Aston Martin wants hyper-car to be faster than F1 cars

[SR71]

Given Aston Martin's recent decision to go with Dunlop in the WEC, you've got to wonder if it is a possibility that they'll be the ones supplying the tyres for this hypercar.

Also, surely just by merit of the Veyron's tyres having a tread pattern they won't produce as much grip?

Veyron is a little outdated at this point to reference.

AM/RB have said the car that they intend to keep up with F1 cars will be a track only version with only a handful being produced. Expect to see slicks on it.

[DiogoBrand]

Maybe with your vast knowledge of whatever you think you know about you can tell how they're gonna make a tyre that's usable on the road, even on wet conditions, and yet has more grip than a Formula One slick.

Your argument of "different requirements" that doesn't say what any of those requirements are just shows that your only "vast knowledge" is of using fallacies in your favour.

But I've already promised myself I wouldn't take part on this thread anymore, since everytime I do a little part of my intelligence seems to die. Maybe now I'll keep my promise.

[DiogoBrand]

Given Aston Martin's recent decision to go with Dunlop in the WEC, you've got to wonder if it is a possibility that they'll be the ones supplying the tyres for this hypercar.

Also, surely just by merit of the Veyron's tyres having a tread pattern they won't produce as much grip?

Veyron is a little outdated at this point to reference.

AM/RB have said the car that they intend to keep up with F1 cars will be a track only version with only a handful being produced. Expect to see slicks on it.

Therefore every single argumentless post you made since the beggining of the thread to try and show how a road car can be faster than a Formula One car has been for nothing. What's left for you to try to argue for?

[SR71]

Maybe with your vast knowledge of whatever you think you know about you can tell how they're gonna make a tyre that's usable on the road, even on wet conditions, and yet has more grip than a Formula One slick.

Your argument of "different requirements" that doesn't say what any of those requirements are just shows that your only "vast knowledge" is of using fallacies in your favour.

But I've already promised myself I wouldn't take part on this thread anymore, since everytime I do a little part of my intelligence seems to die. Maybe now I'll keep my promise.

Why does it have to have more grip than an F1 slick? Who said that was a requirement?

If you have 3X the downforce of an F1 car, "grip" might not be at the top of your requirement checklist, you'll have other forces to worry about. Of course you know that being that it's obvious, so not sure why you say the tire has to have more "grip".

Could have equal or less and still be more effective, it's a balancing act of the cars performance properties. Obvious, again, i know.

[Manfer]

The car is going to powered by a Cosworth engine. Watch Salomondrin's latest video. He talks about the car and its design.

[Cannonballer]

Veyron is a little outdated at this point to reference.

AM/RB have said the car that they intend to keep up with F1 cars will be a track only version with only a handful being produced. Expect to see slicks on it.

Therefore every single argumentless post you made since the beggining of the thread to try and show how a road car can be faster than a Formula One car has been for nothing. What's left for you to try to argue for?

IF they choose to have a track specific version thats faster than an F1 car and the road going version is not, doesn't mean a road car cannot be faster than an F1 car.

You get that right?

But it does mean (or at the least make it highly likely)that AM/RB could not build a road car that is as fast an F1 car, otherwise there would be no need for the track only model. The only evidence you have presented to show that a road car can be as fast as an F1 car is the fact that AM/RB were going to build one. ...

[mrluke]

Maybe with your vast knowledge of whatever you think you know about you can tell how they're gonna make a tyre that's usable on the road, even on wet conditions, and yet has more grip than a Formula One slick.

Your argument of "different requirements" that doesn't say what any of those requirements are just shows that your only "vast knowledge" is of using fallacies in your favour.

But I've already promised myself I wouldn't take part on this thread anymore, since everytime I do a little part of my intelligence seems to die. Maybe now I'll keep my promise.

Why does it have to have more grip than an F1 slick? Who said that was a requirement?

If you have 3X the downforce of an F1 car, "grip" might not be at the top of your requirement checklist, you'll have other forces to worry about. Of course you know that being that it's obvious, so not sure why you say the tire has to have more "grip".

Could have equal or less and still be more effective, it's a balancing act of the cars performance properties. Obvious, again, i know.

Remind me again how downforce makes cars faster?

You can have all the downforce in the world but the car is only connected to the road by 4 little bits of rubber.

[mrluke]

Just because a car has downforce does not mean that it can go round corners faster. There is a limit to how much grip the tyre can provide, sure typically this limit increases with downforce but it is still dependent upon just how much you can lean on the tyre.

Your statement that tyre performance can be ignored "because downforce" is quite simply wrong.

[flmkane]

Just because a car has downforce does not mean that it can go round corners faster. There is a limit to how much grip the tyre can provide, sure typically this limit increases with downforce but it is still dependent upon just how much you can lean on the tyre.

Your statement that tyre performance can be ignored "because downforce" is quite simply wrong.

But apparently pointing out where users are flouting the laws of physics deserves personal attacks and down votes.

But that's an interesting thought experiment. How much can you increase downforce, before the gains in grip flatten out, purely due to Tyre load sensitivity?

Edit: hoping Jersey Tom might reply to this.

[cramr]

But that's an interesting thought experiment. How much can you increase downforce, before the gains in grip flatten out, purely due to Tyre load sensitivity?

Edit: hoping Jersey Tom might reply to this.[/quote]

Downforce is the same as applying more load to the tyre without the negative effect of having more mass in the car and it's negative effects in Inertia and so on.

Here you have a plot of tyre lateral force vs tyre load. Usually this information is hard to get and you need to test tyre in Lab in order to get this graphs. I found one online but not sure what kind of tyre is shown here
http://s250.photobucket.com/user/uktrai ... 3.png.html

[No Lotus]

The car is going to powered by a Cosworth engine. Watch Salomondrin's latest video. He talks about the car and its design.

I thought that Newey said it would use a V12, but this article from Racecar Engineering (Jan 2014) may indicate it's a Cosworth inline 4, originally developed for F1.

"According to sources in Cosworth speaking with Racecar Engineering founder Ian Bamsey, now editor of Race Engine Technology magazine, development on both the I4 and V6 has continued as the former is being worked on for an undisclosed high performance road car project ..."
http://www.racecar-engineering.com/news ... ower-unit/

[FoxHound]

So where are we currently...

Its not going to be road legal, nor will it have road going tyres.
Why not just buy a used F1 car for a million dollars and use the 4 million for fuel, spares and renting out a track with an engineer for the day.

[rjsa]

So where are we currently...

Its not going to be road legal, nor will it have road going tyres.
Why not just buy a used F1 car for a million dollars and use the 4 million for fuel, spares and renting out a track with an engineer for the day.

LOL, this can't be serious. Where did RB/Aston Martin say that? I wan't to hear it from the horse's mouth.

[No Lotus]

Now AM are saying the car won't necessarily be limited to 99 examples. From R&T today (June 30th):

"When asked if the hypercar would be turbocharged, Palmer had this to say:

'I wouldn't take that as a given because remember, we're not so worried about the emissions effect," said Palmer in an interview with Road & Track. "We're not making very many of them–between orders of magnitude between 99 and 150–[so] it doesn't dictate the necessity of a downsized engine.'

Palmer said that decision to go turbo or not has "been made, but I'm not going to go into it. We're saving that up for a few weeks time.'"

[domh245]

Due to be unveiled today at Gaydon with Martin Brundle in attendance

https://twitter.com/MBrundleF1/status/7 ... 2518316032