Bernie Vs. Melbourne

[bizadfar]

In defence of scrapping melbourne; that track has rarely provided interesting races. It has no fast corners or overtaking opportunities. In fact id rather go back to adelaide.

No fast corners, are you on --- crack? Apex speeds 2007: 212km/h Guess what corner that is, yea and its not T5 which is taken flat if you got a good car udner you.

It sure isn't

very logical to spread F1 races all over the Globe and then try and tailor the schedules to suit just one market. It's like Bernie's saying: "Look, the locals aren't a priority. Their taxpayer money is, but we cater to a European audience first and foremost, you've just gotta deal with it. Any takers?" Such a message doesn't say much about the trust Ecclestone places in the real remaining Global potential of the sport. Basically, it seems like the main part of the business will still be driven by a geographical and demographical minority (as TV viewers or tourists), other areas serving merely as subcontractors or suitable outsourcing locations. As much as I like Formula One, were I bestowed with the public trust as an elected leader (or even dictatorial power over), say, of an ascending Asian nation, the economics, the cultural aspect and even the symbolism of this arrangement would seem all wrong to me - i.e. "no sale".

Exactly my thoughts. He keeps saying the move into dodgy corrupt Dubai/India slums will be global thing for F1. Then he caters for an European audience, f'in twat.

The reality is an 8pm race for Melbourne wouldn't be a major move for them and is practical in many ways. It's still daylight until after 8pm in March anyway so it could be a twilight race.

Likewise, the GP has lost a lot of money the past two years - exacerbated by the loss of the V8 support race and last year the World Swimming Champs were also on the same week.

Bernie does have a point - the potential audience pool Europe-wide is over 500 million people. I assume if he could move the GP to a better time-slot for Europe (9-12am-ish in Europe if it was done at 8pm local time) then he could probably offer them cheaper hosting rights because of higher TV revenue elsewhere.

I stay at a house about 100m from Albert Park usually during the GP weekend and moving the race to 8pm would mean there would be less noise for at least half the day for a change.

As for the 'green' concerns. Honestly, the environmental impact of running the lights would be about 1/1000th that of the cars. It's not even an issue.

R

V8s are back. Btw I've never really seen a house 100m from the track just apartments

It does baffle me why people think energy is precious. I'm all for being "greener" but i don't think people really have enough information on a given energy burning issue to know what would be greener.

for example, the AGP is currently on during the night in Europe.. For the millions of fans in Europe watching the race they are using energy during hours they would usually be asleep. i would argue that the amount of power used to light up a race track for a few hours pales into insignificance compared to all the lights, kettles, televisions, etc that the European fans will use this coming weekend at about 4am.

But i'm just guessing. It sounds fair to me. Anyway F1 has always been a mix of sport and business. If a race is losing money and could make more money in other ways then thats where the sport goes.

Anyway i'd love to see a night race in Australia! What a great spectacle! Plus more fans in Europe would be able to watch it. How can that be a bad thing?

I love the AGP but i have to say opening a season in the middle of the night (for the biggest percentage of F1 fans worldwide) is a bit of an anti climax. I prefer it when Bahrain started the season, even if it is "like driving round Heathrow airport" as Mark Webber so eloquently put it.

And the people outside of Europe wasting that energy to watch races anywhere from 12am-4am (yea and they're not live at least here most of the time).

Bernie.. what an ass. Its a global sport. You have races, and fans, in the Americas, in Europe, in Asia. Obviously races will be on at odd hours for some people. Just let it be. Hasn't been an issue yet. Dumb to cater just to one audience.

Agree,
There is no solution to this, deal with it. If we've (I mean all in a radically different TZ than Europe) managed for decades, why are you bitching about 2-3 races (Canada, Brazil, Aus)

A little perspective

to back the conversation up, courtesy of grandprix.com (read the whole article there): The constant pursuit of numbers

Bernie Ecclestone is a man who likes numbers. They are the way in which he can measure progress. His chief aim is to expand the Formula 1 circus year after year, pushing up the number of viewers, and reaching the widest possible audience around the world. It is a process that has been going on since the 1970s when Formula 1 was a much less organised activity than it is today.

...

If only that was true buddy.... the Aus GP just about brings the most spectators out of all F1 GPs over the weekend. Hardly any traffic problems either.

[Rob W]

I stay at a house about 100m from Albert Park usually during the GP weekend and moving the race to 8pm would mean there would be less noise for at least half the day for a change.

V8s are back. Btw I've never really seen a house 100m from the track just apartments

Canterbury Road, Middle Park. Walk out the front door, cross the road and tram-tracks and I'm in Albert Park. Maybe it's only 75m away actually. I was exaggerating.

R

[Rob W]

some of you just don't get it, do you....

...the writing's on the wall: BERNIE DOES NOT WANT F1 IN AUSTRALIA ANYMORE. hasn't for at least a good 18 months now.

I sort of doubt this notion. It is in his interest to keep his sport spread out around the globe. It aids international interest for TV and for global sponsors. (ever wonder why he moved to the US? Added to Canada it opens up the sponsorship market for teams and the sport itself).

For example, they moved to Asia and suddenly Lenovo is interested in F1 and turns to Williams. Levono wanted to grow it's global reach - in particular through Australasia. Ditto for Johnny Walker - they sponsored McLaren to reach into the Asian market, the biggest whiskey market in the world. Many more examples could be made.

The middle east and former eastern Europe are the areas I think he'll try to add as growing markets - I'm pretty sure it will be at the expense of races in Europe, not the far flung places like Australia, Japan and Brazil - which all have truly massive passions for motorsport and histories to match. Why remove those fan-bases and sponsorship potentials when removing one of the nine or so races in Europe wouldn't degrade much of anything.

Bernie is pushing for cash. Every race pays a different amount - factored by location, importance to F1, willingness to bend over forwards for F1 etc. Australia will move their race time (either in Melbourne or elsewhere) or they'll lose it.

R

[Expo]

And the people outside of Europe wasting that energy to watch races anywhere from 12am-4am (yea and they're not live at least here most of the time).

I was referring to the fact that a higher percentage of F1 viewers globally are based in Europe. Races that are on during the night in Europe are likely to have a bigger effect on energy usage compared to other countries.

Anyway this is just a guess but sounds plausible.

the writing's on the wall: BERNIE DOES NOT WANT F1 IN AUSTRALIA ANYMORE. hasn't for at least a good 18 months now.

Well considering the business nature of F1 this could be true. After all the population of India is 1.1 Billion compared to Australia's 20.4 million. Why should Australia keep a race when another country with much a higher audience potential (which in turn means more business potential for all the teams) wants a race.

I'm not saying it's right, personally i enjoy the AGP. But this is business as much as it's sport.

[Expo]

sorry.. post was duplicated!

[Tom Castellani]

I'm not saying it's right, personally i enjoy the AGP. But this is business as much as it's sport.

I agree to an extent, however it is when business begins to have more of an influence than the sport itself that F1 will become a lost cause. If not for the love, for what?... Money? Popularity?

The other point I was making initially which I would like to reiterate is that after one planned night race, this is the third mention of another one. The first one hasn't even happened yet! It's almost as if night races have become a new fad whereas although I admit Singapore will be cool, why not just stick to regular daylight for now... Maybe it's not such a bad idea in Melbourne's case but I still feel that if Bernie could control time to cater for a bigger audience, he would. Right now he's just doing the next best thing. I agree with some of the things that have been said here and F1 is a GLOBAL sport. Now all of a sudden Australia is a hindrance because it's inconveniently placed on the globe for Bernie and his billions.

[Rob W]

Now all of a sudden Australia is a hindrance because it's inconveniently placed on the globe for Bernie and his billions.

The thing is though, it isn't really. Australia is ideally placed for viewers in the fastest growing motorsport viewing market - Asia.

Malaysia, China, Japan, Taiwan etc are growing and increasingly influential markets for F1 whereas Europe, although far further down the track, has little growth left in it. This surely is a consideration for Bernie allowing Germany and Italy to only host 1 GP each now (altho this doesn't explain Valencia which boggles - maybe he wants to put pressure on Catalunya if Valencia does well).

In the end Bernie is clearly about keeping things fresh. He surely wants an Aussie GP - because it is a defacto extra Asian GP (TV and sponsorship-wise), but he wants them to modernise. Singapore/KL/China are moving forward, Melbourne needs to also.

R

[SZ]

rob, i wouldn't doubt the notion at all.

australia will get on fine without F1. it's a tired event with very exaggerated attendance. the track is boring and to be fair - without it being the first race of the year having any serious propensity of carnage in dry weather with new drivers and untested cars - it'd be mind-numbingly uninteresting.

lenovo will continue to sell laptops and johnny walker some scotch whiskey in australia, f1 or not. australia's a developed market for either make - the people cashed up enough to spend money on a GP weekend aren't going to be swayed by a few hours of lewis zipping around in a silver blur that ---, tonight a bottle of johnny walker would go down phenomenally. or that when it comes time to get a new laptop, lenovo's the go. the sponsors don't particularly care either. there's far more exposure that your average australian gives a damn about at far less cost on a the side of a v8 supercar - if they're really worried about an asian market or any penetration here.

on that, australia doesn't really sponsor motorsport. any australian at the cutting edge of their two or four wheeled game has one thing in common - that they got there the hard way with bugger all support from home relative to their international competitors. then again, whilst australia does have an undeniably talented F1 driver in it's ranks, he's also the unluckiest driver on the grid. any ten year old kid in australia can reel of a few v8 supercar drivers names, knows who casey stoner and troy bayliss are without issue, but will have trouble naming the country's current best driver. this isn't a new phenomenon either - ask your average australian which brabham last drove in f1? (i daresay if you asked your average indian or malay child which of their own last tested an F1 car, they'd have a better chance of getting it right. why? awareness, promotional opportunities that just don't exist in australia. and that's down to interest, demand.)

australia might be an APEC signatory however most australians aren't terribly interested in what happens in the rest of asia, nor vice versa. most malays are very interested however in what happens in an ex-state that declared independence some 50 years ago and has since overtaken malaysia in many important social indicators, so having two races in a small region with bugger all motorsports history, synergy, drivers, whatever makes plenty of sense if you're in it for the milking of two nations with disproportionately large ego's. "malaysia boleh!", remember.

australia does not have a massive passion for motorsport. australia has a small part of it's population with a messianic belief in (indigenous) v8 supercar racing. it has a strong, small but steady contingent of people happy to drive three hours from a major city to see an excellent round of SBK or motogp. it has a great street setup in brisbane that serves indycar well. it has a diminishing number of people that will attend a three day procession wherein the headline act, featuring a bunch of largely euro-based toffs - is too fast to catch moving, and at any rate, where all the racing takes place in pit lane.

for australians are a warm fun-loving culture and enjoy a good time. they will clearly pay to see real racing and the diminishing state of it in f1 is increasingly removed from the australian palette. the (very) few australians that give a --- about just what tweak mclaren has on it's sidepod this week have been getting up at all hours - that's right, when there's bugger all revenue in tv advertising - to watch f1 anyway since they knew the sport. the same free-tot-air channel that carries it this year will run NASCAR at a more palatable hour. speaks volumes about which is more marketable - the pinnacle of motorsport that runs once a year in the city or a foreign formula very, very few australians are familiar with, lesser still of which have ever seen live.

there has been a small but strident group of people around albert park that took severe offence to having the park turned on it's head a few months a year to setup the GP, let alone the noise it makes whilst running, (let alone the notion that a GP used to run there 50 odd years ago). these people were widely regarded as selfish, narrow-minded, hardline hippy killjoys and peripheral to the views of the main population at best. environmental issues are now far more prevalent to the australian cause, and opportunities to flaunt excess (a GP weekend, let alone a GP weekend held under a ridiculous amount of lighting) sees a growing number of average australians disenfranchised with the current event. demand it be held at night, and the aforementioned hardline hippy killjoys - which noone really took any notice of - now have a legitimate voice. this isn't lost on bernie.

australia is home to 20 million people of which a minority actually attend the GP religiously. if you took all the above factors and applied it to india or russia, you'd still have far more support.

i'd never compare the AGP to japan or brazil. the former country has one of the richest general automotive and motorsports cultures in the word and a truly global presence in both, the latter is home to one of f1's favorite - and no doubt fastest - sons. you will not remove f1 from the senna heartland, ever, as it's (rightly) impossible to take away his legacy from f1.

australians - as a culture - aren't so insecure as to believe their home "needs" a GP to have "made it". but australians don't like being held to ransom either. the notion of an uppity pom telling a nation that the rights to a GP will cost a taxpayer more, that the cost of running an event already a net loss of the state need double to stage it at night - inconveniencing people as far as 20km away that'd prefer to sleep - "or else" - well, the average australian reaction is to tell said pom to take himself and his circus away and that he can go forth procreate with himself.

again, not lost on bernie and a machiavellian masterstroke.

just when i was thinking that sure, if the sky fell and melbourne bent over backwards, bernie could be cornered into keeping an aus gp at a price, the latest news rolls in - http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_ ... t_id=34080, bernie wants a 3am start. he's mastered the australian public ire hook, line and sinker. by the time he's done only the most irrational aussie fanboys - that will still watch every gp live at all hours - would want to entertain the notion of having a local race. no pressure for bernie to renew, no PR backlash in nations where f1 is more prevalent or important. brilliant.

i'm wondering if this 3am demand is going to be enough. if bernie's got his estimations of the australian public right, then word should arrive from on high (government) confirming that the race will not exist beyond the current contract any moment now. if he hits the home run there'll be an announcement that (given public vibe, disillusion with bernie, inability to meet unreasonable demands etc) it's going to be terminated BEFORE the current contract expires in 2010. which would be more cash at another location a year sooner. really depends how seriously he's taken by government and like i said, brilliant. his best chance to drum up displeasure at having the race here is this weekend. if he doesn't make a kill this year, look for him to start talking about the race in the past tense when he gets to australia next year.

he is, seriously, brilliant in business and all budding entrepeneurs should take note. if you read the press over the last few years, bernie has telegraphed this move for a while. you can't deny he has a clear vision and a good appreciation for just where the money's at.

rob i am an f1 fanboy, i have followed the sport religiously for years and i live in melbourne, australia. i would very much like to see a race here forever - or somewhere close enough for me to go see it - but i'm a realist too, i can see validity in other points of view, and i can see the writing on the wall.

but i lived though it being in adelaide and watching it on tv, and this won't stop me getting up to watch it at all hours when it's anywhere else.

[WhiteBlue]

wonderfull write up SZ =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

we are now reading about alternative moves:

http://f1.automoto365.com/news/controll ... s_id=30964

So what is the point of taking F1 to Sydney? If Sydney needs a motorsport center and the gov is willing to invest there would it make sense in terms of people attending? would more people come to Sydney than are comming to Melbourne now?

probably not.

so, paying for the GP it would still have to be a night race and perhaps it would still have to be a shared race with Malaysia to be affordable. the price for a race is going up to US $ 35 mil in the future. does it make sense for Australia to have the race under such conditions?

[SZ]

wonderfull write up SZ =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

we are now reading about alternative moves:

http://f1.automoto365.com/news/controll ... s_id=30964

So what is the point of taking F1 to Sydney? If Sydney needs a motorsport center and the gov is willing to invest there would it make sense in terms of people attending? would more people come to Sydney than are comming to Melbourne now?

probably not.

so, paying for the GP it would still have to be a night race and perhaps it would still have to be a shared race with Malaysia to be affordable. the price for a race is going up to US $ 35 mil in the future. does it make sense for Australia to have the race under such conditions?

WhiteBlue; in essence I agree with you.

There's no point other than to Justify a serious upgrade of Eastern Creek. Sure, there are some that are into the whole inter-state rivalry thing wherein Melbourne nicked every sporting event bar Indycar and the 2000 Olympics, but realistically at this stage this is just part of a feasibility study that justifies how much money could be dedicated to upgrading Eastern Creek. The NSW govt will naturally hit back with "F1 is not enough", and the proposal will naturally have been expanded to "we could do SBK and V8's too and have the trifecta."

It's about as effective as Philip Island Grand Prix Circuit's owners saying they'd be prepared to make major investments to accommodate F1 if they got the race. Which, naturally, has actually been said. Anyone with a permanent circuit would be prepared to examine the possibility of spending a little money to make a whole lot more. There's even a few people with large amounts of cash wanting to setup a new track in Geelong. Having the cash from the Australian side is only half the story. I don't doubt Eastern Creek could do it theoretically but that's only half it.

It'll only get serious when they say a dick o'clock start is OK, when the neighbours promise they won't get pissed off with the noise, when families decide that taking kids to see the races at said hour on a Sunday night is spiffy, when a race at such a time attracts the kind of people families will want to go to anyway, they'll put on a floodlight display with enough power to vaporise every ecomentalist within a 5,000km radius before they get the chance to say "environmental feasibility study", when they get permission to host night races semi-regularly to justify investment in additional lighting, when the relevant state declares the Monday after the race a public holiday so people involved/going don't get fired for skipping work, when contractors for the GP find a government happy to pay penalties on race day +1 to start the teardown on said public holiday... oh and importantly, when Bernie pauses before a new and highly original excuse to take the race out of Australia should all those conditions be met.

And that last bit won't happen, as the only thing illuminating about needing night races in Australia is that the will to take F1 out of here should be lit up quite clearly.

It won't be shared with Malaysia because (a) a move to any permanent circuit in Australia would necessitate any works having a payback period 2x as long plus interest, which isn't desirable, and (b) as Malaysia won't share unless Singapore is sharing too in the same year. They certainly won't share with each other.

It would take a phenomenally good race and event in 09 for reasons unique to Melbourne to convince anyone it's worth extending beyond 2010.

[Chaparral]

If I can just jump in here guys - the ARDC have just commissioned a firm (at a cost of $350,000) to do the feasabilty study on expanding Eastern Creek in Sydney to a duel circuit operation and up to FIA F1 sanctioning standards. The ARDC would not be spending that sort of money on a pipe dream let me tell you. I think there will be some serious dscussions going on between Ecclestone and the NSW government already - so whilst I agree Melbourne is most likely to lose the GP I doubt at this stage it will leave Australia.

[Chaparral]

Here are some TV numbers from 2007 for the Australian market - around 2.6 million for the GP weekend in total which is good numbers for this market however Sydney lags well behind Melbourne in viewers. Interestingly the next largest audience is for the Japanese event (which was broadcast live - well a 60 minute delay in fact) but mid afternoon Sunday. It would be interesting to see numbers from the TV networks in Japan, Malaysia, China etc given we're all in a similiar time zone. The lights issue with Melbourne is a load of bollocks to be honest - its as SZ says just an excuse or get out clause for BE especially if he can drag the extra millions out of the NSW government


Formula One World Championship
Total Individuals
2007

Description 2nd Description 5 City Metro Sydney Melbourne Brisbane Adelaide Perth
AUSTRALIAN FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - DAY 1 ROUND 1 - AUSTRALIAN FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX (FRI) 155,209 38,257 40,584 25,336 32,977 18,054
AUSTRALIAN FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - DAY 2 ROUND 1 - AUSTRALIAN FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX (SAT) 340,156 78,301 128,148 43,550 63,543 26,612
AUST FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - RACE PREVIEW ROUND 1 - AUSTRALIAN FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX (SUN) 434,299 93,696 173,903 55,441 85,794 25,464
AUST FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - RACE ROUND 1 - AUSTRALIAN FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX (SUN) 1,045,019 215,502 484,695 113,403 158,716 72,703
AUST FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - RACE HIGHLIGHTS ROUND 1 - AUSTRALIAN FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX (SUN) 641,664 110,438 308,215 72,618 109,757 40,636
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 2 - MALAYSIA (QUAL - SAT) 144,505 13,975 76,509 19,098 13,611 21,312
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 2 - MALAYSIA (SUN) 226,084 62,567 75,039 35,260 25,840 27,379
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFER ROUND 3 - BAHRAIN (QUAL - SAT) 162,018 14,221 92,236 11,083 12,085 32,393
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 3 - BAHRAIN (SUN) 274,145 80,991 98,117 29,049 30,718 35,270
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 4 - SPAIN (QUALIFYING - SAT) 136,426 35,505 67,026 7,917 13,185 12,793
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 4 - SPAIN (SUN) 187,925 60,438 54,889 28,385 24,413 19,800
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 5 - MONACO (QUAL - SAT) 143,497 23,117 51,597 23,676 26,058 19,048
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 5 - MONACO (SUN) 204,355 80,605 54,843 23,961 23,339 21,607
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 6 - CANADA (QUAL - SAT) 38,547 4,877 12,053 13,241 3,950 4,427
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 6 - CANADA (SUN) 91,898 33,957 19,508 18,096 10,395 9,942
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 7 - USA (QUAL - SAT) 41,493 18,207 14,369 3,843 1,666 3,409
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 7 - USA (SUN) 75,101 21,395 27,077 11,608 4,673 10,348
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPSIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 8 - FRANCE (QUAL - SAT) 47,342 20,158 13,217 4,642 7,514 1,811
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 8 - FRANCE (SUN) 197,891 63,713 66,949 26,380 25,468 15,381
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 9 - GREAT BRITAIN (QUAL - SAT) 173,049 15,583 85,573 6,508 35,549 29,837
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 9 - GREAT BRITAIN (SUN) 205,028 68,314 73,465 20,579 23,527 19,143
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 10 - EUROPE (QUAL - SAT) 181,378 47,779 73,250 15,150 27,530 17,668
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 10 - EUROPE (SUN) 322,655 102,311 99,308 41,644 38,709 40,683
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 11 - HUNGARY (QUAL - SAT) 132,088 22,375 39,028 20,789 37,290 12,605
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 11 - HUNGARY (SUN) 304,876 93,599 89,767 46,410 40,793 34,307
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 12 - TURKEY (QUAL - SAT) 158,358 39,079 55,578 20,468 24,814 18,419
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 12 - TURKEY (SUN) 140,902 33,551 48,698 17,942 24,137 16,574
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 13 - ITALY (QUALIFYING HIGHLIGHTS - SAT) 35,160 14,804 6,598 5,702 2,408 5,647
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 13 - ITALY (SUN) 55,331 17,599 10,609 4,239 15,308 7,576
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 14 - BELGIUM (QUAL - SAT) 50,549 25,560 8,304 8,176 6,532 1,977
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 14 - BELGIUM (SUN) 201,747 47,168 66,117 14,226 46,429 27,807
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 15 - JAPAN (QUALIFYING - SAT) 71,601 24,165 12,483 5,812 14,554 14,586
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 15 - JAPAN (SUN) 401,074 63,510 175,792 74,108 49,412 38,252
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 - QUALIFIER ROUND 16 - CHINA (QUALIFYING - SAT) 114,114 35,486 34,391 13,966 20,984 9,287
FIA FORMULA ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 2007 ROUND 16 - CHINA (SUN) 69,442 19,617 14,063 7,807 11,557 16,398

[SZ]

If I can just jump in here guys - the ARDC have just commissioned a firm (at a cost of $350,000) to do the feasabilty study on expanding Eastern Creek in Sydney to a duel circuit operation and up to FIA F1 sanctioning standards. The ARDC would not be spending that sort of money on a pipe dream let me tell you. I think there will be some serious dscussions going on between Ecclestone and the NSW government already - so whilst I agree Melbourne is most likely to lose the GP I doubt at this stage it will leave Australia.

The ARDC has a bit of a problem with the impending Oran Park closure and needs to do something given Eastern Creek is generally very nearly booked to capacity as is. They've no other option but to investigate upgrading Eastern Creek. I would be surprised if every upgrade on the table hinges on an F1 contract being present or not, but it's no surprise Eastern Creek could do with a make-over, nor that F1's part of the feasibility analysis in a "and if we got this event, we could afford to do this" context.

Trouble is A$350k is not a great deal of money in the context of what emergent nations are prepared to do to build a brand new site, and as it's not going into Bernie's pockets regardless. The real argument is which venue will do this best, not which in Australia is best for F1.

If it goes to Eastern Creek for any period of time it won't be the ADRC spending A$350k that mattered, it'd be the NSW government bankrolling the millions Victorians won't cough up to continue funding the event.

Sale to the highest overall bidder, then, where "overall" means "greatest net revenue".

[Chaparral]

Thats very true SZ with the closure of Oran Park the only city venue is Eastern Creek which indeed does run close to capacity now - just getting track time is a problem if you want to run historics track days as a friend of mine does and its not inexpensive $15,000 a day.

To the ARDC who lease the track from the NSW government $350,000 is a great deal of money let me assure you and money they dont need to spend when under their leasing arrangement the operation runs at a profit these days without any changes needing to be made. There was talk initially thatTony Perich the owner of Oran Park would build a circuit to replace the Park somewhere further South West but that isnt happening so Eastern Creek is it for the Sydney basin. Forget a street circuit around Homebush Bay Olympic site - thats not going to happen despite Bernie Cochrane of V8 Supercars bluff and bluster the government arent interested when they own Eastern Creek. I say this feasibility study is very much aligned with talks already occuring between NSW government and BE - we shall see.