About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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f1316
f1316
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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I honestly thought the Schumacher overtake was quite disgraceful.

I know it had NO effect on the championship result whatsoever, but you should race the last race the same as the first race; it's like a football team playing a weakened side once they've qualified from the group stages of a competition - it's unfair to the team they thrashed in the first match.

Team orders is one thing but people in other teams not fighting in a race that could have affected a world championship is not sporting. Schumacher wouldn't have liked it if, for example, Montoya had let Raikonen through in the final race of 2003, even if MSC's sixth (or whatever it was) was always gonig to be enough.

Button had said he'd rather Alonso win the title, but did he let him through? Of course not.

I even think Schumacher showing preference for Vettel over the team that gave him the majority of his success is a real slap in the face. And don't tell me that he wouldn't usually have fought harder - just look at the Kimi battle.

Vettel would have got him any way, I know that, but I object to the principle. Sorry if this has been mentioned elsewhere/is off topic, and I should point out that I've always been a HUGE Schumacher fan.

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siskue2005
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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look at the topic name "About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso"

mnmracer
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Nando wrote:Just to add on that false Vergne thing.

He was supposedly told that during safety car period as they finished the race.
To open up a gap big enough to still make Vettel champion.

Either way, they did not succeed with it if that was their plan.
Which might tell you more about the value of all these conspiracy theories ;)
BTW, if that was true, why did Vettel not close the 3.7 gap to Hülkenberg?

I am glad that Alonso is not from Florida, or we'd have to wait until October next year before anyone concedes.

f1316
f1316
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Joined: 22 Feb 2012, 18:36

Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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siskue2005 wrote:look at the topic name "About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso"
Very constructive, thank you. I felt that topic had been pretty thoroughly debunked and that one led onto another, but I'll move it elsewhere in any case.

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raymondu999
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Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 07:31

Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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siskue2005 wrote:exactly, you can legally pass someone even in yellow flag zone in special conditions
1. The driver spun or run off the confines of the track
2. Driver slows down abnormally (which is what happened here, no body slows down in a straight)
3. Driver crashed or technical problem

i thought people had learned about this after Melbourne 2009?
More to the point, Vettel on Trulli in Sepang 2010.
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vall
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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IIRC, the issue that got cleared was the overtake of Kobayashi. This one on TR seems another overtake, no? That was not discussed at all, so maybe indeed it was under yellows?

Dragonfly
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Give it a rest for Christ's sake!
F1PitRadio ‏@F1PitRadio : MSC, "Sorry guys, there's not more in it"
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FormulaFast
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Hi all,

This is a fantastic forum in order to discuss, learn, explain and probably understand what really happened in lap 4 with Vettel (Red Bull) and Vergne (Toro Rosso).

The zone is yellow, Vettel overtake Vergne, Vettel must receive a penalty.

Can someone please explain why this ilegal action is in your opinion a legal action? Someone told that there was an extra Marshal/Floppy Maker/Ghost... who was showing a green flag but nobody can show a video or picture in order to save the legality of Vettel Championship so I suppose you are wrong instead of spanish media which is only trying to know what happened there and clarify the results accordingly to the rules.

You have 10-20 videos in youtube (several languages) explaining the ilegal overtake. Do you have something to really say that was legal?

Thanks so much.

k.ko100v
k.ko100v
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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raymondu999
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Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 07:31

Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Turn up the brightness and contrast on your monitor, put it on inverted colors if it helps. There is a floppy marker waving green in the video. It's difficult to see, but it definitely is there.
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raymondu999
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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stfn_ger
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Another question, sorry if its a bit to offtopic...

Different media's are reporting that Ferrari would have time until Nov 30th to protest. But as i checked the reg's for that date i only found it under the article ruling the "Right to Appeal". Maybe i get this wrong, but shouldn't an appeal require a decision to appeal against in the first place ? So, correct me if I'm wrong, but the incident wasn't investigated, thus no decision, thus nothing to appeal against ?

Blue fellow
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Joined: 23 Apr 2012, 04:26

Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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stfn_ger wrote:Another question, sorry if its a bit to offtopic...

Different media's are reporting that Ferrari would have time until Nov 30th to protest. But as i checked the reg's for that date i only found it under the article ruling the "Right to Appeal". Maybe i get this wrong, but shouldn't an appeal require a decision to appeal against in the first place ? So, correct me if I'm wrong, but the incident wasn't investigated, thus no decision, thus nothing to appeal against ?
Wasn't the incident with Kobayashi investigated but no action taken? I don't think the Toro Rosso one was, but the video Raymondu posted is pretty clear. If there's one to argue on, it would be the Kobayashi one in my opinion.

stfn_ger
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Blue fellow wrote: Wasn't the incident with Kobayashi investigated but no action taken? I don't think the Toro Rosso one was, but the video Raymondu posted is pretty clear. If there's one to argue on, it would be the Kobayashi one in my opinion.
I don't think so. At least there's no such document in the FIA F1 Media Center. Why investigate the Kobayashi - Maneuver at all, I thought one of the Stewards already clarified that the light signals there has been oil flags ?

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raymondu999
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Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 07:31

Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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stfn_ger wrote:Another question, sorry if its a bit to offtopic...

Different media's are reporting that Ferrari would have time until Nov 30th to protest. But as i checked the reg's for that date i only found it under the article ruling the "Right to Appeal". Maybe i get this wrong, but shouldn't an appeal require a decision to appeal against in the first place ? So, correct me if I'm wrong, but the incident wasn't investigated, thus no decision, thus nothing to appeal against ?
I think you can appeal a result I guess? Not sure though.
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