ausie carnage - the blame game

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dave kumar
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Joined: 26 Feb 2008, 14:16
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ausie carnage - the blame game

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Interested to know how many accidents in the race could be attributed to the removal of traction control and/or electronically assisted engine braking. Could Kimi's wheel on the grass spin have been collected by TC? Certainly no amount of driver aids would have prevented his trip across the gravel trap in an earlier overtaking move on Kovalainen, surely he was just carrying too much speed into the corner. I don't think the Massa/DC incident (still not sure who was at fault there....) would have been prevented.

Or could it, according to Martin Brundle...
Interestingly, I’m told that 70% of any difficulties arising from the loss of technical gizmos are on the way into the corner and 30% coming out of the corner in terms of wheelspin.
http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type ... e&id=41892
Another point I'm interested in canvasing opinion on: was the high rate of mechanical failure down to the high temperatures or in part because there isn't as much software mediating the driver's inputs to the car. I can't find a complete list of retirement reasons from the GP, can anyone provide a link?

Nice to see Fernando hanging it out on so many occassions. Are we getting a better experience as a viewer? You could certainly see which drivers were pushing hard.

On a side note it was a real pleasure to hear the engines without the misfires. You just got a feeling for what the driver's right foot was doing as he teased the throttle to accelerate the car out of each corner. Great stuff.
Formerly known as senna-toleman

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checkered
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Joined: 02 Mar 2007, 14:32

Re: ausie carnage - the blame game

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Martin Brundle wrote:Interestingly, I’m told that 70% of any difficulties arising from the loss of technical gizmos are on the way into the corner and 30% coming out of the corner in terms of wheelspin.
http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type ... e&id=41892


Roughly the same sorts

of opinions (to Brundle's) have been out and about for quite some time, I remember Sam Michael talking about this at length pretty soon after the initial tests without TC/engine braking (or so). Anyway that was quite a while ago, so I guess the teams have had a reasonably comprehensive grip on this issue before the season started. I can't remember a single racing accident in Melbourne I could directly attribute to the change (though my recollection can fail me). Perhaps as a contributing factor (drivers having to fiddle with the diff and brake balance, compromising their situational perception - especially in close proximity to other cars which doesn't help overtaking at all), but no-one seemed to completely lose it just by gunning the engine at an inopportune moment.

The two moments that came closest to "unforced errors" were Massa's first corner rampage and Glock's kangaroo tribute (which could've ended badly). I suspect that Felipe's incident might have had something to do with engine mapping though, as the FIA hastily imposed a 90 second ban on engine map changes from the start to prevent one of the 12 available settings mimicking launch control. While a Ferrari representative did commend the decision saying that it made "launch control maps" "extremely unlikely" I still suspect that the top teams have compromised one map for the start, accepting some handling risk for the first minute and a half of the race. Notably McLaren's Merc engines were said to rev at about 9000 when they practiced starts, while most others' were screaming well beyond that. As for Timo, he commented that his car had become very challenging to control after his pitstop, so I imagine that off can't be pinned on lacking TC/engine braking either.

The mechanical failures were fairly diverse, but considering the length of the homologation (and especially almost a complete lack of engine failures during the actual races in 2007) it's clear that one of the avenues of investigation must be the new SECU, or rather its adaptation. It's an interesting thought, for example, whether the SECU could've been made less specific to certain engine harmonics/properties. As has been apparent in this msgboard for some time (for the considerable efforts of at least one member), an analysis of the exhaust noise can yield highly specific data about the performance and ranges of operation an engine employs - and by extension, doesn't employ. Overheating, as I understand it, is a compounding problem only partly to do with performance and air temperature ending more regularly in failing peripherals than catastrophic events in the main components. I guess we'll hear some "versions" eventually, depending on the teams' positions and general stinginess with details.

FLC
FLC
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Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 14:01

Re: ausie carnage - the blame game

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checkered wrote: The two moments that came closest to "unforced errors" were Massa's first corner rampage and Glock's kangaroo tribute (which could've ended badly).
I'm not so sure that Glock's incident was due to lack of TC. I have watched it a few times after the race and I'm pretty sure that if he wouldn't have met that bump he would have saved it.

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jaho101
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Joined: 16 Oct 2006, 07:02

Re: ausie carnage - the blame game

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checkered wrote: The mechanical failures were fairly diverse, but considering the length of the homologation (and especially almost a complete lack of engine failures during the actual races in 2007).
I think much of the problem was the team's lack of preparation for such a hot environment, didn't many of the teams change their brake ducts and other things to compensate for the unexpected heat? I'm sure Ferrari and other teams didn't make concessions for such a hot weekend.

mx_tifoso
mx_tifoso
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Joined: 30 Nov 2006, 05:01
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Re: ausie carnage - the blame game

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FLC wrote:....I'm not so sure that Glock's incident was due to lack of TC. I have watched it a few times after the race and I'm pretty sure that if he wouldn't have met that bump he would have saved it.
I was actually a bit annoyed at the fact that a circuit has such large bumbs around the track. Two very unecessary grass bumps caused two very unecessary accidents on Sunday; Nakajima's destroyed front wing and Glock's race ending launch. What are these bumps doing around a high speed race track?

I believe race circuits should be better prepared around the edges, especially street circuits, because bumps in particular are unforgiving and transform simple errors into possible race ending accidents. Even if Glock would've been unable to save it without the bump, the accident would have been of a much lesser degree, I would even go to the extent of saying that the car could have been driven [if not too damaged] back to the team garage. Possibly even just a high speed brush against the retaining wall without pieces being spilt all over the track as they did on Sunday. And I'm sure that Nakajima's race was highly affected as well, since it called for a un-scheduled pit stop to replace the nose cone. Those darn bumps made all the difference in both of these drivers race results.

If safety is such a top priority for the FIA, they should might as well pay attention to these small details surounding circuits as well while they're at it.
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Ray
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006, 06:33
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Re: ausie carnage - the blame game

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The worst thing next to that bump being there was the fact that Timo could have broken his back or worse. I'm so happy he walked away from that.

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Ciro Pabón
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Joined: 11 May 2005, 00:31

Re: ausie carnage - the blame game

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Yes, I thought exactly the same about the bumps: it's ridiculous they exist. It also proves how fragile is an F1 car once it leaves the ground.
Ciro