2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

[SameSame]

As predicted, Monza is a pretty good circuit for Mclaren, certainly not their worst of the year.

Okay so we now have pretty definitive evidence of Honda PU vs Mclaren Chassis.

I think there is debate over whether RBR or Mercedes have the best chassis, I am going to compare to RBR because they have a known weak PU whereas Mercedes are strong everywhere.

We can take RBR as a benchmark for strong chassis, weak PU
We can take Manor as a benchmark for weak chassis, strong PU
Where does Mclaren sit in this?

Monaco 2016 Qualifying
RBR 1:13.622 (0.000)
MCL 1:15.352 (1.730)
MAN 1:17.295 (3.673)

Monza 2016 Qualifying
RBR 1:22.389 (0.000)
MCL 1:23.273 (0.884)
MAN 123.315 (0.926)

From the above you can deduce that RBR chassis is around 1.8s per lap quicker than Mclaren but the Honda PU is around 0.8s per lap quicker than the Renault.

On the other hand the Manor chassis is around 3.7s slower than RBR but their PU gains them 2.7s.

If anybody has a similarly chassis dependent circuit I can supplement Monaco with that would be appreciated, there are plenty of power tracks, Baku, Spa etc.

There is no way the Merc PU is 2.7s faster than the Renault and in turn the Honda is in no way 0.8s up on the Renault. You have such a small sample size. That's using selective data to come to a conclusion. What about Hungary where Alonso was 1s away from Ricciardo? Or what about Baku where Alonso was 1.3s behind Ricciardo? The picture looks a lot different if such small sample sizes are used.

And how is Monza a good track for them?

[iotar__]

Yup,Looks like he has an option to drive in 2018, Alonso's contract runs out next year. He has talked to retirement. So possibly Jenson teams with stoffel in 2018.

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/ ... confirmed/

- I hope you are joking. One year without racing (new tyres, cars) and one more year of age over 35 and you expect him to come back?

- So how much are McLaren going to pay Button for nothing? 10 000 $ per tweet? A grand for a cheesy one-liner? This is how big car company Honda is spending their money and where Force India's well deserved share of F1's profit is going.
- Formula 1 is really Roman Empire of our times. What's next, Whiting becomes Renault's team principle and Bernard E. puts his favourite dog as an F1 race director?

[Andres125sx]

As predicted, Monza is a pretty good circuit for Mclaren, certainly not their worst of the year.

Okay so we now have pretty definitive evidence of Honda PU vs Mclaren Chassis.

I think there is debate over whether RBR or Mercedes have the best chassis, I am going to compare to RBR because they have a known weak PU whereas Mercedes are strong everywhere.

We can take RBR as a benchmark for strong chassis, weak PU
We can take Manor as a benchmark for weak chassis, strong PU
Where does Mclaren sit in this?

Monaco 2016 Qualifying
RBR 1:13.622 (0.000)
MCL 1:15.352 (1.730)
MAN 1:17.295 (3.673)

Monza 2016 Qualifying
RBR 1:22.389 (0.000)
MCL 1:23.273 (0.884)
MAN 123.315 (0.926)

From the above you can deduce that RBR chassis is around 1.8s per lap quicker than Mclaren but the Honda PU is around 0.8s per lap quicker than the Renault.

On the other hand the Manor chassis is around 3.7s slower than RBR but their PU gains them 2.7s.

If anybody has a similarly chassis dependent circuit I can supplement Monaco with that would be appreciated, there are plenty of power tracks, Baku, Spa etc.

I´m afraid it´s not that easy when every team evolve during the season. Both McLaren chasis and Honda PU are very different from Monaco to Monza. Same for the rest.

Also, if RBR chasis is that fast compared to McLaren, that does not mean they will have that gap on every track. Your reasoning is "RBR chassis is 1.8s quicker minus 0,8s due to Honda PU", but there´s no way RBR chassis is providing 1.8 seconds advantage at Monza, even if they got that advantage at Monaco

[ctdrftna]

Yup,Looks like he has an option to drive in 2018, Alonso's contract runs out next year. He has talked to retirement. So possibly Jenson teams with stoffel in 2018.

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/ ... confirmed/

- I hope you are joking. One year without racing (new tyres, cars) and one more year of age over 35 and you expect him to come back?

- So how much are McLaren going to pay Button for nothing? 10 000 $ per tweet? A grand for a cheesy one-liner? This is how big car company Honda is spending their money and where Force India's well deserved share of F1's profit is going.
- Formula 1 is really Roman Empire of our times. What's next, Whiting becomes Renault's team principle and Bernard E. puts his favourite dog as an F1 race director?

Do you think that he won't drive next year? I would bet you see him in pre season and multiple Friday's throughout 2017, I would rather him driving all season.

I don't think age has anything to do with it, he's still very fit, and still is fast.

[GoranF1]

Why did Button said Alonso was "checky monkey"?
I didnt read so i dont know the context.

[dr.chaos]

Jenson said he had an edge over Fernando all weekend, but Alonso found a couple of tenths on him in qualifying. That's what he was referring to.

[ringo]

Alonso was hiding his hand until qualy.

Anyhow button is doing the right thing by not racing next year. He gets to stay at HQ more and live a normal life, being closer to his family. We must remember that he has been on the road fo 1 7 years straight. That's a lot time.

I don't think the Honda engine is better than the renault unit at all. The mclaren chassis is probably the 3rd best with ferrari.
The honda engine is improved but it's not as good as refined nor mature as renault.

[fellowhoodlums]

Button kept as cover should Alonso take a pre-season testing wobble.......

[Powy]

Jenson Button explains his F1 absence in 2017 (video message on his instagram). He will stay involved with the team though.

[Schuttelberg]

Alonso was hiding his hand until qualy.

Anyhow button is doing the right thing by not racing next year. He gets to stay at HQ more and live a normal life, being closer to his family. We must remember that he has been on the road fo 1 7 years straight. That's a lot time.

I don't think the Honda engine is better than the renault unit at all. The mclaren chassis is probably the 3rd best with ferrari.
The honda engine is improved but it's not as good as refined nor mature as renault.

You can sugar quote it as much as you like but fact is that Button is being pushed out. It happened in 2006 as well to another great champion. It's very clear that Button has not lost any speed and if anything a chap like him will be even more motivated considering the McLaren is finally beginning to show a competitive edge. This is all PR and I'm quite appalled that Button won't be racing next year.

Frankly, I can't understand why Ferrari didn't try to lure him ever since 2015.

[Pierce89]

As predicted, Monza is a pretty good circuit for Mclaren, certainly not their worst of the year.

Okay so we now have pretty definitive evidence of Honda PU vs Mclaren Chassis.

I think there is debate over whether RBR or Mercedes have the best chassis, I am going to compare to RBR because they have a known weak PU whereas Mercedes are strong everywhere.

We can take RBR as a benchmark for strong chassis, weak PU
We can take Manor as a benchmark for weak chassis, strong PU
Where does Mclaren sit in this?

Monaco 2016 Qualifying
RBR 1:13.622 (0.000)
MCL 1:15.352 (1.730)
MAN 1:17.295 (3.673)

Monza 2016 Qualifying
RBR 1:22.389 (0.000)
MCL 1:23.273 (0.884)
MAN 123.315 (0.926)

From the above you can deduce that RBR chassis is around 1.8s per lap quicker than Mclaren but the Honda PU is around 0.8s per lap quicker than the Renault.

On the other hand the Manor chassis is around 3.7s slower than RBR but their PU gains them 2.7s.

If anybody has a similarly chassis dependent circuit I can supplement Monaco with that would be appreciated, there are plenty of power tracks, Baku, Spa etc.

Do the same calculation but use Hungary in place of Monaco and use all 4 cars.....Shouldn't that show about the same according to your "deduced" conclusion. Hungary is every bit the "chassis" track that Monaco is.

[mrluke]

I'll go one better, ill start a new thread and go through all races this year with rbr vs Manor as an indicator on power vs chassis and see how that sits

[Sevach]

Didn't Mclaren also say that Mika was gonna take a sabbatical all those years ago?

[ME4ME]

I don't like the sound of this deal at all. They basically imply that Button will be called upon or return fully if Vandoorne doesn't perform well right from the start. We've seen with Magnussen and Perez that Mclaren isn't very patience or give 2nd chances. Im afraid Vandoorne won't get a fair shot and he'll be replaced. I'd rather see Button go permanently and continue his motorsport career elsewhere.

[Webber2011]

You can sugar quote it as much as you like but fact is that Button is being pushed out. It happened in 2006 as well to another great champion. It's very clear that Button has not lost any speed and if anything a chap like him will be even more motivated considering the McLaren is finally beginning to show a competitive edge. This is all PR and I'm quite appalled that Button won't be racing next year.

Frankly, I can't understand why Ferrari didn't try to lure him ever since 2015.

Maybe they did ?

Knowing Ron Dennis' hatred of Ferrari, this is the perfect way of letting Jenson retire, but keeping any other Team from signing him up.

I think it's very a very clever "f@$k you" to anyone else who was interested in him