Negativity and Haterism trend....

[Andres125sx]

We´ll see, but I think Rosberg was very lucky with Hamilton car´s problems. If they start the seasson with same luck, I´d bet for Hamilton hands down, don´t see Rosberg fighting for too many GPs

[Moose]

We´ll see, but I think Rosberg was very lucky with Hamilton car´s problems. If they start the seasson with same luck, I´d bet for Hamilton hands down, don´t see Rosberg fighting for too many GPs

Yep, the season result shows us how far ahead Hamilton really was. Once they were both level pegging in terms of car failures (3 each) at the end of the season, Hamilton was the best part of 70 points ahead, and that doesn't even take into account Hamilton's qualifying car failures.

[turbof1]

We´ll see, but I think Rosberg was very lucky with Hamilton car´s problems. If they start the seasson with same luck, I´d bet for Hamilton hands down, don´t see Rosberg fighting for too many GPs

I personally think Rosberg will come back stronger. He has the speed to make Hamilton's life miserable, it's a matter of getting it out.

[dans79]

We´ll see, but I think Rosberg was very lucky with Hamilton car´s problems. If they start the seasson with same luck, I´d bet for Hamilton hands down, don´t see Rosberg fighting for too many GPs

I personally think Rosberg will come back stronger. He has the speed to make Hamilton's life miserable, it's a matter of getting it out.

While he is great at working with his engineers to squeeze a near perfect lap out of the car in qualifying, this works against him in the race. Instead of feeling what the car is doing from one lap to the next, he is to busy analyzing and flipping switches. I think this is why the win count is so heavily in Lewis's favor.

[Pierce89]

The one thing that's really irritated me about f1 for the past 5 or so years is that its gotten to the point that money now dictates success more than engineering or driving talent. Merc simply spent way more money than everyone else, before that, Redbull spent the most and before that Ferrari spent the most(Toyota was close). I see a pattern. Previously, a brilliant young mind could beat money, but no longer. Hell, the regs design the cars, teams just optimize them. I bet JerseyTom gets more stimulus in Nascar than any of the current f1 engineers.

[Pierce89]

We´ll see, but I think Rosberg was very lucky with Hamilton car´s problems. If they start the seasson with same luck, I´d bet for Hamilton hands down, don´t see Rosberg fighting for too many GPs

Yeah Rosberg got super lucky in Singapore,Austria,Abu Dhabi etc. The simple fact is Rosberg is right there with Lew, but without that last TINY bit. Lewis won, but his fans seem disappointed that he didn't beat Rosberg worse. I dont get it. I guess they still believe Lewis is another Senna

[TAG]

WDC... only Hamilton car problems provided some excitement, but on track there was no battle at all, Lewis crushed Nico on every GP they both had their cars ok

He didn't crush him.

Ok I did exagerate, agree, and also agree Nico performed surprisingly well on qualifying beating the best on saturdays for most people more often than anyone would have expected.

But on sundays Lewis beated Nico consistently. Well, he´s Hamilton, you know he will never be as consistent as Alonso , but even with his problems (not refering to his car) he´s been much better than Rosberg


Maybe I was too confident with Lewis, but once the car problems dissapeared I didn´t have any doubt about the outcome

This is an interesting discussion but once you take out the bias and look at what was going on during the weekends. It's clear that Hamilton changed his focus mid way through the season (after the Spa debacle) focusing all of the efforts on Sunday race pace knowing fully well that Nico would go for a faster qualy set up in order to gain the upper hand. Lewis banked every race of the season post Spa on his ability to overtake his teammate, on 14 occasions both Lewis and Nico saw the finish on race day, Rosberg finished ahead of Lewis only 4 times. Add to the fact that on two occasions Lewis started out of the front row where he could have been. Doesn't take much convincing given the number that were it not for the spin in Brazil, Nico would have been shut out after the Spa incident.

[Moose]

We´ll see, but I think Rosberg was very lucky with Hamilton car´s problems. If they start the seasson with same luck, I´d bet for Hamilton hands down, don´t see Rosberg fighting for too many GPs

Yeah Rosberg got super lucky in Singapore,Austria,Abu Dhabi etc. The simple fact is Rosberg is right there with Lew, but without that last TINY bit. Lewis won, but his fans seem disappointed that he didn't beat Rosberg worse. I dont get it. I guess they still believe Lewis is another Senna

He's not right there with Lewis though - he's near enough 3 race wins (with retirements) behind Lewis in the points. Or, to put it another way, if you assume both cars finish, he's 10 race wins behind Lewis in the points.

People seem to forget how far in the lead Lewis was, because the number of retirements only evened up in the final race.

[Sulman]

The one thing that's really irritated me about f1 for the past 5 or so years is that its gotten to the point that money now dictates success more than engineering or driving talent. Merc simply spent way more money than everyone else, before that, Redbull spent the most and before that Ferrari spent the most(Toyota was close). I see a pattern. Previously, a brilliant young mind could beat money, but no longer. Hell, the regs design the cars, teams just optimize them. I bet JerseyTom gets more stimulus in Nascar than any of the current f1 engineers.

You have to spend it the right way, still.

Ferrari's budget is and always has been at the top of the pile, but they are prone to organisational struggles. The Todt/Brawn/Byrne/Schumacher era was something special. Toyota and BMW spent a pile of dosh, and they came and went. I don't recall a source for this, but I gather Schumacher took a pay cut to to go to Mercedes? I don't think the operation was being run on the sort of money F1 had been spending before.

Money is one thing, but it's no good without solid management and engineering.

[Jonnycraig]

I personally think it's around the same over one year. The rivalry between Senna and Prost of course lasted several years. Let's see how that goes with Hamilton and Rosberg. But I think that started as good as how the rivalry between Prost and Senna started.

But the most important difference is that neither Mercedes is a patch on either Prost or Senna. In my personal opinion of course.

It's more Mansell v Patrese than Prost v Senna, again in my opinion.

[iotar__]

How about for once person making outrageous claims was forced to back it up with something even slightly resembling reality using facts from material world and not internet alternative reality from his/hers own head? Who won Silverstone head to head? Who won Canada? "I don't like the result so let's exclude them"? "Crushed" goes straight into garbage can, BTW bloke claiming that gets 2 internet points for this drivel, brilliant . Let's see head to head overall:

Australia - impossible to say
Malaysia - Ham
China - impossible to say
Bahrain - impossible to say - not head to head because of strategy, safety car
Barcelona - impossible to say - not head to head because of strategy
Monaco - Rosb
Canada - Rosb, car problems identical different handling by drivers, brake bias change around pitstop
Austria - Rosb
Silverstone - Rosberg, qualifying, start lead after 1st pitstop, other option impossible to say, you might say strategy was similar in Barcelona but since it's about made up "head-to-head": Barcelona was close for the whole first stint and close towards the end so it was head to head ruined by strategy, unlike Silverstone which was not close enough 3 s at the first stop. Simple definition: it has to be close to be head to head.
Hungary - impossible to say, not head to head at all with safety cars, car problems and strategy
Germany - impossible to say, car problems
Spa - ? figure this one out yourself, car problems in Q, Ham won the start, Rosberg closed quickly and overtook Hamilton "head to head" so it surely goes to Rosberg, or does it? They were both at fault in this collision, Rosberg more but still both. Unlike Bahrain when it was 100% Hamilton's fault with the chop. Car problem? No, drivers problem.
Monza - car problems so it doesn't count, Ham
Singapore - impossible to say
Japan - Ham
Russia - Ham
USA - Ham
Brazil - Rosb
Abu Dhabi - impossible to say, would have been similar to Silverstone but the difference is qualifying and smaller gap, no head to head in GB sorry to say that , this head to head is tricky. So again why invent selective criteria, why for example Rosberg's Germany win should be excluded from drivers comparison?

Qualifying head to head (separately or add to races, guess which driver would benefit from it):
- Rosb: Canada, Japan, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Brazil, USA, Monaco, Austria, Great Britain
- Ham: Australia, Malaysia, China, Russia, Singapore, Spain
- no contest: Spa, Hungary, Germany, Monza - , don't even start with Monza, no P3 = no chance in qualifying
That's 9-6, considering 50% of Hamilton's were rainy, even more pity about Hungary, Germany and Monza. So the only driver "crushed" was Hamilton in qualifying: 3 wet races in the beginning of the season and between May and November it's only Spain, 0,007 in Singapore and Russia with long gaps between them. On the other hand Rosberg had 4 and 5 in a row. Imagine if it was the other way round: "OMG crushed", "untouchable natural speed" etc. Not to mention whining about current impure F1 where faster driver doesn't win because of tyres, fuel, evil DRS and tarmac run-offs, which leads us back to unhealthy, baseless nostalgia, the main topic of this weird thread.

[Moose]

Lets do that in a slightly less biased way now...

Australia - impossible to say
Malaysia - Ham
China - Ham (no idea why you claimed this was impossible to say, was it because the race finished 2 laps early?)
Bahrain - Ham (the safety car only benefited Rosberg)
Barcelona - Ham (again, no idea why you claimed it was impossible to say - hamilton won an on track battle)
Monaco - Ros
Canada - Ham (he passed Rosberg on track, and then suffered a more severe failure due to being in hot air for longer)
Austria - impossible to say (they never actually got to fighting), though Hamilton was certainly faster in the race
Silverstone - impossible to say
Hungary - impossible to say
Germany - impossible to say (though once again, Hamilton gained all through the race)
Spa - impossible to say Rosberg did not overtake Hamilton at any point.
Monza - Ham (what car problems are you talking about - Ros just outbraked himself repeatedly)
Singapore - impossible to say
Japan - Ham
Russia - Ham
USA - Ham
Brazil - Impossible to say due to botched strategy
Abu Dhabi - Ham had already won the battle before Ros's car failed.

That's 10-1 to Ham.

[Richard]

Oh dear, we know when people resort to discussing luck that rational thought has departed. It's just fanboy blather about who crushed who with a runcible spoon as they raced in the light of the moon.

Now forgive me if I'm wrong, but I thought the aim of the competition was to accumulate the most points? The chequered flag doesn't lie.

[dans79]

Oh dear, we know when people resort to discussing luck that rational thought has departed. It's just fanboy blather about who crushed who with a runcible spoon as they raced in the light of the moon.

Now forgive me if I'm wrong, but I thought the aim of the competition was to accumulate the most points? The chequered flag doesn't lie.

I think the problem is some fans care more about saving face than the actual drivers do.

[strad]

Why can't we ever have a discussion that is not predicated on fanboyism?