2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[Nuvolari]

Once again the circuit with all the long straights that was expected to show up just how weak the Honda engine is, instead gives a pretty solid performance.

It's clearly not working at its best but I don't think it's that far off say the Renault pu. Need to do a bit of analysis on it.

I'm going to say that if it's a wet race then don't expect Mclaren to do that well, think Brazil last year. Their chassis / down force is not really their strength.

Overall its good to see that Mclaren Honda are still knocking on the door of q3 despite all the doom and gloom.

I'm sorry but I have to challenge this.

These are the outright best sector times and Alonso/Hulkenberg:

Sector 1
Best: 23.998 (Vettel)
Alonso: 24.693
Hulkenberg: 24.439

Sector 2
Best: 27.079 (Hamilton)
Alonso: 27.862
Hulkenberg: 27.816

Sector 3
Best: 40.469 (Bottas)
Alonso: 41.762
Hulkenberg: 41.269

I don't know how you get to the conclusion that losing almost 1.3 seconds in a sector almost entirely composed of straights is somehow a deficiency of the chassis? Alonso only lost out 0.254s to Hulkenberg in S1, and pretty much on par in Sector 2...he loses a lot more in S3 to Hulkenberg, and if the Honda was an equal to Renault, he's easily in Q3.

I hate doing these chassis/PU debates but the McLaren is easily fighting with the best Newey can come up with in an aero dominant regulation change if the Honda was up to scratch. Trying to spin this into a fault of McLaren is pitiful.

[Duderino]

New engine to be tested at the upcoming Bahrain test. Source: https://jp.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-%E ... 84-891274/

[etusch]

Good news. After today's performans I am waiting that update more excited

[proteus]

Once again the circuit with all the long straights that was expected to show up just how weak the Honda engine is, instead gives a pretty solid performance.

It's clearly not working at its best but I don't think it's that far off say the Renault pu. Need to do a bit of analysis on it.

I'm going to say that if it's a wet race then don't expect Mclaren to do that well, think Brazil last year. Their chassis / down force is not really their strength.

Overall its good to see that Mclaren Honda are still knocking on the door of q3 despite all the doom and gloom.

Mclaren's pace defecit is laregely obscured by Alonso's absolutely stellar driving. If you compare VanDoorne, who supposedly is 'this big thing', then the difference is massive. I've only seen VD struggle, whilst Alonso just does what is best and actually gets it there. It's amazing he was P9 for a seriously long time, it's a shame he couldnt repeat that in Q2 but p13 is rather stellar for what they're dealing with. Especially since Australia 'seemed lucky' but rather is starting to show Alonso's capacity, really. Only hampered by the technical problems of the MCL32, which cost him his result in AUS. Hopefully, that won't be the case in china. 17 kmh speed difference on the straight with Mercedes, is insane to still put it there.

i really do hope it'll rain and he'll get that car in p8 or something, that would be massive.

Yes and no. If we compare Vandoorne and Alonso, who is getting all the updates first and probably gets the car developed to suit him better? And comparing someone who has almost a decade of the particular track experiance to someone being there the first time in a F1 car there is a bit unapropriate. As allways the driver does what car allows him to do. If the car and the engine would not be able to achieve the result it would not matter how good the driver is. Vandoorne is right now a bit slower than Alonso and that is completely normal, on the other hand he has also alot more technical issues (second time in a row before qualifying) so his pace was compromised both times as well.

Alonso is overperforming drivers and not the car. If he would overperform the car, then he would cheat the laws of physics.

[JuanjoTS]

Once again the circuit with all the long straights that was expected to show up just how weak the Honda engine is, instead gives a pretty solid performance.

It's clearly not working at its best but I don't think it's that far off say the Renault pu. Need to do a bit of analysis on it.

I'm going to say that if it's a wet race then don't expect Mclaren to do that well, think Brazil last year. Their chassis / down force is not really their strength.

Overall its good to see that Mclaren Honda are still knocking on the door of q3 despite all the doom and gloom.

Mclaren's pace defecit is laregely obscured by Alonso's absolutely stellar driving. If you compare VanDoorne, who supposedly is 'this big thing', then the difference is massive. I've only seen VD struggle, whilst Alonso just does what is best and actually gets it there. It's amazing he was P9 for a seriously long time, it's a shame he couldnt repeat that in Q2 but p13 is rather stellar for what they're dealing with. Especially since Australia 'seemed lucky' but rather is starting to show Alonso's capacity, really. Only hampered by the technical problems of the MCL32, which cost him his result in AUS. Hopefully, that won't be the case in china. 17 kmh speed difference on the straight with Mercedes, is insane to still put it there.

i really do hope it'll rain and he'll get that car in p8 or something, that would be massive.

Yes and no. If we compare Vandoorne and Alonso, who is getting all the updates first and probably gets the car developed to suit him better? And comparing someone who has almost a decade of the particular track experiance to someone being there the first time in a F1 car there is a bit unapropriate. As allways the driver does what car allows him to do. If the car and the engine would not be able to achieve the result it would not matter how good the driver is. Vandoorne is right now a bit slower than Alonso and that is completely normal, on the other hand he has also alot more technical issues (second time in a row before qualifying) so his pace was compromised both times as well.

Alonso is overperforming drivers and not the car. If he would overperform the car, then he would cheat the laws of physics.

Stoffel has not complained about having fewer updates, I think ALO has earned respect and his salary, do not detract from Stoffel, but you can not fall into underestimating the best driver today.
The only driver who has won ALO as teammate was BUT and in a season where finishing a race was like playing Russian roulette, nobody has won, nor HAM, tied 109 points and I stay there, not to enter In favor deals etc.
You can not demand stoffel what other experienced pilots have not achieved, but you can not throw ALO on the ground.

[godlameroso]

If the upgraded engine brings an extra tenth on each straight, combined with McLaren's ability to develop the car, they'll easily be Q3 contenders, those two factors should add up to at least an extra second per lap, the deficit would go from 2.6 seconds to ~1.5 by Sochi, that's great news.

[GoranF1]

If the upgraded engine brings an extra tenth on each straight, combined with McLaren's ability to develop the car, they'll easily be Q3 contenders, those two factors should add up to at least an extra second per lap, the deficit would go from 2.6 seconds to ~1.5 by Sochi, that's great news.

Carlos Sainz Jr said Mclaren will be back in Barcelona...so i guess PU spec 2 coming for Spanish GP

[The_table]

Alonso is overperforming drivers and not the car. If he would overperform the car, then he would cheat the laws of physics.

Alonso has this talent for driving around "problems" and changing his style to suit the car, most drivers try to develop a car to suit their style and are unhappy with anything else.

[godlameroso]

The thing I respect the most about Alonso is he never complains of under steer or over steer, or things like a lot of other drivers complain about.

[diffuser]

Once again the circuit with all the long straights that was expected to show up just how weak the Honda engine is, instead gives a pretty solid performance.

It's clearly not working at its best but I don't think it's that far off say the Renault pu. Need to do a bit of analysis on it.

I'm going to say that if it's a wet race then don't expect Mclaren to do that well, think Brazil last year. Their chassis / down force is not really their strength.

Overall its good to see that Mclaren Honda are still knocking on the door of q3 despite all the doom and gloom.

I'm sorry but I have to challenge this.

These are the outright best sector times and Alonso/Hulkenberg:

Sector 1
Best: 23.998 (Vettel)
Alonso: 24.693
Hulkenberg: 24.439

Sector 2
Best: 27.079 (Hamilton)
Alonso: 27.862
Hulkenberg: 27.816

Sector 3
Best: 40.469 (Bottas)
Alonso: 41.762
Hulkenberg: 41.269

I don't know how you get to the conclusion that losing almost 1.3 seconds in a sector almost entirely composed of straights is somehow a deficiency of the chassis? Alonso only lost out 0.254s to Hulkenberg in S1, and pretty much on par in Sector 2...he loses a lot more in S3 to Hulkenberg, and if the Honda was an equal to Renault, he's easily in Q3.

I hate doing these chassis/PU debates but the McLaren is easily fighting with the best Newey can come up with in an aero dominant regulation change if the Honda was up to scratch. Trying to spin this into a fault of McLaren is pitiful.

@Nuvolari I agree. I just want to add
1- Australia is a power track as well. There is room to pass in China, that's why they're expecting to get mugged.
2- Just because last year's chassis had weakness X doesn't mean that all the McLarens for the rest of eternity will have the same weakness. We're not really sure how good/bad the chassis is yet.

[Schuttelberg]

Alonso is overperforming drivers and not the car. If he would overperform the car, then he would cheat the laws of physics.

Alonso has this talent for driving around "problems" and changing his style to suit the car, most drivers try to develop a car to suit their style and are unhappy with anything else.

He also has an immense talent for making everything all about himself. The situation at the moment cannot be that of harmony at McLaren-Honda. He might be the best driver in the world, but he's perhaps the worst WDC I've seen when it comes to team ethos. The situation in the team at the moment is all about 'how do we give Alonso a competitive car?' and not how do we win as a team again. If you compare Hamilton and Vettel's PR the use of 'we' compared to the use of 'I' by Alonso is remarkable.

Alonso is a world class talent, but he needs to learn to be a team man. He might be the best driver of his generation and thoroughly deserves a 3rd title, but he is not bigger than McLaren or Honda.

[godlameroso]

Let's not make this a fan-boy discussion please, humans have egos they're not robots, under the right kind of stimulation everyone will devolve and the sentimental side takes over. Honestly, what are we doing here, ugh, just save it .

This goes for drivers, team managers, mechanics, and engineers, especially engineers who like to pretend they're always rational calculating beings. The more you deny your animal nature, the more it wants to remind you who's really in control.

[Singabule]

Wow, alonso can hold bottas, look like the inlet plenum update works well

[GhostF1]

Sadly, double retirement. Shame as Alonso was doing a great job sticking in 8th.
Vandoorne - Fuel Issue
Alonso - Driveshaft failure

[bauc]

Sadly, double retirement. Shame as Alonso was doing a great job sticking in 8th.
Vandoorne - Fuel Issue
Alonso - Driveshaft failure

Very Bad, as two races in a row ALO was in the points before his car quits on him