Formula one plans for fourth year project?

[mikekx102]

Hi guys, my name’s Michael Grover and I’m a third year mechanical engineering student. I’m interested in photography and old formula one cars. For my fourth year engineering project I’m hoping to build my own formula one chassis and focus on the use of composites in its design. I aim to learn more about their construction and investigate alternative materials as I go. If anyone has any plans for a car they are willing to share this would greatly assist in my research project. Please note that plans back to 1990 will be fine. Doesn't have to be the latest.

Thanks.

Mike.

[Jersey Tom]

For my fourth year engineering project I’m hoping to build my own formula one chassis and focus on the use of composites in its design.

I would say that's a project more appropriate to a team of 10-20, not 1. You may want to think smaller scale.

[Tim.Wright]

Yea thats a pretty big task. When you say build an F1 chassis, do you actually mean a full size carbon tub? What do yo plan to do with it?

Which uni are you at? There are 3 unis in WA doing FSAE who might appreciate some research into a carbon chassis.

[mikekx102]

I would say that's a project more appropriate to a team of 10-20, not 1. You may want to think smaller scale.

Yeah, but I dont mind if it takes many years and I just focus on one part for my project.

Yea thats a pretty big task. When you say build an F1 chassis, do you actually mean a full size carbon tub? What do yo plan to do with it?

Which uni are you at? There are 3 unis in WA doing FSAE who might appreciate some research into a carbon chassis.

I mean at first a full size carbon tub, followed by the rest of the car and probably a hayabusa engine. Then I plan on driving at trackdays I'm at Curtin and I'm joining the team to learn and help with that, but this is my long term goal.

[Greg Locock]

The use of composites in F1 was pretty much a black art until at least 1988, and quite possibly later. Aerospace wasn't any better, or at least, both fields insisted on treating composites like some bastard cousin of metal. The classic example is people who put pop rivets through hardpoint plates as a last ditch strength improvement/manufacturing aid, thereby creating stress raisers and breaking fibres and causing the very problems they were trying to prevent. Or else you get some designer who puts an integrated aluminium hardpoint in and doesn't taper the loads out into the composite. Impedance mismatch is the term, it ain't just for loudspeakers.

So, you want to use a fairly modern tub if you want to learn about good practice, and the drawings for them are going to be hard to find.

[Jersey Tom]

I would say that's a project more appropriate to a team of 10-20, not 1. You may want to think smaller scale.

Yeah, but I dont mind if it takes many years and I just focus on one part for my project.

Edit - I just re-read this... ok... that makes sense, pick a small part for your project, yes. You may quickly find though that CRFP isn't really practical for a track day car. The cost of making all the molds and tooling alone can be quite steep, especially after you graduate and time and materials become much more expensive!

[Richard]

I'd focus on one detail and try to understand how it works. For example a connection, or a push rod.

BrianG posted some great info on this:

Carbon Fibre pushrod, a closer look http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... =6&t=11557
Rear crash structure, a closer look. http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... =6&t=11546
F1 wishbone construction, a closer look http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... 92#p221292


Here's another one about F1 wing manufacturing http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... f=6&t=7677
or http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... f=4&t=9110

Try searches for autoclave, resin, carbon fibre, Rohacell etc.

[Tim.Wright]

I mean at first a full size carbon tub, followed by the rest of the car and probably a hayabusa engine. Then I plan on driving at trackdays I'm at Curtin and I'm joining the team to learn and help with that, but this is my long term goal.

My old uni, small world... What JT says about the tooling costs are dead on. Might be worth having a chat to the UWA guys. I believe thy used to make their tubs from flat panels which were cut and bonded like you would do with an aluminium. monocoque.

Finding an oven to cure it would be the next step. There used to be a company called Quickstep doing composites near freo but. they've packed up and moved to Sydney BUT last I heard their autoclaves were still in freo and operational. Unfortunately I dont have any contacts in there anymore, but could be worth a shout. Failing that, there is a massive boat industry in Henderson so theres a fair bit of composite knowledge and facilities around.

Sounds like a cool project though.

Tim

[mikekx102]

Thanks for the ideas guys! I appreciate it =)

[kilcoo316]

I mean at first a full size carbon tub, followed by the rest of the car and probably a hayabusa engine. Then I plan on driving at trackdays I'm at Curtin and I'm joining the team to learn and help with that, but this is my long term goal.

Hmmm...

I would advise forgetting about the F1 aspect, as information will be challenging to come by. Perhaps you'd consider getting in touch with the likes of MEV ltd - a kitcar manufacturer in the UK.

You could then investigate developing a composite component to fit onto the chassis as replacement for existing metallics.

http://www.roadtrackrace.co.uk/mevabusa.html

Its possible they have an FE model already, they should have a CAD model, and they might supply data to you if you were to make a deal on giving any data developed back to them.


I would consider it too large a step to for any engineering student to build their own complete carbon tub without getting a few years experience of the design, stress and manufacturing processes relevant to the material. I don't want to be overly down on it, but me saying this might stop you wasting time and money.

[mikekx102]

Thanks for all the ideas guys. I thought it would be easier to find old plans since there have been companies like EuroBrun, Brabham and Ligier who went bankrupt and probably sold their stuff for a song. And then there's Rial who quit F1 a long time ago and now make rims, and then also Life and Larousse...

If anyone ever does get a hold of anything and is willing to share or sell a copy, I'm still super interested, but for now I think the best approach is to just help out with Formula SAE =)

Mike.