Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

[Joseki]

http://www.fia.com/file/37632/download?token=nmuz5dKl

Page 46 of the 2016 F1 sporting regulations:

Any manufacturer intending to homologate a new power unit during the 2016-2020 period
must provide the FIA with full details of the power unit on or before 28 February of the year of
homologation. The FIA must be satisfied, at its absolute discretion, that such a power unit
could fairly and equitably be allowed to compete with other homologated power units.
Details of the above power unit must be included in a dossier supplied to the FIA 14 days prior
to the date of homologation. The manufacturer must hold a complete power unit to this
specification in a container sealed by the FIA prior to the 28 February of the year of
homologation.

So, if I've understood correctly, the manufacturers have to send a complete dossier of the 2016 power units... tomorrow. This means Honda will not run different PUs during test session I think.

[jure]

http://www.fia.com/file/37632/download?token=nmuz5dKl

Page 46 of the 2016 F1 sporting regulations:

Any manufacturer intending to homologate a new power unit during the 2016-2020 period
must provide the FIA with full details of the power unit on or before 28 February of the year of
homologation. The FIA must be satisfied, at its absolute discretion, that such a power unit
could fairly and equitably be allowed to compete with other homologated power units.
Details of the above power unit must be included in a dossier supplied to the FIA 14 days prior
to the date of homologation. The manufacturer must hold a complete power unit to this
specification in a container sealed by the FIA prior to the 28 February of the year of
homologation.

So, if I've understood correctly, the manufacturers have to send a complete dossier of the 2016 power units... tomorrow. This means Honda will not run different PUs during test session I think.

I don't see any reason why one couldn't homologate last year's PU and spend some tokens before 1st race. Unless they can homologate completely different power unit to last year's.

[Joseki]

I don't see any reason why one couldn't homologate last year's PU and spend some tokens before 1st race. Unless they can homologate completely different power unit to last year's.

I don't see any reason why one couldn't homologate last year's PU and spend some tokens before 1st race. Unless they can homologate completely different power unit to last year's.

I didn't think about re-homologating the old PU then hologate the 2016 one before Melbourne, but the wording of that article to me means that you must homologate the 2016 PU on 28 February or simply cannot do it later.

[mclaren111]

I agree with -wskt-

The start of the season will be the "basic" PU - with new Turbo, Compressor and MGU-H - and with "solid" developments for the start of the European leg.

No fireworks to be expected at the beginning

[wuzak]

http://www.fia.com/file/37632/download?token=nmuz5dKl

Page 46 of the 2016 F1 sporting regulations:

Any manufacturer intending to homologate a new power unit during the 2016-2020 period
must provide the FIA with full details of the power unit on or before 28 February of the year of
homologation. The FIA must be satisfied, at its absolute discretion, that such a power unit
could fairly and equitably be allowed to compete with other homologated power units.
Details of the above power unit must be included in a dossier supplied to the FIA 14 days prior
to the date of homologation. The manufacturer must hold a complete power unit to this
specification in a container sealed by the FIA prior to the 28 February of the year of
homologation.

So, if I've understood correctly, the manufacturers have to send a complete dossier of the 2016 power units... tomorrow. This means Honda will not run different PUs during test session I think.

I don't see any reason why one couldn't homologate last year's PU and spend some tokens before 1st race. Unless they can homologate completely different power unit to last year's.

Time.

The 2016 concept may be sufficiently different to require a completely new installation. As was the case with Ferrari's 2014 to 2015 PU changes (why Manor used 2014 Ferrari PU). Delaying the changes until after the PU homologation date would mean that McLaren may have to change their chassis significantly during the season.

[jure]

Time.

The 2016 concept may be sufficiently different to require a completely new installation. As was the case with Ferrari's 2014 to 2015 PU changes (why Manor used 2014 Ferrari PU). Delaying the changes until after the PU homologation date would mean that McLaren may have to change their chassis significantly during the season.

As I understand, homologation is all about fia paper work. Mclaren could homologate last year's pu while test (in winter testing) different PU layouts for 2016 (although they should have approx. the same installation requirements). After winter tests are over and Mclaren knows which layout is best they could go to fia and say they want to spend tokens on this and this,... Then they race updated pu from race 1.

How can manufacturer send spec to fia, if they have not yet tested the new PUs on track? They might want to change/redesign things without spending additional tokens. Or maybe they decide to postpone token usage to a later date because of some before undiscovered issues.

[GoranF1]

Remember this sound? Filming day pre 2015 test. 2016 filming day coming soon.



...just something to kill time...

[Vortex37]

All success is equal at HPP (or was in 2014 anyway), whether it was customer of works team getting the podium the bonus was still the same.

Also all of the parts come from a general pool which are then built into engines which go into a pool for race use, the aren't pre-determined as to what teams they are going to. So to make differences to the same engines would be a logistical nightmare.

Ok, I'm not doubting you but I have a source within HPP that says otherwise for 2014.

As to your second paragraph, I guess we will agree to disagree. I have worked and assembled F1 engines and almost all of our parts were pre-determined as to what teams there were going to, down to the block itself. Logistically not very difficult.

@Wazari

It might be wise to also consider that these engines are under total computer control. It is very easy to introduce a small performance inhibitor at many points.

I would also add, that Jonathan Neale of McLaren, said on BBC TV on 2015-05-07(ISO format date) " ....I don't think if we had stayed where we were, with Mercedes, there was a cats chance in hell of us beating them, and you saw it here today, they were dominant. And the customer teams are all very powerful, they are just not going to beat them(Mercedes). Toto is a great guy, Paddy (Lowe) love him to death, love him like a brother, but they are not going to pass on that kind of technology to those teams (customer teams) So you have be an independent. You can see what Ferrari are doing. We've picked and backed with Honda, and were not going to get into a situation where we're tearing out relationship apart with our engine manufacturer, we're going to fight this as a team. That's the only way back to championships, with an independent. (engine manufacturer backed team)......."

[mrluke]

All success is equal at HPP (or was in 2014 anyway), whether it was customer of works team getting the podium the bonus was still the same.

Also all of the parts come from a general pool which are then built into engines which go into a pool for race use, the aren't pre-determined as to what teams they are going to. So to make differences to the same engines would be a logistical nightmare.

Ok, I'm not doubting you but I have a source within HPP that says otherwise for 2014.

As to your second paragraph, I guess we will agree to disagree. I have worked and assembled F1 engines and almost all of our parts were pre-determined as to what teams there were going to, down to the block itself. Logistically not very difficult.

@Wazari

It might be wise to also consider that these engines are under total computer control. It is very easy to introduce a small performance inhibitor at many points.

I would also add, that Jonathan Neale of McLaren, said on BBC TV on 2015-05-07(ISO format date) " ....I don't think if we had stayed where we were, with Mercedes, there was a cats chance in hell of us beating them, and you saw it here today, they were dominant. And the customer teams are all very powerful, they are just not going to beat them(Mercedes). Toto is a great guy, Paddy (Lowe) love him to death, love him like a brother, but they are not going to pass on that kind of technology to those teams (customer teams) So you have be an independent. You can see what Ferrari are doing. We've picked and backed with Honda, and were not going to get into a situation where we're tearing out relationship apart with our engine manufacturer, we're going to fight this as a team. That's the only way back to championships, with an independent. (engine manufacturer backed team)......."

Interview needs to be taken with a pinch a salt, at that point mclaren were justifying the decision they had already made rather than making an independent assessment of the realities of the situation.

[Mclarettino]

How can manufacturer send spec to fia, if they have not yet tested the new PUs on track? They might want to change/redesign things without spending additional tokens. Or maybe they decide to postpone token usage to a later date because of some before undiscovered issues.

This is what annoys me so much. Why can't the FIA have all the paperwork/designs be sent AFTER the 2 pre-season tests have finished, maybe Monday the 7th of March, give them a couple of days to look analyse the data 2nd pre-season test data and finalise the design.

The FIA created many good Technical and Sporting Regulations around the PUs. But there were 4 dreadful ones that makes it hard for PU manufacturers that are either new or need to significantly improve from succeeding:

1. Engine tokens, with the number decreasing each season.
2. Having black and white zones on the PU which decide areas which can/cannot be developed, with the black areas increasing each season.
3. Making PU makers have to submit their final PU designs BEFORE both 2 pre-season tests. (after 0 days of on track testing).
4. Making PU makers have to homologate their PU BEFORE the 2nd pre-season test (after just 4 days of on track testing).

WHY CAN'T BOTH 3. AND 4. BE DONE A FEW DAYS AFTER THE 2ND PRE-SEASON TEST?
And FIA wonder why no new engine manufacturers want to enter the sport?! Talk about creating a needless horse before the cart situation.

Thankfully 1. and 2. were removed. =D>
Now 3. and 4. both need to be changed to be a few days after the 2nd pre-season test.

[haza]

https://twitter.com/McLarenF1/status/69 ... 45601?s=09

honda engine started

[GoranF1]

Amazing sound...926Bhp.....

[mikeerfol]

Amazing sound...926Bhp.....

More speculation?

[hemichromis]

Amazing sound...926Bhp.....

That's the ICE alone!!


They do sound better this year.

[GoranF1]

Amazing sound...926Bhp.....

That's the ICE alone!!

i know....