2014/15 Silly Season

[CBeck113]

What if it was Ferrari and not Alonso or McLaren that was hampering Fred's move to McLaren, in case they do go to three car teams next year...Rai, Alo & Vet...that would be a very expensive set of drivers with a [most likely] slim chance to win the title. But I'd like to see it!

[ScottB]

I don't see why LdM would be going round saying he released Alonso from his contract, certainly without Alonso or Ferrari rebuking him, if it hadn't happened.

Also, has been pointed out many times, IF 3 cars happen, as things stand the 3rd cars are non scoring. Ferrari aren't going to spend a fortune to have one of Alonso, Kimi and Vettel run around not scoring, nor would one of them be up for that!

[bauc]

As the situation is at the moment with Catherham F1 at the brink of total collapse, we are getting closer & closer to three cars per team next year so imagine this trio in a Mclaren team: ALONSO, VETTEL & BUTTON with K-MAG reserve driver ..... Silly season goes on!

[MOWOG]

Seeing as everything in this thread is mere conjecture, it is my opinion that if Alonso and Vettet were in identical cars, Fernando would manhandle Seb just as he has Kimi.

Now, don't feel the need to reply with indignant posts formulated while smoke is coming out of your ears. That's my opinion and worth precisely what you paid for it.

My only conclusion from the lack of any formal announcements from Ferrari, Vettel, McLaren, Alonso, Magnuson and/or Button is that tectonic shifts in the structure of the sport going on in the background at the moment. We may well see a sport that is structured entirely differently than we are accustomed to in 2015.

That also is an opinion valued at precisely what is cost you. If you have a different opinion, good for you!

[turbof1]

Silly season people. The topic isn't about which driver will castrate his future teammate and who doesn't. I'll remove the non-conforming posts.

[JimClarkFan]

Kind of surprised people are still talking about this, not only has it been extremely tedious the last few weeks, the potential moves are now obvious.

[xDama]

https://soundcloud.com/sidepodcast/aside66

Starting from 36:20 there's a nice opnion on the Alonso-situation. Loved this part:
- Ron Dennis: well Fernando, you owe me 100 million, where do we start from here?.

[Alexgtt]

Any move to three cars surely relies on Bernie giving up more funds for the teams to finance it. I can't see it happening but if it does the teams must already know so that provisions and personnel can be available. If that's the case no wonder the drivers market/silly season is still in such flow this late in the season. Forget Ferrari and McLaren............who would be in the 3rd seat at Merc? Is that why Alonso was trying to throw the scent off with his no Merc power comment? Could we dare to think Ham/Ros/Alonso at Merc? God help Wolff if so!

[Manoah2u]

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/2016- ... -the-works

2016 Audi F1 program with Alonso rumored to be in the works


Insiders at Audi have stated that the marque may ditch endurance racing and join the ranks of Formula One.

According to Auto Express, the Formula One Silly Season just got a lot more interesting. Audi, which has enjoyed a stranglehold on Le Mans for nearly 15 years, may be abandoning their successful endurance racing and touring car programs in favor of Formula One.

That is the claim of unnamed insiders at Audi and its parent company, the Volkswagen Group. There has been a lot of pressure from Volkswagen for Audi to pull out of the WEC, stepping aside for their cousins at Porsche. They will unite their WEC and DTM budgets, and they may also have support from Red Bull to assist them in their new venture, according to the report.

Alonso and Domenicali's involvement

It is believed that they have been in talks with two-time Formula One World Champion Fernando Alonso. That news jells well with everything we've been hearing thus far. The McLaren deal is at a stand-still because Alonso is apparently keen on a one-year contract. We then learned that he may be joining Audi at Le Mans in 2015 before making his F1 return with an unspecified team come 2016.

Also, in the midst of an potential racing lull, the Spaniard seems unusually confident.

Let us not forget that Audi recently hired former Ferrari Formula One team principal Stefano Domenicali, who has no experience in Le Mans-level sports car racing.

Audi in Formula One would also reignite a 75-year-old rivalry with fellow German automobile giant Mercedes, which is currently doing in Formula One what Audi has been doing at Le Mans for some time now ... Dominating.

Could we be in for a clash of the titans in 2016? Audi joining F1 has been anticipated almost as much as the incessant pleas that Ferrari would develop a new LMP1 program.

Hmmmm i can see this happen, to be honest.

Alonso indeed is 'overly' confident for somebody seemingly in the high risk of having no F1 seat for 2015, since the Mclaren deal remains nothing more then 'rumours'. Same goes for the supposed 'Honda contract' Alonso is having - is there any evidence Alonso actually signed with Honda? I can't remember reading any Honda statement regarding an agreement between Alonso and Honda.......

It's obvious Alonso and the new Ferrari management isn't a 'fruitful' relationship, or, lets just say the relationship 'doesn't work'. Doesn't matter whose responsibility, it doesnt work. Alonso leaving f1 is as good as 100% certain if you reason with the facts. After that, everything is open - even Vettel's direction, people seem to think there is no doubt he'll be heading to Ferrari, which does seem logical, BUT, we seem to forget fast;

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/3156 ... eculation/

Vettel coy over McLaren speculation

McLaren is pushing to secure the best possible driver partnership ahead of its Honda reunion next season, with reigning World Champion Vettel and Ferrari's Fernando Alonso believed to have been contacted by the team.

"There has been a lot of talk," said Vettel. "In Spa I heard I had signed for $150 million for three years. I was asking where the pen was but nobody came back to me!"

Mclaren wants a partnership for 3 years.......Alonso doesnt'......who's going where?

Regarding Alonso though,

In any case, the Alonso-Domenicali relationship DID work. Despite the fact Alonso with Ferrari did not achieve a title, they came damn close to it several times. If Alonso wasn't held up (or just had overtaken) by Petrov a couple of years ago, chances were he could have had that Ferrari title.

On one side you may say; Ferrari and Domenicali didn't work, on the other side, despite arguing the 'praise' for Ferrari bagging the 2008 constructors title is more to Jean Todt rather than newly appointed Domenicali, the fact remains, under Domenicali they've had a Constructor title and nearly a 2012 driver Title.

And again, the Domenicali-Alonso combo seemed to be very harmonical. Now what makes this even more interesting, is when I stumbled upon this statement when i was searching wikipedia for domenicali's reign at Ferrari:

Domenicali resigned as Ferrari team principal in April 2014.[7]

As of October 2014, Stefano has been hired by Audi,[8] and is rumored to be spearheading their Formula One entry in 2016

which got me started thinking.....April 2014, huh.

At which point this year did Alonso's dis-satisfaction with Ferrari seemed to pop up more and more?
I did remember this little 'report' which surely Mattiachi didn't really enjoy

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/formula1/27096591

Fernando Alonso dedicates podium to former boss

He dedicated his third place in China to former boss Stefano Domenicali, who resigned after Ferrari drivers were ninth and 10th in the last race.

"Obviously this podium is dedicated to him in a way because probably all the parts from now until July or August are coming from the team working under Stefano."

Could it also be a sign?

http://www.grandprix247.com/2014/10/16/ ... so-follow/

Alonso’s next stop is not known, but when he visited the fabled 24 hour Le Mans race in June, he stopped by the Audi garage before waving the start flag for this year’s edition of the race.

“It’s a very attractive category for sure,” said Alonso before officially starting the 2014 edition in June. “Definitely I will race here.”

“Maybe he [Alonso] will leave Formula 1, take a break. This year he went to see his friend Mark Webber at Le Mans — it is obviously a race that fascinates him.”

Alonso stated he won't be driving a Mercedes-powered car next year....
He also stated answering whether he'll be driving for Mclaren next year is "difficult to answer".
"I have decided for 2 or 3 months now what I am going to do"
"I want to win again and become champion, and work with a professional team and be happy"
"All those things point me in a certain direction and probably is the cause of the shift you are seeing now"
"When you know all the options, you'll say "offcourse you were going to do that".

So, some summarisations;

Alonso really wants to race at Le Mans/endurance, something he intends to do AFTER his F1 career, and he first wants his 3rd WDC title BEFORE retiring from F1.
Alonso has stated he has several options (he is showing a genuine confidence and happiness) and is in a privilidged position, and wants to do the best he can for Ferrari.

Now what If Alonso is going to race @ the Joest Audi Le Mans team for 2015, where Dominicali has joined - he'll have fun there for a year. He'll get aquainted with the Audi team and perhaps engine, and return to F1 in 2016 with Domenicali and Audi......

If it's true that Alonso wants a one-year deal only at Mclaren, then it might be that he has decided to go with the Audi team in 2016 either way (who knows just how much $$ Audi is intending to spend on a F1 adventure).

It would explain Alonso's desire for a one-year contract only, having the option of driving for Mclaren or Le Mans.

The paddock rumour is said that Alonso's F1 contract has been 'released' @ Suzuka at thursday. I don't know the genuine truth behind it, neither do we know the truth behind 'Screaming, doors slamming' on a talk between Alonso and Mattiachi (or was it the new Ferrari president?). Remember, Alonso actually IS/WAS signed for Ferrari for 2015.

It might just be however that Alonso stated his plans to Ferrari, not for 2015, but for 2016 - and that the new Ferrari management doesn't agree or like Alonso's plans, and thus wants to unbind his contract for 2015. Perhaps Alonso genuinly intended to driver for Ferrari in 2015, hoping to 'finish' his stint with them by securing a 3rd WDC title with Ferrari.
It's still not impossible, but would be a far reach imho.

The possible Mclaren deal sounded dubious from the start regarding Alonso's clear 'beef' with Ron Dennis (remember Alonso's blocking Hamilton?). Now, Mclaren deal might not happen because of Alonso's desire for a one-year only run, whilst they want a 3-year deal.

Despite the sound of Alonso @ Mclaren-Honda seems like a logical deal for Alonso,
the sound of Alonso @ Audi F1 in 2016 does sound interesting.....Audi has intended to enter F1 for several years and a clear path is being constructed as we speak. Furthermore, if Audi enters, i'd reckon they plan for 1 thing only: Beating Mercedes, and i'd say Audi is willing to spend enough $$ to guarantee they're in a position to actually WIN the championship, and Audi certainly would be seeking arguably the BEST driver available - and guess what, Alonso might be the best driver available -, and also looking for somebody with experience in 'leading the team', preferably somebody who can work together well with the best driver available......and who would that be? Stefano Domenicali does fit the description, whom just signed with Audi.......

I'll call it: Fernando Alonso @ Audi F1 team 2016.

[CjC]

Great post Manoah2u! Some interesting thoughts, I enjoyed the read!
BUT
regardless of whether Audi buy an existing team or start up afresh with a new team, there is no they they'd win any title before 2020, especially if they start in 2016. How old will Alonso be then? Too old! By then there will be another 'cream if the crop' driver line up, there will be a new Hamilton, Alonso and Vettel that Audi will want to drive for them.

Just my thoughts.

[Manoah2u]

Great post Manoah2u! Some interesting thoughts, I enjoyed the read!
BUT
regardless of whether Audi buy an existing team or start up afresh with a new team, there is no they they'd win any title before 2020, especially if they start in 2016. How old will Alonso be then? Too old! By then there will be another 'cream if the crop' driver line up, there will be a new Hamilton, Alonso and Vettel that Audi will want to drive for them.

Just my thoughts.

thought crossed my mind, but, if Audi has been focusing on this project 'in the background' for some time, then that might change things. I've read about how Audi is shifting it's attention from Le Mans to Formula 1 because of Porsche. Porsche has become under threat from Audi's Le Mans wins, possibly losing out to their own amount of Nr 1 Le mans winner status.
In short, VW Ag owns porsche, BUT, the Porsche Pfiech family OWNS VW AG.
And guess what thy've done? Porsche back in Le Mans.

That goes back to last year already, and early this year, with Mark Webber driving for Porsche etc etc. In the meanwhile, Audi could have been focussing on F1 without mentioning it for a while. So while one might assume Audi is going to 'start' their F1 project in 2015/2016, they might have been focussing on it for a while.
In fact, they hardly need to 'start' a new team from scratch.

They could buy Toro Rosso. That's a team with a great infrastructure, has good results, and has been the subject of many possible 'buys' in the past. So Audi could just 'buy Toro Rosso' and rename it.
Could do the same with struggling Sauber, they have many benefits, their windtunnel f.e. is great, Hinwil and Ingolstadt aren't that far apart. Audi actually used Sauber's windtunnel for their LMP1 project, which worked out great for them.

So if Audi indeed is going for a 2016 F1 entry, i'd say they'd probably buy into the Sauber team. The Kaltenborg-run isn't working, they are spiraling down a sponserless road and result-less road, where it becomes harder and harder to be able to perform. If i remember correctly, they haven't paid or partially paid for their Ferrari engines. So finances are an issue.
I think peter sauber has reached a point where he wouldn't care much about sauber changing it's name completely.
Sauber seems like a fair dude so i'd expect him to want a guarantee on his personell to maintain in business.

So a Audi buyover of sauber and the entire hinwil base, a name change to Audi F1 Team, with Fernando Alonso and a german driver at his side - i'd say Nico Hulkenberg, and there you go!

The remark that RedBull would even support them could be a hint they'd favour buying Toro Rosso's team though.

[Sasha]

With two teams not going to the USGP,it looks like the top teams next year will have to run three cars.So what is that going to do to the driver rumors?It will not happen this year because the rules state the teams get a 60 day notice to field a third car.

[ScottB]

With two teams not going to the USGP,it looks like the top teams next year will have to run three cars.So what is that going to do to the driver rumors?It will not happen this year because the rules state the teams get a 60 day notice to field a third car.

There's no guarantee of third cars, indeed the only statements that have come from people of influence have been to say they won't happen.

But if they do, the rules appear to be that teams will be asked to field a 3rd car, but they can decline if they can't afford it. Third cars will be non scoring, so hopefully we can avoid anymore 'OMG Ferrari will have Alonso, Kimi and Vettel!!!!' posts...

[Manoah2u]

I genuinly don't think there will be 3-car teams ever. I have been mistaken on the double-points issue though, so i might be wrong here.

however, 2015 is too short notice for 3-team cars to appear. FIA even confirmed this.

In 2016, HAAS F1 team will join, and there is the sound rumour of Forza Rossa. that would mean 2 new entries.
Lose 2, gain 2. Result? no 3-car teams.

For all that matters, Caterham and Marussia might be on the 2015 grid under new leadership or different names.

So i'm still highly doubtfull on the 3-car teams.

[Moose]

I genuinly don't think there will be 3-car teams ever. I have been mistaken on the double-points issue though, so i might be wrong here.

however, 2015 is too short notice for 3-team cars to appear. FIA even confirmed this.

In 2016, HAAS F1 team will join, and there is the sound rumour of Forza Rossa. that would mean 2 new entries.
Lose 2, gain 2. Result? no 3-car teams.

For all that matters, Caterham and Marussia might be on the 2015 grid under new leadership or different names.

Marussia will for sure be back, unless Sauber can pull a 9th place out of the bag. They're in line for $90m from the FIA this year, compared to $30m last year.