the illusion of greatness that mere mortals aspire too that trends buying advertised products - and believing P1 is gospel. Pole position does not reflect the greatest car, just the perception of it.

[FrukostScones]

Most people in marketing understand the psychology behind such situations. It's used against the general population to separate their money from their wallets. For example; look in your fridge or pantry and notice how many 'brand name' products you have. Why? Are they really any better than any other product? It's the illusion of greatness that mere mortals aspire too that trends buying advertised products - and believing P1 is gospel. Pole position does not reflect the greatest car, just the perception of it.

but drivers are brands too

[raymondu999]

A car will never do what it's incapable of doing. It's as simple as that.

I know - and that's not what I meant. I meant, why is it that people do not seem to allow for the possibility that it was the driver (as opposed to the car) making the difference? What is to say that yesterday, the McLaren and Williams were not actually of equal pace, and Maldonado was just 0.5 slower than Hamilton?

Therefore the only real varaible from car to car is the speed and the driver.

Yeah, but people sometimes seem to forget of the driver part of it.

Most people in marketing understand the psychology behind such situations. It's used against the general population to separate their money from their wallets. For example; look in your fridge or pantry and notice how many 'brand name' products you have. Why? Are they really any better than any other product? It's the illusion of greatness that mere mortals aspire too that trends buying advertised products - and believing P1 is gospel. Pole position does not reflect the greatest car, just the perception of it.

I get what you're saying, I really do. But it wasn't quite what I was talking of. It falls down to sort of the neverending question - why do people assume that (generally) drivers who have outqualified their teammates was absolutely on the limit in qualifying?

[Websta]

A car will never do what it's incapable of doing. It's as simple as that.

I know - and that's not what I meant. I meant, why is it that people do not seem to allow for the possibility that it was the driver (as opposed to the car) making the difference? What is to say that yesterday, the McLaren and Williams were not actually of equal pace, and Maldonado was just 0.5 slower than Hamilton?

That's something I always think about. Hamilton's second lap in Q3 which was 3 tenths slower highlights the possible variability in qualifying performance. It's probably exacerbated by the Singapore circuit characteristsics - 23+ low speed corners where you can lose and gain a lot of time based on skill/technique will favour any driver who can control a car with a near-optimum set-up.

[bhall]

A car will never do what it's incapable of doing. It's as simple as that.

I know - and that's not what I meant. I meant, why is it that people do not seem to allow for the possibility that it was the driver (as opposed to the car) making the difference? What is to say that yesterday, the McLaren and Williams were not actually of equal pace, and Maldonado was just 0.5 slower than Hamilton?

[...]

There's nothing to stop someone from having that belief. Such is the nature of a theoretically non-spec series.

That said, you'll never get a better indication of a car's outright speed than the one displayed during qualifying, where, for all intents and purposes, the variables are narrowed down to driver, car, and track. (In making that statement, I've chosen to ignore compromises made for qualifying that ultimately benefit a car's race pace.)

[GrizzleBoy]

I don't think many people take into consideration the fact that tyre use during qualifying determines performance come race day.

There may be MUCH more speed in any given car, but drivers also still have to be wary of how they use their tyres in all qualifying sessions.