Red Bull RB10 Renault

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
User avatar
Kiril Varbanov
147
Joined: 05 Feb 2012, 15:00
Location: Bulgaria, Sofia

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

Bomber_Pilot wrote:
djos wrote:What rubbish, most of the teams have been using laser alignment at the track for years!
RedBull use a piece of string. I will try to find some pictures when I get to the computer.
They do, indeed.

Image

Along with laser control tools by Leica, as indicated a while ago. The chassis argument is a done deal, honestly. Vettel has got a new chassis and the previous is history, covered in dust.
Whether this was a crack in the internal survival cell structure or something else. Vettel delivered excellent performance in Spain.

User avatar
Tim.Wright
330
Joined: 13 Feb 2009, 06:29

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

turbof1 wrote:The only thing that can detect SOME of the issues, is sonic wave devices. But even then it's still difficult.
Well dimensional issues (like a warped chassis) could be measured with a CMM if the tub is stripped bare.

A torsional and bending test will allow a quick check for structural problems without having to do a full ultrasound NDT of the whole chassis.

Ultrasound is certainly not the only method to check for a defective chassis.
Not the engineer at Force India

User avatar
turbof1
Moderator
Joined: 19 Jul 2012, 21:36
Location: MountDoom CFD Matrix

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

I have to say with that "... in the case of hairline cracks".
#AeroFrodo

AlexT
AlexT
0
Joined: 29 Jan 2014, 11:33

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

Did anyone notice Red Bull had a change of nose since China. The step seems steeper now and more pronounced http://tinypic.com/r/35lxjci/8

zioture
zioture
549
Joined: 12 Feb 2013, 12:46
Location: Italy

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

AlexT wrote:Did anyone notice Red Bull had a change of nose since China. The step seems steeper now and more pronounced http://tinypic.com/r/35lxjci/8
Sure, I had posted this on twitter, Red-bull team used this nose in the race

Image

marcush.
marcush.
159
Joined: 09 Mar 2004, 16:55

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

Tim.Wright wrote:
djos wrote:What rubbish, most of the teams have been using laser alignment at the track for years!
All the laser alignment in the world will not detect a chassis defect because the ride height, camber, caster and toe adjustments will hide any problems exactly as they are designed to do.
I´m not a big fan of laser Voodoo .A string will get you there as well .One Thing that will indicate torsional stiffness discrepancies is the cars reaction to crossweight changes .
Sure the Teams know exactly what to expect in Terms of crossweight Change for any Change of push/pullrod length /one sided rideheight Change .If this is not working as expected one has to look deeper in Installation stiffness of that particular car as it stands on the setuppads.

You would ,of course not really know how things behave when the car is running at full temps though ..mind you not only Aluminium and Magnesium but also bonds and resins have temperature related behavior ...once you exceed limits (heat ,Vibration) it may still look fine but lost a fair amount of its specified characteristics .

That said you cannot judge a structure ssolely by ultrasonic testing I´d say .This will only be partly valid if you have done the exact test beforehand so you can relate to a earlier set of data of exactly this structure .But I´m rather sure there are failure modes of a Composite structure not detectable by sonic testing ...

Crucial_Xtreme
Crucial_Xtreme
404
Joined: 16 Oct 2011, 00:13
Location: Charlotte

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

GA's analysis of the new RB10 floor slot/s.

Image
via AutoSport

User avatar
techF1LES
176
Joined: 25 Mar 2012, 22:02
Location: Slovakia

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

AMuS Red Bull without a TV camera trick in Monaco

FOM as a representative of the commercial rights holder was not satisfied by the second refinement of the front TV camera housing in Barcelona and demanded more radical improvements.

From the Monaco GP, the front of TV camera and the housings will sit in two ears on either side of the nose cone - similar to Mercedes and Ferrari.

aral
aral
26
Joined: 03 Apr 2010, 22:49

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

I cannot see how anyone can change the rules mid season. The RB10 camera position fulfills the letter of the law, so just because FOM are not happy, the rules cannot be changed.

e30ernest
e30ernest
27
Joined: 29 Feb 2012, 08:47

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

gilgen wrote:I cannot see how anyone can change the rules mid season. The RB10 camera position fulfills the letter of the law, so just because FOM are not happy, the rules cannot be changed.
If Google Translate was accurate, it states that the FOM cited the annex of the regs which showed a drawing with the camera housed on external positions. It also said something about Clause 20 in the rulebook.

avatar
avatar
3
Joined: 13 Mar 2009, 22:01

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

gilgen wrote:I cannot see how anyone can change the rules mid season. The RB10 camera position fulfills the letter of the law, so just because FOM are not happy, the rules cannot be changed.
From memory the rule is that there has to be agreement with the commercial rights holder on camera positions - no rule change needed in that case!

wesley123
wesley123
204
Joined: 23 Feb 2008, 17:55

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

So they have allowed Red Bull to run an illegal car for the past few races. I don't know what is "worse".
"Bite my shiny metal ass" - Bender

aral
aral
26
Joined: 03 Apr 2010, 22:49

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

There is a designated area within which the cameras have to be positioned. This was agreed with FOM and FIA. The simple fact is that RBR have placed the camera within the designated position, so it is entirely legal. It might not be what FOM intended, but they cannot change the rules mid season.

beelsebob
beelsebob
85
Joined: 23 Mar 2011, 15:49
Location: Cupertino, California

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

gilgen wrote:There is a designated area within which the cameras have to be positioned. This was agreed with FOM and FIA. The simple fact is that RBR have placed the camera within the designated position, so it is entirely legal. It might not be what FOM intended, but they cannot change the rules mid season.
There's a designated area and a requirement that the FOM must be happy with the view from it. RBR have met half the requirements, not all of them.

bhall
bhall
244
Joined: 28 Feb 2006, 21:26

Re: Red Bull RB10 Renault

Post

Looks like Red Bull met the letter of the law.

20.3.1 All cars must be equipped with five positions in which cameras or camera housings can be fitted. Referring to Drawing 6, all cars must carry (i) a camera in position 4 and (ii) a camera or camera housing in positions 2 (both sides), 3 and either 1 or 5.

Any decision as to whether a camera or camera housing is fitted in those positions will be by agreement between the relevant Competitor and the Commercial Rights Holder.


Done.

20.3.4 When viewed from the side of the car, the entire camera (or dummy camera) in position 2 [the camera in question] shown in Drawing 6 must lie within a box formed by two vertical lines 150mm and 450mm forward of the front wheel centre line and two horizontal lines 325mm and 525mm above the reference plane.

Any camera or camera housing fitted in the left hand position 2 shown in Drawing 6 must be mounted in order that its major axis where passing through the centre of the camera lens (or corresponding position for a camera housing) does not intersect any part of the car lying forward of the camera or camera housing.


Also done.

FOM politics, on the other hand, not so much.

Damn shame, too. It was one of my favorite recent "innovations."