Fisichella 'Shotgun'

[boban-mk]

Here is a comment from Jean Todt:

"It has been a good learning exercise for us," said Todt, acknowledging the way in which Italian Giancarlo Fisichella drove 'shotgun' to protect defending champion Fernando Alonso while he was struggling with his tyres. "We have learned what we can do. We learn what we can do inside and we learn from what the others do, so it is always interesting. It is up to you to judge if they (Renault's tactics) are usual or unusual. We are just taking it into consideration. I don't have any more comment to make."

I think that was a stupid move from Fisico and only because MS go with whole car on the shicane a crash was avoided.

[DaveKillens]

If the roles had been reversed, then it was a wasted opportunity and dumb. But instead of Fisi pulling a Shu and ramming his contender off the road to secure more points lead in the manufacturer's and driver's title, Fisi kept it clean and had no choice but to let Shu go.
Here's the scenario. Massa was already strugggling badly, he was not involved in making any points that day. If Fisi took Shu out with himself, Alonso would have won and had 12 more points than Shu. As well, Renault would have had a 7 points lead in the manufacturer's chase.
That's what you get for driving clean, being accused of dumb driving.... oh, if he had only done what Mikey would have done..........

[RH1300S]

Todt is talking out of his arse - pot/kettle etc.

He'd be better off focusing on a great drive from MS and perhaps a little nod in the direction of BOTH Renault drivers who COULD have removed MS from the action, but didn't.........

Fisi's defence of his line was fair (although he let himself be mugged by failing to stay on the dry bit)........

MS made a brave move up on the kerbs considering there was a chance that Fisi may have chosen to be more forceful at that point....

All in all it gave us a great race and all Todt can do is mutter darkly and a little obliquely about team tactics

[bhall]

I still think it made more sense for Fisi to do everything he could to hold that dry line, even if it meant taking the corner really slow rather than what he did by trying to be fast through it. He had to either keep Schu behind him or force him to the outside onto the wet line. Instead he made a very serious mistake in slowing down and giving up the dry line. In the blink of an eye, Schu ended up 7.5 seconds ahead.

However Fisi still drove a hell of a lot better than Massa. I think it's now safe to say that Massa is mostly useless in wet conditions.

[Spencifer_Murphy]

It is up to you to judge if they (Renault's tactics) are usual or unusual. We are just taking it into consideration. I don't have any more comment to make."

I find it strange that on ITV's F1 website the poll for "who was your driver of the day" is being lead hugely bu Michael. For what exactly? I understand he drove well, but had it not been for Alonso having a sticking wheel nut he won have won, fact, and that's even when the team made a mistake with the tyre choices for the second pitstop.

Reason I started with that is because it leads nicely onto the fact that I'm also suprised that some people find Fisi's efforts "stupid". (Jean Todt) In what respect? I fail to see how racing Michael in an effort to him him behind him is "stupid", how prey is it unusual that Fisi helped Alonso, they are teammates afterall...and what exactly did Rubens Barrichello do for his entire Ferrari carear? Help Michael. What has Felipe Massa does at every race he could have done so far this year? Help Michael. So why is Fisi now wrong to do so? Besides, strictly speaking Fisi could have done it on his won accord. Alonso's first, Fisi's second, Schumi's 3rd....what's Fisi meant to do? Let Schumi by so as NOT to appear to hold him up for Alonso. Doubtful.

The idea that Renault are the only team to do such a thing is not only hugely biased but also extemely narrowminded and naive.

Oh did anybody else listen to Button's comments about Schumi and the AMD/FIA/F1 Racing survey. Louise Goodman asked him about how Michael came out as the most popular driver and Jenson said, "That's because its a poll of random people, if you ask a random person on the street chances are they know Michael whereas they don't know any-other driver." she then said to him"So the fact that you came thrid is therefore irrelevent." to which Jens said "Yep, totally irrelevent." You can understand why so many people know Michael, he's been in F1 for 16years, won 7championships, and has been the centre of a lot of controversy over the years.

Its obvious, but I didn't think of it before, I think I'm finally becomming to understand why there are such a huge number of Fans who are totally biased towards Schumi, almost reardless to what he may do on track. Which explains why quite a few people (and no I'm not suggessting anyone on this forum, just people I know at university) seem to have such weak arguments in schumi's favour. They know nought about F1, with the exception that Michael Schumacher is to F1 what Manchester United is to Football...

...A seriously talented sports icon, which sumhow has more people hating them than anyone else, but also more people loving them! lol. Wierd isn't it?

[DaveKillens]

I believe that with just two races to go and both the driver's and manufacturer's titles so close, Todt, Schumacher, Monty, and the Ferrari gang have engaged in an all out blitz of psychological warfare. They want it to appear that Shu made the drive of his career, while in reality, it was a mistake free race that was won on the mistakes and shortcomings of others. That Todt suddenly mentions Renault's team tactics as if it's something not that he approves of. As if, the only reason he doesn't like it because it's working against ferrari, although for years Ferrari has been practicing this stuff with unapologetic enthusiasm. And Monty almost had a heart attack... why? It was a steady, patient Schumacher that crossed the finish line, having done nothing super spectacular, nothing wrong.
This is a very familiar behavior for Ferrari, for the principles to suddenly start spouting off to the media, hoping to somehow sway reality into Ferrari's opinion. At Monaco, same crap. Todt make some comments on the integrity of the stewards, while Monty did it also.
It's ironic that Ferrari are trying to sway people's perception of what is happening, while at the same time, the common man's perception of the FIA is that it is selectively applying the rules to favor Ferrari.

[Tom]

Todt is no-one to talk about team orders, after some of the moves his team have pulled. OK, thats in the past now. It will undoubtably be Alonso vs MS for the title with Fisi and Massa trying to get in the opposing team leaders way as much as possible. Its been done since 1950 and is perfectly acceptable, I doubt they will be particularely influencial anyway.

Fisi did well on Sunday but was a little silly when he came back onto the track after his pitstop, nearly causing an unnessicary collision with Michael. The Ferrari had no chance of going round the outside onto the wet part of the track so Fisi should have slowed right down to stay on track.

Most people on F1.com probably only paid attention to the end of the race, they would have said Alonso was the driver of the day earlier on in the year but now MS is winning they support him. Its always the same.

[bhall]

I don't think Todt was talking in general about the practice of a team's 2nd driver protecting the 1st driver who's in the lead. That's a pretty common and, in my mind, uncontroversial thing to do.

I think he was referring to Fisi staying behind Alonso for so long during the 2nd stint when it was clear that Alonso was well off the pace. That's what enabled Schu catch up to both of them and eventually take the lead. Had Fisi overtaken Alonso earlier, which he could've done easily, he probably would've won the race, with Schu 2nd and Alonso 3rd.

To me, coupled in part with the pit mistake for Alonso and Fisi going wide in turn 1, that was Renault's downfall.

It was a "good learning excercise for (Ferrari)," as Todt put it, because they now see that Renault is going to try and protect Alonso if he's in the lead, no matter what the situation may be. And that's useful tactical information to have if you're the opposition.

[Tom]

Sorry, i got the wrong end of the stick there.

[pRo]

Fisi did well on Sunday but was a little silly when he came back onto the track after his pitstop, nearly causing an unnessicary collision with Michael. The Ferrari had no chance of going round the outside onto the wet part of the track so Fisi should have slowed right down to stay on track.

Without knowing how he communicated with the team, we can only guess. I'm guessing towards #1.

1) "Push Fisi, push. Michael's very close. Push, Push."

2) "Take it easy, especially the first corner, even Michael drove out of the line there. There's no hurry anyway."

Never drove F1 myself. Never came out of pits trying to see whose coming how fast behind me on the straight, especially on the rain. But I'd imagine it's not that easy to realize how was the faster car actually is and can you take it slow or does he have the speed to get by you.

I think it's too easy to say "he should've". If Schumi didn't do the same mistake a lap earlier, he might've taken the lead without Fisi ever having anything to block. Schumi's mistake gave Fisi a chance, a chance he couldn't use.

[Tom]

fair point, from TV it looks easy but in the car I bet its not.

[wazojugs]

I still think it made more sense for Fisi to do everything he could to hold that dry line, even if it meant taking the corner really slow rather than what he did by trying to be fast through it. He had to either keep Schu behind him or force him to the outside onto the wet line. Instead he made a very serious mistake in slowing down and giving up the dry line. In the blink of an eye, Schu ended up 7.5 seconds ahead.

However Fisi still drove a hell of a lot better than Massa. I think it's now safe to say that Massa is mostly useless in wet conditions.

Well put

[FLC]

Massa is useless in wet conditions? That's what you can conclude from a wet race he started 20th and was 9 before he had to quit, on useless tires? Massa drove a great race in china, and if it wasnt for what happened to him with DC (which could happen to anyone, as it was a racing incidnet), he would get some very valuable points.

I said from the start that Fisi did very well in China. Some people are admiting to realise it just now, but together with the comments made here about Massa in mind, I have to say that this guy here with the signature saying "everyone's an F1 expert" has got it pretty damn right. How many wet races did Massa do in a Ferrari? 2? How many places did he have to make up so that people would appreciate his achievement? 10? 15? Only if he finished on the podium? What are you talking about?

I find it strange that on ITV's F1 website the poll for "who was your driver of the day" is being lead hugely bu Michael. For what exactly? I understand he drove well, but had it not been for Alonso having a sticking wheel nut he won have won, fact, and that's even when the team made a mistake with the tyre choices for the second pitstop.

Same point. Your view is one way to look at what happened in China. I could say that MS got 3rd pretty quick and on track (as opposed to through pit-stops), was patient, smart and good enough to use his opponent's mistakes. Which is exactly what makes you a good driver. Had it not been for him keeping the Ferrari on track with them lousy tires, had it not been for him getting 6th in qualy with the same lousy tires and with one lap less of fuel than Alonso, had it not been for him finding the right moment to pass Alonso, had it not been for him using Fisi's mistake (even just being too patient or cautious), had it not been for him keeping the car on sliks when rain started to poor down for the last 5 laps - he would'nt have won the race.

[boban-mk]

I also think that massa did well, except his mistake when he hit DC. If you see what other with bridgestone did you will be supprised that only MS had a good race. All others were disasters. Massa did good job i woud say. But I also agree with usseless for wet .

[tomislavp4]

Ok out of topic but I just wanted to say hi to Boban because I´m from Macedonia olso but currently i live in Sweden.
Super e da se vidi uste nekoj od makedonija na forumov!