Sausage kerbs doing more harm than good?//blow over events

[wesley123]

Earlier today I spotted the following article http://www.motorsport.com/formula-e/new ... than-good/ . As you can read, this article talks about these so-called "sausage kerbs" and their deal in recent crashes from Nick Heidfeld in Beijing last weekend and Konstantin Tereshchenko in the GP3 in Spa.




As it is visible, both drivers got some good air coming from the kerbs.

And then I started thinking, is this all the sausage kerbs fault? How much is in the car itself?

Recent rule changes in the LMP categories have all been to reduce the blow over events, an event where the cars generate lift under sudden yaw(hope i word it correctly here). The ACO first issued a spec underbody for the LMP1 and 2 categories in 2006 together with a dual roll-over hoop. However, as shown by Ortellis crash in Monza 2008, and a few other similar incidents in those years, this was not enough.
[youtube]http://youtu.be/0_yfiE9Esfg?t=4m13s[/youtube]

To further reduce these blowover events from 2011, new LMPs had to run a large shark fin. As shown by McNish' huge crash at the 2011 24h of Le Mans this fin seemed to do his work very well. Rockenfeller also had a high speed crash on the main straight, where the fin too seemed to work.


From 2012 and onwards the LMPs have mandatory holes in their wheel arches to reduce pressure buildup.

Seeing the effort the ACO had(successfully) put in, it made me think. Open wheelers surely aren't immune to this instability?

To get more closer to the open wheelers. They have a big issue; the open wheels. wheel-to-wheel collisions are a huge issue that sends cars into the air. Indycar tries to solve this by covering the wheels as much as possible, and the Formula E car has a similar philosophy.

Mark Webber had a big crash in 2010 where he collided into the back of the Lotus


Surely the wings of an F1 car would hold the car to the ground, right? Webber's crash shows the car retaining air for much longer than one would expect, and even does a really cool backflip. And the same has been the case in Konstantin Tereshchenko's crash.

Even though open wheelers obviously take off when hitting a huge bump or another cars wheels, there surely could be done something to make this airtime less of a danger? It has been a hot item in LMPs for years and still is, while there hasn't been anything on it in open wheelers.

[mrluke]

The FE crash, the car is sliding along the floor as the right rear suspension has failed, the sausage kerb acts as a ramp. The GP3 crash at spa is practically identical.

I dont think the GP3 car flies particularly, its just that it is going very fast and it is very light.

However the Audi lemans incident is more a demonstration of why gravel traps dont work, if there had been a large sausage kerb in the path of the audi it would also have flown through the air.

Finally Webbers impressive hang time is the result of the large flat floor, if you had large holes in the floor it would improve the situation but would expect the teams to be very reluctant to do this.

[countersteer]

and the lip of the kitty litter if things aren't properly graded ...



I remember this because Gil deFerran was the head of the Driver's organization and went to supervise, personally, the grading of the runoff area after this incident.

(edited to correct the embedded video, 3 times, lol...)

[Andres125sx]

Fully agree with the article

To me it´s amazing they´re using these sausages, there are plenty better options and as the article states, it´s just a matter of time before we see some tragedy due to this kerbs

Actually Heidfeld crash at FE was really close, I wonder what was the distance between his helmet and the wall when he crashed. If the car would have rolled a bit more before the impact.....


To me the best option would be a kerb similar to current ones, they´re flat at the part closer to the track, and the step between them is deeper as you go to the inside. Just continue this tendency until they´re as deep as speed bumps. If someone go too much to the inside he´ll loose traction and will slide or spin, or could even break suspension. Now go to the inside all you want

[wgknestrick]

Remove the curbs and replace them with small, 24" square pools of .5in deep water that run around the perimeter of the track. Have at it that gents. That will keep them on track, punish those who can't, and still be relatively safe as they skid slightly off track and slow down on the paved, high grip, run off areas.

The problem with the current curbs are that they don't slow them down enough to keep the drivers from "using them" AND also have a geometry that can launch cars airborne.

Curb design cannot have any significant "Z height" or bump element to it. It must be all about loss of frictional forces IMO.

[Andres125sx]

Remove the curbs and replace them with small, 24" square pools of .5in deep water that run around the perimeter of the track. Have at it that gents. That will keep them on track, punish those who can't...

And the cars behind him as he will wet the tarmac