Engine power

[Rogue230]

Copied from elsewhere...

11/06/04

FrankF1

Most powerfull F1 engine

Just found on the german rtl.de site the news that BAR-Honda has the most powerfull engine ("BAR stellt PS-Rekord auf"). It should have 925 hp, against Ferarri 915 and BMW 905. The Honda engine should also be the lightest engine (only 89kg!)

I thought that no manufacturer actually publishes the figures of their engines. Does anyone know if this news is true? And second question, what is the ranking (in performance) of the F1-engines?

[Irvingthien]

Two possibilities.Either the information was leaked from the engineers or some die-hard BAR-Honda fans trying to make their team look big.But I would go for the second possibility.Engineers today are so busy the don't even care how much the horsepoer is,the just keep on upgrading and developing.

[Monty]

About the Hp numbers, I've heard that they can calculate (more or less excact) how much Hp an engine boosts trough measuring the RPM of the engine. The measure this acousticly

[bernard]

I've heard that they can calculate (more or less excact) how much Hp an engine boosts trough measuring the RPM of the engine. The measure this acousticly

I thought it was the RPM they measured acoustically. Anyway, since the teams don't give their RPM measures to public, then if the HP was traced through the RPM, it would be rather untrustworthy.

[doc]

Theissen after last race and Ralf yesterday have said that BMW Honda and Ferrari lie on the same level; then the figures from Honda are right (at Imola they had 915 hp, for montreal they have added further 10 hp) because the japanese have no problem to circulate their numbers, but for ferrari and bmw they are totally wrong.
Ferrari's 053 has more power than last year, so 053 should be at least at 920 hp (last year 052 had more than 910 hp); with the new spec for canada (15 hp more) they could have passed the 930, so for sure Honda or BMW haven't the most powerful engines (note that BMW has the same power of 2003,i.e. 920 hp, but i don't know if they have brought more hp's at Montreal); there is only a lot of speculation about Honda, because BAR is thought to be the best challenger to avoid another Ferrari's win, but i think, also looking at the top speeds of this season, that Ferrari has a margin on the engine too, so in canada it will be the same story...

[Monstrobolaxa]

At the begining of the season it was reported that Toyota had the most powerfull engine....but toyota quickly denied it! And said that Williams still had the most powerfull engine! Recently I read that between BMW, Honda and Ferrari there was just a 10hp diference! being BMW the most powerfull and honda the least! But with the results....I'd say BMW isn't the most powerfull! (and I know that the engine isn't eveything in a car)

[walter]

Top speed is a decieving in terms of horsepower. I think it was either last year or the year before that Jordan had the fastest top speed during the Indionapolis F1 race, and I highly doubt that the Ford Cosworth engine was ever the most powerfull in the past several years.

About the Horsepower-RPM-acoustics relationship... not true at least not yet. the acoustics measurements are used to determine the number of piston powerstrokes per given time, No correlation to horsepower unless exact numbers are known at a given RPM along with the relationships ratio. (linear, exponential...)

[Monstrobolaxa]

Even this year Jordan has had some top speeds! but this is only due to the lack of wing they put on the car! The car already has aerodynamic problems...and leck of downforce....so they try to compensate for the lack of competitivness in the slower sectors by trying to increase the time gained in the fast straights.

[walter]

This is true, and just goes to show that Jordan is basically in the same boat as Minardi when it comes to aerodynamic efficiency as well as engine performance. so sad.

[bernard]

Jordan is basically in the same boat as Minardi when it comes to aerodynamic efficiency

What aerodynamic efficiency? minardi has just made it's car produce as little drag as possible, that's all they have done aerodynamic-wise, at least judging by their car. Just look at those side pontones. I bet the guys at ferrari are working over-shift to copy their design.

[Monstrobolaxa]

bernard...walter was being sarcastic!....when it comes to aerodynamic eficiency Minardi is in the same boat as Jordan....they don't have any!

[guest]

so does anybody know how much horsepower the toyota engine has?

thanks

[Guest]

the strongest engine is the ferrari if u look at the topspeeds of this year...

[marcush.]

those Horsepowerdiscussions are really useless.would any sensible man allow himself to believe 10 horses more or less would be of any significance in a car weiging 600 kilos and having 900 horses to start with?
If we speak of Peakhorsepower ,just forget it.The Horses you need to make the Car faster are going up in square for each KMH you want to gain.
So ANY advantage in Trapspeed is a function of:corner exitspeeds/traction
and DRAG of the car.
Ferrari is very good on Aero efficiency and they have a very good engine .
Some Years ago Stewart had always the best trapspeeds running F3 size Wings,but they were nowhere in laptimes.

The thing you are really interested in is the Area under the power curve.
If you are able to increase this area ,this will make you faster around the track,as well as managing to make the engine /car reach the maximum rpm in ashorter timescale(transient power).
If you watched Button compared to Renault dragracing out of the Hairpin in hockenheim it was rather obvious that the Renault was everything but slower .So --- on those 70 horses the Renault is missing on the dyno,if a stronger engine cannot outaccelerate it.

[Reca]

minardi has just made it's car produce as little drag as possible, that's all they have done aerodynamic-wise, at least judging by their car

On what kind of analysis are you basing that ? are you an aerodynamicist ?

I bet the guys at ferrari are working over-shift to copy their design.

Actually you would be surprised to see how many aero solutions (and not only aero actually) first appeared in a Minardi and then were copied by top teams. The latest example are the vertical cuts in the RWEP that Minardi introduced this winter, Renault and Williams copied it.

The Horses you need to make the Car faster are going up in square for each KMH you want to gain

Actually power required growths with the cube of speed but the general concept is the same, the top speed says very little about engine power, especially when the differences are small as they surely are between the top engines.