2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[SameSame]

Canada might not be too doom and gloom for the team. Last year Alonso was able to make Q3. If some rain comes for the race they might have a chance of scoring good points.

It's not qualy i'm worried about (though even that won't be good if Honda doesn't bring the Update), it's when efficiency comes into play.

Yeah the race will be painful.

Regarding the PU, I thought the major limiting factor was the vibrations and how detuned the PU had to be run in order to solve that. The PU was supposed to have potential if they cured the vibration issues. What's the issue with it now? Are they not able to implement TJI without vibrations occurring?

If that is the case and they are not using TJI, then how are they making similar power to last years Ferrari PU which has been using TJI that had been perfected in it's second year? Is TJI not such a magic bullet then?

[Big Mangalhit]

Canada might not be too doom and gloom for the team. Last year Alonso was able to make Q3. If some rain comes for the race they might have a chance of scoring good points.

It's not qualy i'm worried about (though even that won't be good if Honda doesn't bring the Update), it's when efficiency comes into play.

Yeah the race will be painful.

Regarding the PU, I thought the major limiting factor was the vibrations and how detuned the PU had to be run in order to solve that. The PU was supposed to have potential if they cured the vibration issues. What's the issue with it now? Are they not able to implement TJI without vibrations occurring?

If that is the case and they are not using TJI, then how are they making similar power to last years Ferrari PU which has been using TJI that had been perfected in it's second year? Is TJI not such a magic bullet then?

Do you think this year PU is on par with Ferrari's from last year? I would say not. Maybe on peak power but most probably not in compound mode. I mean Sauber is closely matched with McLaren so far and has probably a weaker chassis and a weaker driver lineup.

[godlameroso]

They are using TJI, they have to run rich because it's the only way they can ensure the integrity of the TJI flame jets.

It may be the resonance that's causing it, or immature design. With better intake and exhaust designs, they've improved the jets and reduced some of the vibrations.

To really improve the engine requires new or tweaked combustion chamber. Meaning new intake and exhaust ports, modified valve angles, piston crown, pre-chamber, fuel injectors, and new turbos to match. Then there's the MGU-H to consider, as well as the intake and exhaust system such a concept requires.

And even going against conventional wisdom, perhaps an unconventional firing order.

[SameSame]

Do you think this year PU is on par with Ferrari's from last year? I would say not. Maybe on peak power but most probably not in compound mode. I mean Sauber is closely matched with McLaren so far and has probably a weaker chassis and a weaker driver lineup.

If they can match Sauber on peak power then harvesting is their issue? Would they then be so worried about the ICE performance and not put more emphasis on turbine blade and MGU-H design?

[Thunder]

Keep in mind Sauber is (or was?) running their 2016 PU detuned due to cooling issues.

[SameSame]

They are using TJI, they have to run rich because it's the only way they can ensure the integrity of the TJI flame jets.

It may be the resonance that's causing it, or immature design. With better intake and exhaust designs, they've improved the jets and reduced some of the vibrations.

To really improve the engine requires new or tweaked combustion chamber. Meaning new intake and exhaust ports, modified valve angles, piston crown, pre-chamber, fuel injectors, and new turbos to match. Then there's the MGU-H to consider, as well as the intake and exhaust system such a concept requires.

And even going against conventional wisdom, perhaps an unconventional firing order.

Resonance seems too easy to cure, especially if the car is underweight?

Is there an optimal AF ratio that TJI works for? Or is the end goal getting the mixture as lean as it possibly can?

[SameSame]

Keep in mind Sauber is (or was?) running their 2016 PU detuned due to cooling issues.

Ah okay that makes sense thanks.

[godlameroso]

Well the resonance has certainly gotten better, so maybe not so easy to solve.

Sometimes you have an issue with a car, and you think it's easy to solve, but you're left scratching your head after trying everything. Electrical issues are a good example.

[JuanjoTS]

Nothing is heard about an update for Canada, in the words of Hasegawa a few months ago that means that for Canada will have a new engine specification.

"When we have a great update we will say nothing."

[godlameroso]

When did he say that?

[superdowg316]

Didn't Brundle in Monaco say the Canada upgrade was cancelled due to running and reliability issues?

[etusch]

About the engine I think we can believe to Hasegawa's statements only

[fellowhoodlums]

Brundle did say and Hasegawa mentioned the timescales were tight for Canada.

It was the word "cancelled" that worried me. Delayed means Baku in my mind, cancelled say no fixed date because they have scrapped the planned solution to start again.

[shady]

Didn't Brundle in Monaco say the Canada upgrade was cancelled due to running and reliability issues?

Brundle said nothing of Canada, he said the "update was cancelled" a meaningless, contextless statement. Honda never committed to a schedule, only ASAP. so what he said has no point of reference, it was rubbish reporting, with absolutely NO explanation, just a one off statement.

[ME4ME]

Didn't Brundle in Monaco say the Canada upgrade was cancelled due to running and reliability issues?

Honda never committed to a schedule, only ASAP.

Of course they did. Just not publicly. It might very well have been the plan originally to introduce a upgrade in Canada.