About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Pup
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Well, I don't think they're going to wake Todt just to make a press release about something which may not even happen.

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Hail22
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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News in that Ferrari are "reviewing" footage from the last grand prix, and hints that
The FIA could decide to investigate even without a Ferrari protest.
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/motorsport/ ... z2DZp8XC4o
If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari.

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raymondu999
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Hail22 wrote:News in that Ferrari are "reviewing" footage from the last grand prix, and hints that
The FIA could decide to investigate even without a Ferrari protest.
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/motorsport/ ... z2DZp8XC4o
I think that's "could" as in "can" - as in "has the ability to," rather than "is possibly looking at"

ie. "The FIA has the ability to investigate even without a Ferrari protest."
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Hail22
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/motors ... title.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/20531638

These two have been published in the last three hours.... unless the press are trying to make a quick buck the more murmuring the more I feel there may be an appeal lodged/investigated. :?:
BBC Sport asked the FIA:

- If the stewards of the Brazilian Grand Prix had investigated the incident in question during the race.

- If there was a green flag waved on lap four at the marshals' post on the inside of the track after the exit of Turn Three.

- If the FIA was now investigating the incident.

The FIA declined to comment.
To me that is the typical response of a Governing body that is secretly investigating a matter, as if they divulge information it can hurt the due process of an investigation.

I may be wrong, this is just my opinion, if someone else can shed some more light for me/us that would be appreciated :)
If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari.

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Pup
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Hail22
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Well Rupert Murdoch has fired up his media minions from Fox Sports to start the "feather ruffling", what do you make of it Pup? (Actually genuinely interested in members thoughts no sarcasm.)

http://www.news.com.au/top-stories/ferr ... 6526550679
If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari.

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raymondu999
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Hail22 wrote:unless the press are trying to make a quick buck
Hail22 wrote:Well Rupert Murdoch has fired up his media branches to start the feather ruffling, what do you make of it Pup? (Actually genuinely interested in members thoughts no sarcasm.)
To be frank - that's what they're all trying to do.

Now I'm not saying that these reports are inaccurate - but that's what every single news agency in the world tries to do. Bitterness and seeming "lack of justice" sells papers.
BBC Sport asked the FIA:

- If the stewards of the Brazilian Grand Prix had investigated the incident in question during the race.

- If there was a green flag waved on lap four at the marshals' post on the inside of the track after the exit of Turn Three.

- If the FIA was now investigating the incident.

The FIA declined to comment.
To me that is the typical response of a Governing body that is secretly investigating a matter, as if they divulge information it can hurt the due process of an investigation.
While I don't agree with your reasoning - I agree that such a "no comment" stance would seem as if they are investigating the issue.

On the other hand - what are they supposed to say?
"We're not investigating" - it would cause massive outrage of false judges.
"We're investigating" - it would cause massive outrage of idiot judges.

Either way - the FIA cannot win. "No Comment" would be the obvious path of least resistance! :lol:
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Cam
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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In all of this the word 'considering' has been used for the protest and they wanna be dead sure before announcing anything.

We've all seen the videos and dissected them in every way, and to be honest we all here made great strides in trying to figure out the first one and then this one. This hinges on the dash lights and why they stayed on. Pity we don't have other on-boards of the same lap as that would speak volumes. Even if the Marshall was waving a green flag, good old arbitrage will be rolled out and the regulations given a good going over. If nothing else it'll be another 'clarification' issued.
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Ignorance is a state of being uninformed. Ignorant describes a person in the state of being unaware
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raymondu999
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Agreed Cam. They can't risk protesting and losing - because at that point they'd look like the century's sorest losers.
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Raptor22
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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They already look like sore losers and frankly Ferrari doesn't care how they look. Ferrari considers itself to be F1 so any perceived injustice to Ferrari is an injustice to F1 and that is how they push it.

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siskue2005
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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The STR lifted for Vettel, that in itself is a LEGAL pass under yellow lights....moreover the Marshall also waved green flag...so it is totally safe
Kudos to vettel for spotting the marshall =D>

Edit: here is James also having similar view of Vergne slowing down

If the FIA decides to re-open the case – and they can without Ferrari or anyone else being required to protest – this confusion over signalling (flags versus lights) might form the basis of Red Bull’s defence, along with a telemetry throttle analysis which would probably show that Vergne backed off on the straight, as he certainly appears to do, which causes Vettel to pass.

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/11/w ... -evidence/

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raymondu999
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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I was lead to this article: http://www.abc.es/deportes/f1/20121128/ ... 80851.html

Yo no hablo español, but I was reliably told it is saying Ferrari will not pursue? Can any Spaniards confirm?
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LionKing
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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siskue2005 wrote:The STR lifted for Vettel, that in itself is a LEGAL pass under yellow lights....moreover the Marshall also waved green flag...so it is totally safe
Kudos to vettel for spotting the marshall =D>
I think even if there were no green flag waived etc, results and Vettel's WDC should stand.

The incident happened literately at the beginning of the race. It should have been swiftly analyzed and concluded. If there was an infringement penalty should have been given early in the race. Otherwise you are basically preventing RBR and Vettel to react and administer their race accordingly. RBR could have retired Webber's car, Vettel would have pushed more to get the next guy etc...

Also if I am RBR, if Ferrari protests I would also put a protest that Alonso gained advantage on Webber/Massa after he overshoot the T1.

There are so many other secondary considerations that FIA can not sort out if it tries to change race results at this stage...

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Cam
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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Agreed. It opens a pandora box whereby teams will 'find' infringements only to report after the race is over for a greater gain. They'll turn it into a deliberate strategy. Seriously, this has major implications. What a mess.
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
― Socrates
Ignorance is a state of being uninformed. Ignorant describes a person in the state of being unaware
who deliberately ignores or disregards important information or facts. © all rights reserved.

Sombrero
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Re: About Vettel overtaking a Toro Rosso

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In the spanish article they say also that Alonso is pushing for a Ferrari protest. I can't believe it ! Is Alonso so desesperate ?