Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
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etusch
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Mudflap wrote:
02 Apr 2017, 19:47
etusch wrote:
02 Apr 2017, 15:57
https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsma ... doors/amp/

Here an interesting article
what does that have to do with anything ?
well I guess the holographic display might come in handy when the car breaks down on the track and the marshals are slow to turn up..
That news not related F1 but interesting part is Honda's way of doing things completely closed to outside and intention coming from new boss to change this approach. I hope they make this in F1 too. But I dont want to see them to do things completely like others. They must do what they do now. Just I want to see them using all knowledge and experience they can find . Now It looks like they are reinventing bulb to use bulb. ( TJİ)

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Thunder
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Anybody with a Autosport plus Account here to give a quick recap on what the Article says?
http://www.autosport.com/premium/featur ... 1472035319
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wuzak
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Thunders wrote:
03 Apr 2017, 08:56
Anybody with a Autosport plus Account here to give a quick recap on what the Article says?
http://www.autosport.com/premium/featur ... 1472035319
Honda are f*#@ed.

Actually, I believe it has been covered earlier in the thread.

Basically their single cylinder development engine performed well, but it hasn't translated into the V6 as the exhausts and intakes interact with one another.

Sevach
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Image

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Thunder
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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No matter which way you look at it, in the End it comes down to apparently not having a full chassis Dyno and not allowing enough Time to actually Test Things before they are signed off.
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hurril
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Worth getting a subscription?

ncassi22
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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I think this covers a little more of the premium stuff.

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... rev=search

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Andres125sx
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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About the question if they´re ustin TJI or not.... Can TJI be disabled on a TJI engine? I mean, for TJI you need a pre-chamber, so I can´t see how a TJI engine can be used without TJI :?:

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Thunder
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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ncassi22 wrote:
03 Apr 2017, 12:03
I think this covers a little more of the premium stuff.

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... rev=search
Thanks for that. Very Infomative and Honest From Hasegawa. Kudos for that.

But that was pretty much exactly what Arai said in 2015.....
"We thought it was going to be easy, but it's too difficult with this new technology,"
So here's hoping they really get to the Root of the Problem, which indeed lies in their Test Beds (and everything related to it), and figure it out quick.
Last edited by Thunder on 03 Apr 2017, 13:54, edited 2 times in total.
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GoranF1
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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they saw the problem on Christmas and yet they started to work or redesign only after test 2....
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication & competence."

hurril
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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GoranF1 wrote:
03 Apr 2017, 13:27
they saw the problem on Christmas and yet they started to work or redesign only after test 2....
Loose claims.

Chicane
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Hasegawa quotes from Autosport plus

It's hard, very hard, it 's hard to express how hard it is. I am enormously disappointed . " Yusuke Hasegawa recognizes the extent to which Honda lives immersed in a huge nightmare and under a brutal pressure, more accentuated since the last GP of Australia . The Japanese engineer and his team face a few weeks that will be crucial for Honda and McLaren .

"It must be said that our engine is 10 kilos lighter and the center of gravity is one centimeter lower, it is incredible for Formula 1, " Hasegawa acknowledges in the British publication Autosport, where he carries out a professional honesty exercise to explain the causes Techniques of the unexpected setback on the evolution of 2016. "I have to be proud of this, but I can not. From this point of view, we have not taken a step back, but everyone sees it like this, "explains the Japanese coach, for whom" we have achieved the same level of performance and power with a smaller and lighter engine. " In theory, numbers were inviting to optimism. So what has failed?

A serious mistake of trust

"We thought it was going to be easy, but it's too difficult with this new technology," Hasegawa explained, "it was my mistake," the Japanese coach honestly acknowledges, "we had made good progress [in the lab] with a single cylinder, but As soon as we mounted the V6 we had many problems . " The greater the great vibrations of the engine, in addition to a complicated delivery of power. The riders must play with the accelerator to get them on, also raising the foot exaggerated by the consumption in the race.

Honda began detecting problems when the specification of the experimental cylinder was transferred to the complete architecture of the six cylinders. "But it was very late when we realized it, at Christmas." The vibrations had not occurred on the test bench, but the surprise came "when we installed the gearbox, shafts and tires, there are resonances."

"Since January, we've been trying to analyze the difference between the mono cylinder and the V6," Hasegawa explains, for whom the weaknesses of his power unit are "the rigidity of the engine itself (also influenced by the higher current G forces and new tires) , The difference in air flow, and the biggest factor is the influence of each cylinder on the rest . If you introduce a lot of fuel into the third cylinder, you lose somewhere else. Theoretically, the exhaust pressure has more influence on a four-cylinder engine than on one of three, technically speaking. We did not think there would be such a big difference between a single cylinder and six, but it affects a lot. " In short, a serious miscalculation that Hasegawa and his team did not anticipate, again underestimating the complexity of hybrid technology.
What counts for one, has to count for six

The head of Honda recognizes that "we are working very hard on Sakura , we are trying everything we can. We have achieved a good level of performance with the single cylinder, we now have to transfer it to the V6. We have good numbers (with the single cylinder), although we have to improve it, we are confident we can reach that level. " But to what extent there is room for maneuver is to be seen, because "we can change the intake or exhaust system, but not the entire engine interior. We do not have time to change everything , and I do not think it's necessary to change everything . If we find a good solution we can upgrade the engine for the fifth or sixth test, " referring to the version that would appear in Russia or Spain.

"I try to react to the depression that the team and the drivers suffer if there is any way, but it's not easy," he explains sympathetically about the impact of Honda's involution. "It's a huge job to evolve engines, so we have to live With the situation for some weeks. If we find the way, as soon as we do, all will be well. " Although many promises have been heard since Honda.


Source: https://translate.google.com/translate? ... t=&act=url
Quickshifter

ziggy
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Thunders wrote:
03 Apr 2017, 11:59
No matter which way you look at it, in the End it comes down to apparently not having a full chassis Dyno and not allowing enough Time to actually Test Things before they are signed off.
Not only that. The majority of honda software is in japanese language. We saw some screenshots with japanese letters and without a proper translation, one simply doesen't know, what he's looking at. Now imagine how the mercedes or renault guys can just make a screenshot one the pc and send it over to the chassis guys. Honda has to do translations and its complicated. We have problems to translate a simple article from JAP to ENG, how hard it must be to translate a heavy technical document?

And no, this post is not bashing honda or the Japanese people. Just discussion.

Sasha
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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GoranF1 wrote:
03 Apr 2017, 13:27
they saw the problem on Christmas and yet they started to work or redesign only after test 2....
If that was true then the redesign wouldn't be ready until about Aug-Sept.They started the redesign in Jan.

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godlameroso
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Re: Honda Power Unit

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Assuming a 4-6 month lead time to implement a fix, then yeah that means earliest introduction for upgraded engine is Sochi, or as late as Silverstone. Surely they can at least make small improvements until then.
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