Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

[wuzak]

Did you see the last race? They were struggling to hang on to there coattails, infact nearly both of them got beaten by a Renault powered Redbull starting from the back.
Ferrari isn't Honda. Honda would be lucky to get near them let alone Mercedes.

Circumstances played a role in the result and Monza, as well as something awry with the chassis set up.

Ferrari are admitting to a 20hp deficit to Mercedes. Which may be their underlying deficit, or some part of the deficit could be because the Ferrari PU's (spec 3) were on their 4th race and the Mercedes PUs (spec 4) were on their 2nd?

[Zynerji]

I doubt they do. What i still see with the mercedes though; from 2014, is what appears to be a huge ass turbine.

I often wondered why the gigantic size. My only thought was that they somehow integrated Ranque-Hilsch vortex tubes into the compressor, and dump the heat of the compressed air out the waste gate or feed it directly to the exhaust turbine.

[Nickel]

I doubt they do. What i still see with the mercedes though; from 2014, is what appears to be a huge ass turbine.

I often wondered why the gigantic size. My only thought was that they somehow integrated Ranque-Hilsch vortex tubes into the compressor, and dump the heat of the compressed air out the waste gate or feed it directly to the exhaust turbine.

to me it has seemed and continues to seem fairly obvious the turbo is gigantic because they(merc) want to extract as much energy as possible from the exhaust, independently from compressor needs.

Size the turbine to be as big as exhaust energy allows, harvest everything the compressor doesn't need.

[Angel]

Anyway folks. The honda engine will have a new home for 2018. The toro rosso team thread needs to make some room for all the unwanted guests!

Hi! Are you sure about it?
I haven't seen any official news about it... (I think)

[GoranF1]

There are many problems whit Honda engine but the biggest one is that Mercedes is still bringing 30HP updates.

You really think they are still finding 3% more power with every update?

The engine in AMG had 30hp more power then Williams and FI in Monza

[hurril]

There are many problems whit Honda engine but the biggest one is that Mercedes is still bringing 30HP updates.

You really think they are still finding 3% more power with every update?

The engine in AMG had 30hp more power then Williams and FI in Monza

How do you know this?

[MrPotatoHead]

You really think they are still finding 3% more power with every update?

The engine in AMG had 30hp more power then Williams and FI in Monza

How do you know this?

He doesn’t.
And anyway AMG always have more aggressive mapping than their customers as they don’t have to pay the bill for a replacement if it blows.

[63l8qrrfy6]

The engine in AMG had 30hp more power then Williams and FI in Monza

How do you know this?

He doesn’t.
And anyway AMG always have more aggressive mapping than their customers as they don’t have to pay the bill for a replacement if it blows.

I think what he meant was that AMG had the latest spec engine while customers were still on the older spec.
Obviously the 30 hp figure is a media fib.

[MrPotatoHead]

How do you know this?

He doesn’t.
And anyway AMG always have more aggressive mapping than their customers as they don’t have to pay the bill for a replacement if it blows.

I think what he meant was that AMG had the latest spec engine while customers were still on the older spec.
Obviously the 30 hp figure is a media fib.

But that can’t be - the internet knows they lost 100HP with the low oil burn iteration of the engine

[PlatinumZealot]

There are many problems whit Honda engine but the biggest one is that Mercedes is still bringing 30HP updates.

Sure . . and that's why Ferrari is up thier gluteus maximus every race!

Anyway folks. The honda engine will have a new home for 2018. The toro rosso team thread needs to make some room for all the unwanted guests!

Did you see the last race? They were struggling to hang on to there coattails, infact nearly both of them got beaten by a Renault powered Redbull starting from the back.
Ferrari isn't Honda. Honda would be lucky to get near them let alone Mercedes.

Nah. That was all car setup and ERS strategy not Engine Power. Insiders know th engine is almost as strong as Merecedes. Mercedes has maybe 1 to 2 tenths in qualifying on the engine side.

[PlatinumZealot]

Anyway folks. The honda engine will have a new home for 2018. The toro rosso team thread needs to make some room for all the unwanted guests!

Hi! Are you sure about it?
I haven't seen any official news about it... (I think)

Yes. Insider information apparently.

RedBull want the Honda engine for Toro Rosso.
McLaren want the Renault engine.
Renault resources are full.
Renault has a toro Rosso contract.
Sainz wants out of toro Rosso.
Renaault wants Sainz.
Honda wants to be in F1 next year.

So it it all falls into Place.

[Angel]

Yes. Insider information apparently.

RedBull want the Honda engine for Toro Rosso.
McLaren want the Renault engine.
Renault resources are full.
Renault has a toro Rosso contract.
Sainz wants out of toro Rosso.
Renaault wants Sainz.
Honda wants to be in F1 next year.

So it it all falls into Place.

It makes sense... as a scenario... still, if that confirms, for me, I think it's a bad move for McLaren.
Let's see what comes out from here!

[harjan]

Going with Renault will mean McLaren isn't going to be champion under the current PU rules- but they will challenge for the occasional win. But staying with Honda might give them the risk to have another (few) seasons of unacceptable performance and reliability.

It will take Honda another 2 yrs at least to get this engine performing and reliable. McLaren doesn't have that time.

In hindsight (always easy) McLaren & Honda should have put the 100m euro in Manor & Sauber and developed the engine with them until it was up to Renault level. This is all the result of Whitmarsh bad management (read: weak) and Ron Dennis trying one of his signature power moves to correct it.

[RedNEO]

Yes. Insider information apparently.

RedBull want the Honda engine for Toro Rosso.
McLaren want the Renault engine.
Renault resources are full.
Renault has a toro Rosso contract.
Sainz wants out of toro Rosso.
Renaault wants Sainz.
Honda wants to be in F1 next year.

So it it all falls into Place.

It makes sense... as a scenario... still, if that confirms, for me, I think it's a bad move for McLaren.
Let's see what comes out from here!

I think you'll be positively surprised next year

[enkidu1978]

I'm still in shock, i've been waiting for three years for Honda to come good. I think McLaren have made the worst mistake ever, they are going to be gutted when TR drives past them next year.