2018 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, April 6-8

[NathanOlder]

Because of reliability, do your homework next time instead of hate posts.

Oh my.... do your homework they say.

So you have done yours ??

2017..... Max had 4 in race retirements due to mechanical issues.
Bahrain - Brakes
Canada - Electrics
Azerbaijan - Engine
Spa - Engine

You knew that obviously.

Daniel had 5 + 1 (being punted off the road by max in Hungary )

Australia - Engine
Russia - Brakes
USA - Engine
Mexico - Turbo
AbuDhabi - Hydraulics

You choose to ignore this ?

Also I'd like to add, Danny had more mechanicals towards the end of the year when the Red Bull was a stronger car.

So all of this added up means Max had loads more points than danny..... oh wait.

Dont acuse people of being haters when the facts back them up.

[NathanOlder]

It is kind of pathetic, this Verstappen bashing by some of you guys.

I guess you ‘all’ feel threatened by the idea that Verstappen is actually of the same caliber as Hamilton- and perhaps even better, because I still haven’t seen him park his car in another, at the end of the pitlane.

I will leave you ‘all’ to it, enjoy.

And I've not seen max win a title in a single seater , your point being ?

Here you go;

https://youtu.be/aCvFybEDFLc

I didnt mean Karting. I meant a race car. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

[Jolle]

For me there are two kinds of great champions. The first kind are composed, take no risks, like Prost and Stewart. They drive/drove safe but fast, minimising risks. Then you have the second type, the ones on the edge and sometimes going too far. Senna had lots of mash ups like this, so did Hamilton and also Schumacher when he was challenged (especially all in their first half of their career). For all the rest in their driving only came after many years and after their first or second championship (when they got their hands on a dominant car and easy teammate). To me Verstappen isn't Hamilton '15 or Senna '91 yet, but he is a Senna '87. Fast, daring and exciting.

He will test his and his competitors limits for some time and thats a good thing. We don't want 5 Prosts at the start at a race, we need Senna's.

[George-Jung]

And I've not seen max win a title in a single seater , your point being ?

Here you go;

https://youtu.be/aCvFybEDFLc

I didnt mean Karting. I meant a race car. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

Hahaha of course.. no hard feelings.

if you mean Formula cars.. it is because of Max’s steep curve. He went from karts to F3 which he almost won in his debute year and having most wins if I am not mistaken- to F1.. and when he entered F1 he wasn’t immediately in a WDC winning car.....such as Hamilton had with his ‘Ferrari’.

So your point being?

[Edax]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgT02D3L5p8

Remember ROS vs HAM Spa? Similar placement of 2 cars, here everyone said ROS needs to get out of it. Why not Hamilton this time?

Thais isn't difficult to understand. Rosberg is behind and CHOSE to try to go around the outside. It's a completely different scenario to the person behind overtaking and forcing someone wide. If that was allowed then all a following car has to d is throw it up the inside and the car on the outside has to drive off the track every time. It's startling that you think these situations are comparable.

Remember Ros vs Ham Canada first corner? That was same situation Ham pushed Rosberg on grass no penalty, Ros vs Verstappen Hockenheim Rosberg got penalty, Ros vs Hamilton in Austria same situation Rosberg got penalty. Ros vs Kimi in Malaysia also got penalty. Hamilton is no nice guy but Verstappen is guilty here and if his race wasnt already ruined he would probably got 5 or 10s penalty.

I think there is method to the FIA madness.

A divebomb is not allowed. A divebomb is when you enter the corner on the inside with too much speed to either make the clipping point or even the even exit of the corner. That is what Vettel got penalised for in China, or rosberg in austria.

It is also not allowed to force the other out when he is ahead at the midway point you got to give him room. Case at point Ocon and Perez in Baku.

But when you enter a corner on the inside and with good control and you are ahead at the midway point then you are allowed to take the ideal line out. Even if it means forcing the other wide. Like rosberberg and Hamilton in Canada and Austin. Makes sense since you i) cannot expect from a driver to take a tighter line in and a tighter line out and make a pass and ii) the guy on the outside has much more grip and room to work with to take evasive action.

So what Hamilton did was at his own risk. Question is whether it was smart from VES to answer the call. But seeing how difficult it is with the RB to pass a Merc on straightline speed, this was probably the only chance he would get to get ahead. If you don’t take these chances you end up like Bottas.

[Brenton]

Makes sense since you i) cannot expect from a driver to take a tighter line in and a tighter line out and make a pass

You're arguing that driver's shouldn't have to race side by side because it's harder than using the solo racing line?

Coming from an American background, F1 has confused me greatly lately in that it's considered okay to cut off anyone alongside you. It's their "right" as Brundle always says. Anyone racing that way in stock cars would be launched into the wall multiple times a race, for good reason.

I love F1 but don't understand the widespread acceptance of effectively banning side by side racing. The F1 view seems to be that side by side racing only happens if a driver who has the slight lead decides to make the foolish mistake of not running the other driver off the track. It's accepted and normal to run your opponent off track at first opportunity now.

Strangley I remember F1 not being this way 10 or even 5 years ago. Side by side racing was normal before. Now that tracks have become parking lots with painted on racing lines, there's space to push your opponent off on corner exits. What's surprising is the cultural change to go with it, codifying this style pioneered by Schumacher, Hamilton, Verstappen, etc.. I guess when our heros do it, it becomes normal and accepted. But it makes F1 less fun to watch because there's no battles... Either an over take happens or it doesn't.

Just my perspective... I'm open to seeing it differently.

[PlatinumZealot]

For me there are two kinds of great champions. The first kind are composed, take no risks, like Prost and Stewart. They drive/drove safe but fast, minimising risks. Then you have the second type, the ones on the edge and sometimes going too far. Senna had lots of mash ups like this, so did Hamilton and also Schumacher when he was challenged (especially all in their first half of their career). For all the rest in their driving only came after many years and after their first or second championship (when they got their hands on a dominant car and easy teammate). To me Verstappen isn't Hamilton '15 or Senna '91 yet, but he is a Senna '87. Fast, daring and exciting.

He will test his and his competitors limits for some time and thats a good thing. We don't want 5 Prosts at the start at a race, we need Senna's.

Gonna defend Hamilton here. He has never ran into another driver's car when making a racing overtake. His mashups with Massa and Webber were all down to those guys. Max on the other hand has quite the record of outright ramming peoole off the road.

[langedweil]

This way no one will understand this game much longer. Plz, quit that incomprehensible rulebook fetish ...

Why don't all those who want complete chaos watch demolition derbies instead of F1.... Rules are rules, follow them or deal with the consequences.

You can’t honestly be serious, right?
Har gets 2pts for something Per screwed up?
Per jumps Har, gets a time-penalty.
Har does not fix Per’s mistake, and gets a time-penalty + 2pts.

Why the points !?!? It’s not like it was extremely dangerous?
That has little to-do with opting for a demolition derby, which is ridiculous.

[Shrieker]

"The Mexican driver" or "the Mexican driver Perez" would be ok though, wouldn't it? Or is the whole of the North American continent now populated solely by people primed to take offense at anything and everything?

No from my experience people there are people, not everyone, here in the UK that are VERY prepared to take offense at things that I did not know existed before!

That's called PC culture and it's pure cancer.

[dans79]

What's surprising is the cultural change to go with it, codifying this style pioneered by Schumacher, Hamilton, Verstappen, etc.. I guess when our heros do it, it becomes normal and accepted. But it makes F1 less fun to watch because there's no battles... Either an over take happens or it doesn't.

Can't really expect much when they are gearing the sport up to entertain the unwashed masses. So many hear want drivers to be gladiators like in roman times.

[TheFluffy]

For me there are two kinds of great champions. The first kind are composed, take no risks, like Prost and Stewart. They drive/drove safe but fast, minimising risks. Then you have the second type, the ones on the edge and sometimes going too far. Senna had lots of mash ups like this, so did Hamilton and also Schumacher when he was challenged (especially all in their first half of their career). For all the rest in their driving only came after many years and after their first or second championship (when they got their hands on a dominant car and easy teammate). To me Verstappen isn't Hamilton '15 or Senna '91 yet, but he is a Senna '87. Fast, daring and exciting.

He will test his and his competitors limits for some time and thats a good thing. We don't want 5 Prosts at the start at a race, we need Senna's.

Gonna defend Hamilton here. He has never ran into another driver's car when making a racing overtake. His mashups with Massa and Webber were all down to those guys.

I agree that this incident was not Hamilton's fault but saying the past incidents are completely not his fault is so false. Are you a Hamilton fan or something? Look at this video to re-calibrate your past encounters.

[Nathanael F1]

Gonna defend Hamilton here. He has never ran into another driver's car when making a racing overtake. His mashups with Massa and Webber were all down to those guys. Max on the other hand has quite the record of outright ramming peoole off the road.

What about Hamilton and Rosberg? Off the top of my head, Hamilton ran into Rosberg at CotA 2015, albeit it was fairly light as Rosberg opted to go off the track rather than sustain damage. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7Cc7W1T2zQ

[George-Jung]

For me there are two kinds of great champions. The first kind are composed, take no risks, like Prost and Stewart. They drive/drove safe but fast, minimising risks. Then you have the second type, the ones on the edge and sometimes going too far. Senna had lots of mash ups like this, so did Hamilton and also Schumacher when he was challenged (especially all in their first half of their career). For all the rest in their driving only came after many years and after their first or second championship (when they got their hands on a dominant car and easy teammate). To me Verstappen isn't Hamilton '15 or Senna '91 yet, but he is a Senna '87. Fast, daring and exciting.

He will test his and his competitors limits for some time and thats a good thing. We don't want 5 Prosts at the start at a race, we need Senna's.

Gonna defend Hamilton here. He has never ran into another driver's car when making a racing overtake. His mashups with Massa and Webber were all down to those guys.

I agree that this incident was not Hamilton's fault but saying the past incidents are completely not his fault is so false. Are you a Hamilton fan or something? Look at this video to re-calibrate your past encounters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuLYuEmHZv0

I sure did forget a lot about 2011- thanks for making us remember; now we have more than enough ‘ammo’

I wonder how ‘Team Hamilton’ will react- once Lando Norris joins F1 and he’s being taken out by Hamilton.. must be a tough decision to make.

[NathanOlder]

Here you go;

https://youtu.be/aCvFybEDFLc

I didnt mean Karting. I meant a race car. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

Hahaha of course.. no hard feelings.

if you mean Formula cars.. it is because of Max’s steep curve. He went from karts to F3 which he almost won in his debute year and having most wins if I am not mistaken- to F1.. and when he entered F1 he wasn’t immediately in a WDC winning car.....such as Hamilton had with his ‘Ferrari’.

So your point being?

My point is Max was rushed in to F1, his "steep curve" as you put it, is exactly whats hurting him now, it took him and probably his father to agree to it, so no one made him (I'm noy saying that was a wrong move before you jump at me) So he didnt learn his trade like most others do. Lewis was given a Mclaren drive because he was relentless in lower formula's and he won every series he entered. Max hasn't won a single series he entered. Max came unstuck in F3 and still got an F1 drive with it, so he got lucky. Lewis won the Formula Renault 2.0, Euro F3, GP2 and Max failed at the F3 title, he finished 3rd and Ocon outscored gim by nearly 70pts. A quick look shows Max retired 8 times, Ocon failed to finish 2 times. Fast forward to present day, and Max is doing the exact same thing now! He must be in to double figures in his Red Bull career in number of times he's made contact with someone.

[NathanOlder]

Because of reliability, do your homework next time instead of hate posts.

Oh my.... do your homework they say.

So you have done yours ??

2017..... Max had 4 in race retirements due to mechanical issues.
Bahrain - Brakes
Canada - Electrics
Azerbaijan - Engine
Spa - Engine

You knew that obviously.

Daniel had 5 + 1 (being punted off the road by max in Hungary )

Australia - Engine
Russia - Brakes
USA - Engine
Mexico - Turbo
AbuDhabi - Hydraulics

You choose to ignore this ?

Also I'd like to add, Danny had more mechanicals towards the end of the year when the Red Bull was a stronger car.

So all of this added up means Max had loads more points than danny..... oh wait.

Dont acuse people of being haters when the facts back them up.

In the way you write it is quite obvious you are a hater so just gonna ignore you with your late not completed homework

The typical reply from someone who knows they are wrong and has no way to get out the hole they have dug.