Double Points @ Final Race

[turbof1]

From which source is the quote? Which site posted that article?

This topic is more then enough fuel for a fanyboy flame fest; I fear Richard will be closing this one... .

Btw, even if true, this isn't a conspiracy of some sorts. Montezemolo didn't asked for this; it's just Ecclestone who forced it through. And in essence, I think I can understand Ecclestone's reasoning for pointing fingers: other teams didn't do as good a job as Red Bull. They simply failed. Though the reaction to try to solve it, is borderline idiotic.

[RZS10]

http://www.cityam.com/article/139147443 ... eccelstone

@motorsport-total they interpreted it as "Ecclestone blames Ferrari for double points"

[turbof1]

http://www.cityam.com/article/139147443 ... eccelstone

Thanks. Just wanting to be sure it isn't a fluke. A quick check learns that city a.m. is rightside business newspaper. Looks trust worthy.

Do you perhaps mind changing the title? Although only spoken to Montezemolo, Bernies double point idea clearly is to try to benefit all the other teams (except red bull of course). I feel like singling ferrari out on this is going to upset some people here.

[danielk]

it seems that the comments could be read in a variety of ways. for example Montezemelo goes to berny and says:

Montezemelo: "Yo Bernie!! This double points idea is madness!"

Bernie: 'It is very simple why we got that' 'It is because you aren't performing' "'If you were doing what you should be doing there wouldn't be any need for it'

Montezemalo: 'I know, I know',


Now this could have been said to any team on the grid. Bernie doesent want championships decided half way through the season, hes seen TV viewings fall all over the world and people having little interest in the final races. Reason? Championship was decided too early. Reason? Ferrari, Mclaren, Renault, Mercedes, Williams etc are not doing there job as well as Red Bull.

I see nothing wrong with what Berny said. And i see it as not being favouritism towards Ferrari. Lets be honest the rumours as of late is that Red bull is Bernies favourite team and hes super pally with Seb etc. I feel its some selective comments with a journalistic twist.

[Just_a_fan]

Do you perhaps mind changing the title? Although only spoken to Montezemolo, Bernies double point idea clearly is to try to benefit all the other teams (except red bull of course). I feel like singling ferrari out on this is going to upset some people here.

It would be sweetly ironic if the double points actually helps RedBull this year. If they are slow out of the blocks because of the issues raised in testing but then develop quickly during the season, they could end up winning by a narrow margin by virtue of the double points.

Bernie isn't interested in looking after Ferrari; he just wants to be able to protect the last couple of races at the end of the season - presumably so he can charge lots for the privilege of hosting a possible title decider.

Bernie protects the money that's all.

[tim|away]

Sorry, but you got it completely wrong ...

"Formula 1′s controversial new double points rule for the final race is due to a drop of 50m TV viewers towards the end of 2013. That is the belief of F1 business journalist Christian Sylt who perhaps even more astonishingly revealed there was a 9% drop in TV audience in Germany, the home country of Sebastian Vettel.

Bernie Ecclestone himself admitted the much reduced TV figures was due to the “less competitive nature of the final few rounds” after Vettel had wrapped up the title in India and dominated the final nine races."

http://www.givemesport.com/426632-f1-do ... tv-ratings

Having quoted the above, you will understand that it was the broadcasters who put pressure on the working group to get their viewers back, because they were losing out on profit. Bernie's statement to Montezemolo was taken completely out of context and interpreted the wrong way. Bernie simply suggested that if there was competition, there wouldn't be a need for double points, as no one would be moaning about a lack of viewers. Therefore, if Ferrari (or any other team) did its job and was more competetive this problem wouldn't exist - that is all.

[turbof1]

Do you perhaps mind changing the title? Although only spoken to Montezemolo, Bernies double point idea clearly is to try to benefit all the other teams (except red bull of course). I feel like singling ferrari out on this is going to upset some people here.

It would be sweetly ironic if the double points actually helps RedBull this year. If they are slow out of the blocks because of the issues raised in testing but then develop quickly during the season, they could end up winning by a narrow margin by virtue of the double points.

I think Bernie would be still ok with that because his goal is then achieved: to have suspense until the end. Anyhow, I think it would be catastrophic if just ended with more red bull dominance, or a different team's dominance.

[lotus7]

well, if it is to help Ferrari as the thread title states , then only they should get double points . As it is, all the teams that could score, will get double points - including the team leading the championship
That's is exactly the silliness of the idea

[CriXus]

I would say, that people at a certain age should stop talking. I'm starting to think, that Bernie lost his mind. It's time for retirement.

[MOWOG]

I had seen the quoted article about a drop in tv viewership elsewhere. There have been more than a few people at this forum who have suggested they have lost some of their passion for the sport over the past season or two. There have been calls for a boycott of the races. Apparently, those people are not alone. It now turns out the sport is hemorrhaging viewers worldwide, even without our help!

One factor for Uncle Bernard and his minions to keep an eye on is the place Formula One racing holds within the full panoply of sports available to fans today. Now we are inundated with sporting contests 24 hours a day. And they are all designed to suck money out of our wallets on behalf of promoters, broadcasters, team owners, etc. The entire notion of sports has undergone a complete makeover since the invention of the internet. Sports are no longer sports as those of us born before 1980 used to think of athletic competitions. Today, sports is just one of many facets of the entertainment business, which offers many, many choices to the consumer. Do not underestimate the importance of video gaming and casino gambling in bleeding off some of the hitherto loyal fans.

Formula One is desperate to keep itself at the forefront of the sporting world. But its difficulty in attracting enough sponsors to pay the bills is symptomatic of far more than the quality of the racing, or lack thereof. While F1 strives to make its image more environmentally friendly and its technical regulations more appealing to additional automobile manufacturers, by failing to fully understand its place in the universe of leisure time activities it risks becoming what every sports "product" fears most - becoming irrelevant.

[FoxHound]

Ahhh Christian Sylt strikes again....

Although the figures may have dropped toward the end of 2013, double points would not have assisted anyone in catching the eventual winners. The contrast would have been even starker.
The issue here is Bernie will not take the bull by the horns and legislate a fairly split Formula between engine, chassis and aero.
Some may argue that aero always has been a predominant factor in F1. I disagree.

The dice is loaded in favour of those with the greatest aero minds and facilities. If there are restrictions imposed on aero as there are on Chassis and engines it will redress the balance.
The key is to allow development within the confines of fairly policed regulation(this can extend be budgetry within reason...not the 50 million rubbish of 5 years ago).
We all want to see innovation, be that aero, chassis or engine. But it is moot to have 1 team dominating due to their aero prowess and others flailing with the potential to do more on other facets of the car.

Why have a synthetic solution at the final race that leaves fans bemused, when you can strike at the root cause of the problem?
This year the balance has been addressed somewhat wth the introduction of new engines. But they will all be homologated soon and the status quo will be resumed.
In fact it's actually worse. If Renault are as behind as we are led to believe they will have likely be given leeway to make changes to their engine.

I'm all for it if it means a competitive season, but at what point do you stop?

McLaren found themselves falling short in the aero department last year, but such is the nature of the beast that it threw the towel in very early on in full knowledge there was no chance of them getting near the front with all the aero development in the world.

This is, in my view, wrong.

A team like McLaren should not be in this position.

To surmise then....keep double points in the bin where it belongs. Instead of quick fix solutions to boring seasons borne out of lopsided regulations, change the root cause of the problem.
Give the teams the means necessary to compete on all fronts and not just aero.

[Richard]

Ecclestone devised 'double points' to help Ferrari

I'm speechless. Absolutely disgusting.

Firstly, I’m not sure why you’re disgusted. There’s nothing new about Bernie trying to change the rules in order to change the outcomes. He’s not the only one either, Moseley and Balestre did the same too. If you’re speechless and disgusted then I suggest you don’t read any F1 history or you’ll suffer asphyxiation.

Secondly, saying “Ecclestone devised 'double points' to help Ferrari” is misleading. The double points are intended to help all teams against RB domination. As Bernie says, double points have been introduced because all other teams are not performing.

[Aesto]

Nowhere does Ecclestone say that the double points rule is intended to help anyone, not Ferrari, not any of the other teams. What Ecclestone meant is that if Ferrari were doing their job and built a proper car to keep the championship alive until the last race, the rule wouldn't be needed to keep up viewership figures.

But of course, some people are all too happy to misunderstand it because it gives them another opportunity to complain about something, especially if that something is Ecclestone. Same goes for the journalists, they intentionally misrepresent the comment because scandals drive up pageviews.

[Holm86]

I just wonder why Ecclestone wasn't so busy coming up with regulations to hurt Ferrari back when they were the dominant team in the early 00's.

[SilverArrow]

Nowhere does Ecclestone say that the double points rule is intended to help anyone, not Ferrari, not any of the other teams. What Ecclestone meant is that if Ferrari were doing their job and built a proper car to keep the championship alive until the last race, the rule wouldn't be needed to keep up viewership figures.

But of course, some people are all too happy to misunderstand it because it gives them another opportunity to complain about something, especially if that something is Ecclestone. Same goes for the journalists, they intentionally misrepresent the comment because scandals drive up pageviews.

Well forgive us for not believing the naive answer. Regardless of whether or not he meant to say that, it doesn't change the fact that the rule is completely idiotic. Looking at the most recent season we have had, double points would have had absolutely no impact on the standings. It's kind of hard to believe anything he says when the reasoning behind the rule doesn't even make sense.