2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

[Pany]

Yessss. Looking at Renault and Honda progress this year with tokens restrictions, im sure in 2017 all engines will have small gap; let's say Merceds and Ferrari nearly equal and Renault/Honda 15/25 HP behind not more. I also beleave fuel consumption and driveability will be very similar. So in conclusion it will be as always has been: engine not perfectly equal but competition is assured (only on 2 circuits engine will play important role). Next year the best chassis will fight for championship and im not talking only about aerodynamics; very important will be masses distribution, rake optimisation, suspension arms and springs and damper systems and finally chassis weight and stiffness, all of whcich strictly related together. At the moment for sure in these things redbull and merceds are clearly leading. Ferrari and Mclaren need time to catch according to me; it will take some more time up to 2018

[Sayeman]

'McLaren boss Eric Boullier believes main rival team Toro Rosso's superior pace in Singapore will prove "just a one-off".'

Sure nothing to do with their good chassis at all eh Boulier? Even in Monaco Torro Rosso was ahead.
This guy utters more non-sense than making any sense.

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mclar ... ff-827839/

[Dipesh1995]

This is the problem with McLaren: Ignorance. They got hammered in Monaco in terms of pace and that's what's happened here both times by Toro Rosso yet they claim its "just a one off" rather than recognising it's a chassis deficit in slow corners. I don't know whether it's just Bouiller thinking it's a "one off" or whether all of the McLaren engineers share the same view.

[Mad]

This is the problem with McLaren: Ignorance. They got hammered in Monaco in terms of pace and that's what's happened here both times by Toro Rosso yet they claim its "just a one off" rather than recognising it's a chassis deficit in slow corners. I don't know whether it's just Bouiller thinking it's a "one off" or whether all of the McLaren engineers share the same view.

Mclaren hasn't produced a great championship winning chassis since 2009, even in 2008 Ferrari was a better car.
Funny how they started making "great" chassis once Honda came onboard with a weak PU.

[Dipesh1995]

I understand why McLaren think they've done a great job with the chassis since 2015 simply because of the arrival of Peter Prodromou, one of the main guys behind the dominance of Red Bull when it's comes to chassis design. And tbf, I don't think the chassis aerodynamically is bad but what's really frustrating is McLaren's or solely Boullier's refusal to acknowledge the chassis's weak points, one of them undoubtedly being slow corners.

[Jef Patat]

Yesss. I totally agree. Now everything is in mclaren hands. Will be very hard to get chassis at redbul level.

So you think Honda is at Mercedes perfomance level or at least it will be easy for them to reach Mercedes perfomance?

Indeed, some people...

[BrunoH]

Maybe something to do with the wheel base?

[Sayeman]

Great Salvage job from Mclaren, was really worried about Torro-Rosso this weekend.
Mclaren has achieved the 7th place they wanted.
One another thing I noticed is that Mclaren have bad pitstop almost every race, Fernando had a 3.9sec Pit today.

About the PU i don't think it's that much underpowered compared to Renault like some are making it out to be, Fernando was going away from Verstappen out of the corner, barely passed him using DRS and fresher tire.

[Schuttelberg]

Lot of talk about McLaren beating Ferrari here. Both McLaren's started ahead of Vettel and the lead one finished more than 30 seconds behind. So, while McLaren have made progress and have a good chassis, the Ferrari chassis is still better.

[diffuser]

Doesn't look like the new front wing resolved the understeer issue. Button back at Monoco said that when the car was balanced. When he added front wing, 1 notch, it got way to much oversteer. So there is obviously a chassis issue there in high speed corners with high downforce tracks with walls. I think the walls play a major roll. If you have unpredictable oversteer, you don't have the confidance to go in hard. While on tracks without walls you don't have to fear contact. If you run wide 10 cms, its no biggy.

[Kalun]

Although I might argue that McLaren has the best aero and engine combination. But seems like they are struggling with mechanical grip and understeer. If you look at the last few lap when max is chasing after fernando. Although fernando is able to take off better than Verstappen but Verstappen are able to gain on him in the corner while the McLaren are struggling with grip. I would give a credit to Fernando to be able to extract the most from a understeer car.
If you see the qualifying, the mclaren are struggling for grip and the car shakes and move a lot due to its very stiff suspension as compare to the top 3 team and Toro Rosso. But when it comes to semi high speed track, McLaren is doing quite well even with a power deficit. It means the the drivability of the engine and the Aerodynamic of the car isn't that terrible and are on par with the Mercedes and Redbull. McLaren is just lacking of those fancy suspension system which are developed by the top 3 team.
The question now, is mclaren developing a new suspension setup/system for next year? And are they going to introduce it this season like the Mercedes? If they introduce it this season, they can test out the system but it would be a waste of resources and time.

What do you guys think?

[iotar__]

Although I might argue that McLaren has the best aero and engine combination. But seems like they are struggling with mechanical grip and understeer. If you look at the last few lap when max is chasing after fernando. Although fernando is able to take off better than Verstappen but Verstappen are able to gain on him in the corner while the McLaren are struggling with grip. I would give a credit to Fernando to be able to extract the most from a understeer car.
What do you guys think?

I think it can't be happening on this planet and at this time . Singapore result is nice but Sainz took out himself and Hulkenberg, Kvyat is slow in races (maybe unfair but safe assumption) and Perez despite 7 (8) places grid finished one place behind Alonso.

If you want to compare McL to Red Bull and dissect reasons (mechanical grip, handling) why not use qualifying/one lap? Same tyres, same fuel level, best driver vs best, empty track = 1,4 s on non engine, not classic aero but still great car is a great car (top 3) track. If they are anywhere near the best in any category/combination of categories (pointless exercise IMO) how much can they realistically lose in others? BTW Renault's Taffin, no numbers but:

I guess Ferrari is halfway to the gap we have got to Mercedes. Honda are catching but they are quite a way behind us."

[JoeE]

I'd be very surprised if McL were playing the ignorance card internally. Am sure there fully aware of the chassis and engine issues, but you have to bear in mind, they have sponsors to please, so telling the media it's a one off is a pleasing method for the media and shareholders who dont see the day to day workings of the team.

There is no doubt they have improved. We wait until the testing of 2017 takes place and see how we get on for 2016 is simply another donkey.

[godlameroso]

I think the chassis is good maybe even great, the engine is not there yet but getting better, however they still trail the top teams in regards to mechanical suspension. The issue is that the last few circuits haven't really played to the car's strengths. True places like Monaco and Singapore don't have long straights, but they're not pure downforce circuits, they require a lot of mechanical grip, which the McLaren isn't quite up to par with the others. We'll know for sure in two weeks time in Malaysia, that circuit should suit them better than Singapore because the corner speeds are more in the performance window of the McLaren(mid to high speed corners like Spa), and the straights are not too long. The McLaren is good in long radius corners, mid speed corners and under braking, it's not so good at low speed sections with a lot of bumps. Also if Alonso had taken an extra stop he might have been able to fend off Verstappen, but his tire strategy was very conservative and had simply ran out of grip by the end of the race. The team placed more emphasis of keeping him in clean air, then again Button had no hope of passing anyone except the Saubers and Manors, so maybe this was the best team compromise.

[diffuser]

The PU is last with the exception of the 2015 Ferrari, which isn't gonna help them next year since TR will not be running it . The chassis is on par with FI and TR, on some tracks those Chassis do better others McLaren does.

They have alot to work to do in both.