2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[diffuser]

I agree, after closely looking at S1 of the side by side with Hamilton and Alonso from Quali. I have more respect for the McLaren Chassis. I think it was really holding it's own in there. That's not to say that there will not be growing pains....

[loner]

Alonso is not the source of information.
I think the source of information is with some engineers or mechanics working at Honda. Albert knows them because they worked with him in Super Aguri.

okey but if Fabrega know a future information iam sure ALO know about it as well
the delusional poster who think who believes Honda will produce a good PU is delusion well he is delusion because Mclaren is not going anywhere except the Williams route so i excuse him if he thinks Honda will remain noncompetitive, just 14 days for them to bite their fingers in massive bitterness while spec 4 perform in COTA.

Your post doesnt make sense. It reads like you are saying Honda won't make a good engine but then you say spec 4 will be magic, which is magic that you can tell the future.

Also the Williams comparison is old and too simple so don't go there.

HAHA yeah my crystal ball telling me things
ALO care only for ALO he know there is huge upgrade coming in spec 4 its not magic from my side to know the future
there are many articles from several sources saying spec 4 is a major upgrade so anyway ALO will not sign new contract with Mclaren before evaluate the spec 4 if it really deliver he will give Mclaren the middle finger and sign with Honda true reason will be the massive wages but he will mask it with the power boost of spec 4.

[makecry]

okey but if Fabrega know a future information iam sure ALO know about it as well
the delusional poster who think who believes Honda will produce a good PU is delusion well he is delusion because Mclaren is not going anywhere except the Williams route so i excuse him if he thinks Honda will remain noncompetitive, just 14 days for them to bite their fingers in massive bitterness while spec 4 perform in COTA.

Your post doesnt make sense. It reads like you are saying Honda won't make a good engine but then you say spec 4 will be magic, which is magic that you can tell the future.

Also the Williams comparison is old and too simple so don't go there.

HAHA yeah my crystal ball telling me things
ALO care only for ALO he know there is huge upgrade coming in spec 4 its not magic from my side to know the future
there are many articles from several sources saying spec 4 is a major upgrade so anyway ALO will not sign new contract with Mclaren before evaluate the spec 4 if it really deliver he will give Mclaren the middle finger and sign with Honda true reason will be the massive wages but he will mask it with the power boost of spec 4.

Dude you make no sense. Both McLaren and Alonso have access to confidential information about Honda's plans for the future that you don't have. Both of them know what Honda is going to bring with spec 4. You don't. You are making baseless guesses with absolutely no information at hand. McLaren made a decision KNOWING WHAT SPEC 4 is. They made a decision knowing how Honda works. So stop this BS.

[marvin78]

Did they sign Honda with this "knowing"? You are wrong if you think, decisions in such companys are always made with "data" and "knowing". The biggest often are not.

[Thunder]

How much weight it had in the decision Process i don't know, but McLaren must have known pretty much everything about that Spec 4 PU. This is the Spec that should fix the PU (and the Realtionship at that Time) after all.

[Restomaniac]

The Renault PU aint looking too shabby in the races though... If they finally add a quali mode McLaren should be in the mix.

Indeed.
If the McLaren chassis is what I imagine it could be and Renault can get that Quali mode then.

What a mix this will be.
Hamilton
Vettel
Verstappen
Ricciardo
Alonso.

Another 2010 please.

[etusch]

How much weight it had in the decision Process i don't know, but McLaren must have known pretty much everything about that Spec 4 PU. This is the Spec that should fix the PU (and the Realtionship at that Time) after all.

If Honda says spec 4 will bring 30-40 hp and this make us 3d powerful engine, what's McLaren's data? Do you think Honda show them their work and McLaren guys saw it's wrong, it won't bring power?
No as you they just don't believe Honda can do that. All they know is a belief inside them

[makecry]

How much weight it had in the decision Process i don't know, but McLaren must have known pretty much everything about that Spec 4 PU. This is the Spec that should fix the PU (and the Realtionship at that Time) after all.

If Honda says spec 4 will bring 30-40 hp and this make us 3d powerful engine, what's McLaren's data? Do you think Honda show them their work and McLaren guys saw it's wrong, it won't bring power?
No as you they just don't believe Honda can do that. All they know is a belief inside them

Few question that I expect answers to just the way I have asked them. i.e. Post the answers to each question in a numbered manner so I understand the rationale behind your statement.

1) How do you know Spec 4 will being 30-40 bhp? I haven't seen anyone from Honda make that comment so I am kinda confused about that number and what that source is.

2)How will 30-40bhp help exactly? Efficiency is the key. Cranking out 30-40bhp more is not going to help unless they can run that for a longer amount of time.

3)What do you think Honda and McLaren were? Coz as far as I know they are "PARTNERS".
They work together, they have access to each other's data. Anyone who says otherwise is talking out of his ass.

4)How many deadlines has Honda missed? How many times has Honda said,"The update didn't work as planned?" or "It's not ready yet"

5)What is this belief you talk about? You think McLaren would let go of $700mill over next 7 years based on their "belief"? What do you think is going on here? An elementary school project?

[restless]

I was looking at the S1 section of the video where they put Hamilton and Alonso's Best Quali lap side by side. Alonso looses a ton of time down the straight(ok, that was a given). In the exit of Turn 2 they both get on the throttle at the same time (Fly Emirates add on the far left). By the time they complete the exit of turn 2 Alonso is already 7KPH behind in speed). Hamilton gets to turn 3 at 259 and comes off the throttle slightly. Alonso, still only at 249, takes it flat out (having never reached Hamilton's speed). Alonso and Hamilton both come off the throttle and brake for the approach for turn 4.
Turn 5 and 6 are fairly even and speed not power limited. Hamilton goes into turn 7 5 KPH faster than Alonso as the Honda can't get the car up to 237KPH in the time out of turn 6 and into 7, not sure why Alonso did NOT stay full throttle in turn 7 to get his speed up. He does go full throttle much earlier than Hamilton out of turn 7. Almost catching Hamilton's speed exiting turn 7. Then Hamilton goes Full throttle and by the time he gets to the braking spot for turn 8 (little over 50 Meters) from the corner, he at 298 KPH and 15 KPH faster than Alonso.

Anyone able to make such comparison with Verstappen or Riciardo?

[etusch]

Few question that I expect answers to just the way I have asked them. i.e. Post the answers to each question in a numbered manner so I understand the rationale behind your statement.

1) How do you know Spec 4 will being 30-40 bhp? I haven't seen anyone from Honda make that comment so I am kinda confused about that number and what that source is.

2)How will 30-40bhp help exactly? Efficiency is the key. Cranking out 30-40bhp more is not going to help unless they can run that for a longer amount of time.

3)What do you think Honda and McLaren were? Coz as far as I know they are "PARTNERS".
They work together, they have access to each other's data. Anyone who says otherwise is talking out of his ass.

4)How many deadlines has Honda missed? How many times has Honda said,"The update didn't work as planned?" or "It's not ready yet"

5)What is this belief you talk about? You think McLaren would let go of $700mill over next 7 years based on their "belief"? What do you think is going on here? An elementary school project?

1 I don’t know how powerfull spec 4. But I know hasegawa said we are planning to beat Renault. In my statement it is not important numbers but logic is important. Hasegawa said what I mentioned before divorce declared. So how you can assume that mclaren has data to show honda can’t be better or at least same level of Renault. What is your data or logic ? If hasegawa san says "I have numbers, we will beat renault before the end of the season", tell us which datas are mclaren looked and had a decision ?
2 I think this part no need to answer.
3 This is related number 1. There were partners but this not mean Honda or mclaren opened everything to each other. Where do you know they can reach each of data of other one?
4 Can you see difference start of season and now. Do you think all of that because of mcaren chassis?
5 Not me but you have to explain that how someone ( zak brown ) can say if they win next year we will look amateurish. If they are talking with data what that means ? If they made their decision what means “enough is enough” ?

[makecry]

Few question that I expect answers to just the way I have asked them. i.e. Post the answers to each question in a numbered manner so I understand the rationale behind your statement.

1) How do you know Spec 4 will being 30-40 bhp? I haven't seen anyone from Honda make that comment so I am kinda confused about that number and what that source is.

2)How will 30-40bhp help exactly? Efficiency is the key. Cranking out 30-40bhp more is not going to help unless they can run that for a longer amount of time.

3)What do you think Honda and McLaren were? Coz as far as I know they are "PARTNERS".
They work together, they have access to each other's data. Anyone who says otherwise is talking out of his ass.

4)How many deadlines has Honda missed? How many times has Honda said,"The update didn't work as planned?" or "It's not ready yet"

5)What is this belief you talk about? You think McLaren would let go of $700mill over next 7 years based on their "belief"? What do you think is going on here? An elementary school project?

1)I don’t know how powerfull spec 4. But I know hasegawa said we are planning to beat Renault. In my statement it is not important numbers but logic is important. Hasegawa said what I mentioned before divorce declared. So how you can assume that mclaren has data to show honda can’t be better or at least same level of Renault. What is your data or logic ? If hasegawa san says "I have numbers, we will beat renault before the end of the season", tell us which datas are mclaren looked and had a decision ?
2 I think this part no need to answer.
3 This is related number 1. There were partners but this not mean Honda or mclaren opened everything to each other. Where do you know they can reach each of data of other one?
4 Can you see difference start of season and now. Do you think all of that because of mcaren chassis?
5 Not me but you have to explain that how someone ( zak brown ) can say if they win next year we will look amateurish. If they are talking with data what that means ? If they made their decision what means “enough is enough” ?

1)So how can you say 30-40bhp? You gave us that number so I am asking you where that number came from. Hasegawa in 2016 said they could match Ferrari without token system.Didn't happen. Hasegawa-san in 2016-2017 winter break said they will match 2016 Mercedes PU or that's what their goal is, Didn't happen, so on what basis are you trusting him now?

3)Yes they are works outfit. They have full access to each other's F1 program. That's what a works outfit is. McLaren produces a lot of hybrid components for Honda's PU. They will continue doing so next year too when Honda supplies STR next year.

4)You didn't answer the question. The question wasn't whether Honda has made progress or not because yes they have made progress. I will repeat the question again "How many deadlines has Honda missed? How many times has Honda said,"The update didn't work as planned?" or "It's not ready yet".

5)Zak was asked a question about will they regret the decision and the answer is pretty much obvious "If they win, we regret, if they don't we dont regret". How exactly is he supposed to answer that question otherwise? It's pretty obvious.

You are trying to tell us McLaren is shooting in the dark on their PU switch. They have more data on Honda PU, the way they work, their facilities and everything than you can comprehend, their decision is an informed decision NOT some random guess work.

[dren]

It seems that Mclaren has been trying to divorce Honda since preseason testing. Honda has obviously progressed a lot since then. We don't know if they have hit all their targets or not.

I wonder if Renault made Mclaren sign a contract stating they won't badmouth the PU performance in public. I think they made Red Bull sign one if I remember right.

[PlatinumZealot]

I wonder if Renault made Mclaren sign a contract stating they won't badmouth the PU performance in public. I think they made Red Bull sign one if I remember right.

You can bet they did! I think Honda had McLaren sign one too after that "GP2 engine!" outburst from Alonso. McLaren have complained about power but outright disrespect on the levels of RedBull did not happen in recent memory.

[loner]

Dude you make no sense. Both McLaren and Alonso have access to confidential information about Honda's plans for the future that you don't have. Both of them know what Honda is going to bring with spec 4. You don't. You are making baseless guesses with absolutely no information at hand. McLaren made a decision KNOWING WHAT SPEC 4 is. They made a decision knowing how Honda works. So stop this BS.

focus .. Hasegawa said the spec 4 will surpass Renault this is the so called confidential information you claimed that
Mclaren know but it seems they don't believe it,non of my business .. i believe Hasegawa end of the story.
COTA is the date (based on statement from Eric B and Fabrega ) w'll see who is right and who will be bitter.

[daren_p]

2)How will 30-40bhp help exactly? Efficiency is the key. Cranking out 30-40bhp more is not going to help unless they can run that for a longer amount of time.

This is currently a fuel restricted formula, so anytime you increase power at max fuel flow you automatically increase efficiency.

focus .. Hasegawa said the spec 4 will surpass Renault this is the so called confidential information you claimed that
Mclaren know but it seems they don't believe it,non of my business .. i believe Hasegawa end of the story.
COTA is the date (based on statement from Eric B and Fabrega ) w'll see who is right and who will be bitter.

Did Hasegawa actually state spec 4 would surpass Renault? I don't recall seeing this ever posted, all I recall is him saying they "hope" to surpass Renault by the end of the year, which are two very different things. They also "hoped" to be on the podium towards the end of the last two seasons & we all know how well that worked out. Until it actually happens or is specifically stated, we should not be going on "hope".