Speeding: Not sexy at all!

[Belatti]

1) I apologise if I cause any offence, I just was writting my opinions, so please SORRY!

2) checkered, your post is a master piece of posts!!!

3) I thought that in europe or in the U.S. you could get a 1980 Ferrari 208 or a 1985 Porsche 911 for 30K, or even other powerful "from factory tunned" sport car (BMW, Mercedes) for that price, wich I consider that any average wage can buy with just some little effort

4) Do what you want! at last, beyond this forum, you can go and kill people or yourself with a colorlful and full of spoilers 350HP WV Golf

[enkidu]

First of all when you have 125k mortgage and earn 30k a year a 30k car is not possible.....

The other comments in the above post, what a load of nonsense... Come out in the car with me and I will show you how I use the whole road like its a track....... Yes I only do this late at night when its empty....

I put all of my 300bhp to use on public roads I put all of the power down and I drive to the limit.... I also have had track experience i've even taken it round the ring in germany so I know what im talking about.

I've got 6 years no claims on my insurance so im not a bad driver and my skill level and car control is higher than most other road users simply because of my on limit handling, feeling and control of the car. So if a situation happens in rain etc with normal driving I know exactly what the car is doing under me and I can tell you most dont have a clue... Most wouldn't even know about steering into the slide or be able to correct it before it happens... Im not saying im Jenson Button and I drive within MY LIMITS which I know and have learn't from in my younger days.

[johny]

road driving we must go far above the limits

[Tom]

I've got 6 years no claims on my insurance so im not a bad driver and my skill level and car control is higher than most other road users simply because of my on limit handling, feeling and control of the car. So if a situation happens in rain etc with normal driving I know exactly what the car is doing under me and I can tell you most dont have a clue... Most wouldn't even know about steering into the slide or be able to correct it before it happens... Im not saying im Jenson Button and I drive within MY LIMITS which I know and have learn't from in my younger days.

I knew someone who talked like that. Last year he put his girlfriend in a coma.

I would never admit I'm a good driver, I've had to suffer my performance dropping rapidly since I passed my test and I'm taking extra lessons as soon as I can afford them, but i still don't expect that to make me a good driver, not even an average one. I've been autotesting and rallying off the road and I'll tell you know, going fast on the track is a piece of piss compared to driving well on the road. I've had hairy moments on the track and I thought hard about them, analysed what I did wrong and hopefully learnt from them. On the track, even a rally, crashes are hard but rarely as serious as they look.

On the road people get negligent, think they're in control and then a kid steps out. That's when the guy who's been to the track and considers himself a good driver is going 45 in a 30 zone and has no chance.

btw, have you ever been in a slide? I mean a proper one which caught you by surprise? you certainly don't have time to counter steer before the slide, you barely have chance to turn the wheel before the back overtakes you!

[Carlos]

Your right Tom. Sooner or later someone steps off a curb ... a child darts into traffic ... a bicycle turns wide ... another car makes a tight left across your path ... some driver is drunk and hasn't turned on their headlights - and if you are refining your oversteer slide technique ... or just cornering 10 or 15 clicks above the limit. Someone gets killed of crippled.

It's just a matter of time; maybe a matter of decades. We may be driving well, but may need a reserve of technique or attention to compensate for the actions of others that share public roads with us.

With a 125K mortgage and responsibilities ... maybe a wife and child ... perhaps a little caution is not a bad thing ... everyone has an opinion ... me, enkidu, johny, Belatti Tom and others. I'm with Tom and Bellati on this issue. I've seen a lot in the 39 years I have driven.

Almost every town has a car club that sets up autocross courses. Not a bad way to extend your technique and skills. Have some fun. They call it autosolo in England.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autocross

I think some car modifications can be a good thing. When it's time to replace factory installed tires and shocks & exhaust systems ... perhaps even an after market ECU. Less restrictive air filtration. Stock body panels without add-ons. Thats about as far as I would go.

[checkered]

Enkidu, with all that

effort and investment, you'd propably have fun on the track.

What does it add to the experience of driving fast, doing so on public roads? Surely, if it's "perfectly safe" you'd get just as huge a kick of driving within the speed limits, being just as "perfectly safe"? A simple question or two, ones that I haven't thought of asking before when the opportunity has presented itself. Originally, I had half a mind to just go ahead and rip your latest post apart as best I could. But honestly, I'm here to exchange ideas, not to assume the moral high ground or purposefully "educate" people of things that appear self-evident in my own little World.

Maybe my change of heart was down to one of the more horrific negotiating experiences I've had to go through earlier today. Thoroughly suspicious people (as in towards us, for starters), with no apparent intention to shed any light on their logic for the benefit of anything really, evidently taking no interest in what (even generally speaking) the motivation behind having talks is about. So currently I'm a bit at my wits end and in no mood to be confrontational as a matter of my own choice.

I'll just have to keep my eyes peeled on the road, so thanks for the heads up, I guess.

[DaveKillens]

Just what makes a good driver? Hand - eye coordination, experience, and motor skills? Or attitude?

It's interesting to note that in a study, people who buckled their seat belt have a lower accident rate than those who choose not to wear a belt. Maybe having the maturity and intelligence to recognize that anyone, anytime could be caught out in an accident makes a person stay within the limits of performance.

The most important part of being a safe and "good" driver is attitude.

[West]

I've said it before... modifying cars is a hobby; just an expensive one.

As for my driving skills... I learned a lot from Jim Hall Karting School. However, I don't go cutting people off in traffic, or race people, regardless how empty the street is. I always use my turn signal and I always give right of way. However, I have made poor judgement in the past... I am pretty lucky to escape some accidents or other. Everytime I go out to Elfin Forest Road (in San Diego) to the dealership... it begs me to challenge it. It's the equivalent of a rally stage if you haven't googled it by now.

Anyway... I'm not into the ricer scene and all those big wings, wheels and lights... I'm sticking to performance first. Hopefully by the end of the year I will start taking my car to the track. A buddy of mine autocrosses his EVO9, and we were the fastest at Jim Hall one weekend (by a considerable margin), so we both have a good idea of what to expect and learn from our driving.

BTW Tom; I've had the back end come loose once. Didn't know anything about car physics and braked really hard as the rear end was getting light. I had to countersteer for nearly 10 sec (w/ a friend too) on both sides of the road to get the car to go straight. Luckily, no one was around and I didn't touch a curb. Only other times I've really lost it was at Moran in my friend's shifter - first time I ever drove one; it was too powerful for me at the time and his setup was really shitty.

[Belatti]

For me its simply like this:

You can transform your car to whatever you want and you are free, but:

1) Do not speed in public roads if you respect other people
2) You are not Ayrton Senna and you are not always in a high level of concentration like in a racetrack, when you drive in a public road
3) Your tunned car may not have the security steel cage (please help me with this, I dont know the english name!) that will prevent your car turning into a meatball if you turnover
4) I´m shure you dont use a helmet in public roads, and HANS neither
5) The ambulance will not come in 2 minutes like in a race track
6) In public roads there aren´t yellow flags, other cars offenly hit cars that had already crush, and there aren´t red/yellow flags, some oil maybe in the tarmac and you´ll never notice until its too late...
7) A front blown tyre doing 100mph with no barriers or scape vias, with columns near the road and you are already dead
[Carlos quote]Your right Tom. Sooner or later someone steps off a curb ... a child darts into traffic ... a bicycle turns wide ... another car makes a tight left across your path ... some driver is drunk and hasn't turned on their headlights -[/quote]

PD: go have fun in a race track or 1/4 mile track!

[Militia Est Vita]

I'm also on the side of trying to drive safely on the streets as much as I can. I considere myself a not so bad average driver wich has faced a couple of situations where having some basic knowledge of counter-steer and stuff like that has avoided me to have bad experiences. I'm really passionate about cars, speed as much as everybody else in this forum is I'm sure, but I'm also of the opinion that any racing-like experience/skills you might posses shoudl be used to avoid accidents and help you out of trouble if necessary when driving in public roads, but not for actually street racing or speeding since as many here agree, can be hazardous for you, companions or people who are just driving home.
I raced Rotax karts for a few months and truly the basic racing principles tought there helped me a lot, and most important, I got to full trhotle in a safe environment with much less risk even if you crash with the tire barriers. After I left the track I didn't feel the 'need for speed' on the streets

[Tom]

So we all promise to drive safe and within the limits then? Still not garanteed to save you but its a start.

West, the first time the back came out on me properly I did exactly the same as you described, over a crest on a single lane gravel rally track and braked, locked the rears and I had no chance of saving it. My co-driver is a good driver (but he knows it) and understands car physics well too, he was able to tell me exactly what I did wrong and admitted after the initial mistake, when the back got onto the wet grass, I really couldn't have done anything. Next time I'll know though I hope and take more care.

[enkidu]

First of all I don't agree with people speeding in 30mph areas, I don't agree with people speeding through small villages or large towns. I never ever do and I think my posts came across all wrong....

I dont blast my car 130mph everwhere, be the last of the late brakers when im running my mother to the shops or picking my wife up from work etc.

But when the conditions are good and im in a national speed limit area I often have a little fun with a few good looking corners. Now I don't do this with traffic about, there wont be any children about as its not in a town and its usually late at night. Thats it a little fun then it stops and I go home driving normally. Now people on motorbikes have done this your years and nobody complains about them!!


Its how I get my kicks in life, if I had the money I would be on a track every weekend but I don't have the money to change my pads, fluid and get new tyres after every trip. Thats just the way it it im afraid, there are many many people that are exactly like this. Yes some BOY racers go silly in built up areas and I totally DO not agree with that.

Also just to add, there was a post on another forum when someone raced a Honda NSX on the outskirts of london and it was jenson button. Had pictures and everything...... Also i've heard many F1 drivers state they are missing f1 and are driving fast on normal roads to compensate. So I know some of you completely disagree with it but im afraid people do it and thats that really....

[m3_lover]

ya a Blue NSX I saw that thread a long time ago...it was really neat

[nae]

Now people on motorbikes have done this for years and nobody complains about them!!

I so wish that was true.

people complain
people complain more when you appear to be doing something they dont / wont or cant understand
people complain when your bike / car looks / sounds fast
people complain
people complain when folks younger than themselves seem happy
people complain that there isnt enough wars in the world

speeding IS sexy AND exhilaratingly (well tbf its the apparent control over fear that is sexy. but that would then suggest i condone such)

and even if it wasnt people would complain
ffs people are complaining that the mainstream view to hold is that speeding isnt sexy when in plain reality it gives you a bigger penis (this is true 100%)

people complain regardless

do what ever it is you do but ffs dont complain to me when your caught / banned / jailed . enjoy it whilst you can

[enkidu]

But people complain