2014 Engine yin yang

[Holm86]

Completely agree Hollus. This is ridiculous.

[marcush.]

As i understand
A123 Batteries was the supplier to Daimler AMG HPP and went bankrupt in 2012 and was bought by Chinese company Wanxiang...now the question is -what does Chicago play in that ..as A123 is situated in Michigan not illinois....

[mkable1370]

Glad to see the Italian media doing their best to keep up with the German press with respect to the tit-for-tat over 2014 new engine developments...

[Richard]

Gentlemen, restraint and common sense, please!

Completely agree Hollus. This is ridiculous.

Yup, its a very silly thread full of yin yang.

What concerns me is a horrible suspicion that some posts might have been serious.

So back on topic .... One objective indicator of hidden Merc power might be rushed xmas orders with car dealers in Brixworth?

[Bredd]

http://www.espnf1.com/blogs/motorsport/ ... 35869.html

Why the hell do Renault want the revs increased? That doesn't make much sense to me within the regs.

[Ogami musashi]

dead link

[xpensive]

http://www.espnf1.com/blogs/motorsport/ ... 35869.html

Why the hell do Renault want the revs increased? That doesn't make much sense to me within the regs.

Believe me, just the usual smoke and mirrors, the kind of trickery today's Formula 1 journos simply don't grasp.

In particular the speculation over engine failures next year, when these ICE's will probably be the least stressed ever,
580 Hp from a 1.6 liter turbo at 10 000 to 12 000 rpm is nothing compared to the 80s, let alone the 20k V8s of 2006.

With modern material-, coating- and lubrication-technology, the 2014 ICE's will last forever.

The MGU-X systems is another matter however, but you can finish the races without those.

[munudeges]

As i understand
A123 Batteries was the supplier to Daimler AMG HPP and went bankrupt in 2012 and was bought by Chinese company Wanxiang...now the question is -what does Chicago play in that ..as A123 is situated in Michigan not illinois....

Quite right. A123 had a ton of US public money pumped into them and ultimately went bust. I've had dealings with them, but can't say exactly how. They're still going and doing business though.

They were trying to push forwards battery technology where the challenge they had was to weld the battery electrolyte in a moisture and oxygen free environment. Leak testing it proved very difficult and A123 batteries have proved very difficult to keep 'leak free'. Put simply, once they leak in any way they are finished.

Other manufacturers and buyers of batteries, Tesla being the biggest example, have felt it was far better to take current, proven and working battery technology (Lithium Ion) and to put the effort in to get it all under control (thermal events!) and reliable.

[Juzh]

The MGU-X systems is another matter however, but you can finish the races without those.

Last... most likely.

[munudeges]

The thing about reliability is that under next year's regulations if you replace anything then it's a penalty, and that includes wiring or anything surrounding the MGU-X. The engines themselves are bog standard lumps that don't really push anything forwards. Power isn't going to be everything, but the engines are so standardised that we're likely to get three very evenly matched variants. It's what happens around it, the batteries in particular, that will be the most interesting part.

Anything publicly said by anyone, be it Ferrari and fuel consumption, Renault and revs or Mercedes's seeming confidence is complete smoke and mirrors.

[munudeges]

I wouldn't be surprised if it's Panasonic, I understand they're suppying Tesla motors as well, but surely made in China anyway?

Don't pay too much attention to who manufactures batteries. They're all standard lithium ion batteries that Toshiba and countless others make. It's the battery pod that matters, and that's what a company like Tesla have put all their effort into.

[xpensive]

The thing about reliability is that under next year's regulations if you replace anything then it's a penalty, and that includes wiring or anything surrounding the MGU-X.
...

Even the batteries, no more throwaways? I didn't know that, why I guess those components will be pretty critical reliability-wise.

[Bredd]

Yeah no more throw away batteries. Grid penalty for that now.

[xpensive]

Yeah no more throw away batteries. Grid penalty for that now.

Are you really certain about this, batteries are kind of a consumable, if you charge/discharge 6 times per lap, 150 laps per race weekend for 5 races, that's 4500 cycles?

In all honesty, I find it difficult to believe that those batteries will last that long.

[Bredd]

I think you can change them once a race but not like now where they change batteries in and out for free practice, quali and the race. I'm pretty sure a battery has to last a full race weekend. It's not really been mentioned that much.