2018 Spanish Grand Prix - Catalunya, May 11-13

[FrukostScones]

Can you tell who predicted before Friday that the tyres will suit Mercedes? One official article. Just one. Not the tom, dick and harrys after Saturday qualifying.

Isn't is enough to read that in three races there will be tyres used that allegedly were lobbied by Merc with a thinner tread and thus beavior most likely to benifit Mercedes. AMUS article from 6th April

So, reported tyres were used. And what was the outcome?

You still did not provide a proof of, who predicted that Mercedes would win on Friday. Just your thoughts? How would anyone know in April, when the decision was made to change the construction, was designed to help Mercedes?

I didn't predict Merc to win before the weekend, but after having read the AMUS article it was surely not a surprise that they didn't suffer problems with the tyres but instead excelled on them. I predicted that those tyres would help them. What we already saw on Saturday Qfying when fuelloads were identical.
You can be sure that there is proof that those tyres were meant to be used before Melbourne.
Maybe you write an email to an insider and you will get a reply you might believe.

[ferkan]

Pirelli would have done it anyway they said,
Merc lobbied for it Amus on 06. April said.
denied by smirking Wolff, but also stated by Ted Kravitz, but also denied by Mark Hughes (the guy with the Alonso Mattiaci "fantasy" story).

So what is the truth? We don't know.

Ask yourself, what knowledge of upcoming situation that Mercedes would have had, with which they go for lobbying? They were in the driver's seat with the tyres that Pirelli had introduced for the season opener, when Pirelli decided to bring tyres with reduced tread.

Relate it this way. If you were Toto today, would you want to have the tyres that you used in Spain OR the ones that Pirelli says will change for the next few races? That was the situation post Melbourne for Mercedes! So, I don't see why Mercedes needed lobbying, when they were in driver's seat.

If I would have been Toto in Melbourne, I would have resisted Pirelli trying to change the tyre construction.

Mercedes has been playing to the interest of the field from 2014. They could have resisted the Token system change, when they were dominating, but didn't. They could have resisted Honda's engine allocation increase for 2016, but they didn't. They even offered to help Honda. They could have resisted fuel limit change from 100kg to 105kg (while other manufacturers were struggling on fuel front), but didn't. They could have easily created a reliability situation and worked for using more oil, but didn't (remember Red Bull Renault in 2012? Exhaust blowing?). All the while, they were slowly letting their advantage slip. Compare it to Ferrari from 2000 to 2007!

Last year, they had a difficult car, but didn't got anything changed from tyre or regulations front, but worked their bu&&s hard to get their car right. It is baseless to blame them when there is so much of evidence, if you use your common sense to look through it. Unless, you are just sour that Ferrari lost the race.

What are you on about? Mercedes resisted HARD on token change thing. They offered 10% more tokens, but no more time during winter to do development, and this was firmly rejected by Ferrari and Renault. Only reason why it was dropped was because Ferrari argued that rules had loophole and that in season development was actually permitted. Merc was very angry at that time, I remember that clearly. So this "Mercedes always fought for entire field" bs is 100% wrong.

[Phil]

Not sour at all that Ferrari lost but only interesting that the predicted occured. Merc having no tyre problems at all on those "tailored" -0.4mm tread tyres.

That is not completely accurate though, is it? Everyone was struggling with the SS tires, at least in FP2. There was a clear trend suggesting that the SS had issues on this track. In QF it was extremely close between Ferrari and Mercedes. I think some of you are just hung-up on that Ferrari gambled with the S vs Mercedes who nailed an even better lap on the SS.

To illustrate:
Q1 - Ferrari/Vettel 1:17.031 (SS)
Q2 - Ferrari/Vettel 1:16.802 (S)
Q3-1 - Ferrari/Vettel 1:17.255 (SS)
Q3-2 - Ferrari/Vettel 1:16.305 (S)

Q1 - Mercedes/Hamilton 1:17.633 (SS)
Q2 - Mercedes/Bottas 1:17.111 (S)
Q3-1 - Mercedes/Hamilton 1:16.491 (SS)
Q3-2 - Mercedes/Hamilton 1:16.173 (SS)

Q3-2 - RedBull/Verstappen 1:16.816 (SS)
Q3-2 - RedBull/Ricciardo 1:16.818 (S)

Evidently from the above Vettel (Kimi too btw) had slower Q3 lap times than even their Q1 attempt on the same SS tire. This suggest that something clearly went wrong and following the on-board laps, it is quite evident that both made a mistake into T1. Maybe Ferrari panicked seeing that huge gap to Mercedes (7 tenths something) and then decided to gamble on Softs.

Going by expected evolution of times between Q1 and Q3, one had to assume that the Ferrari should have been easily capable of doing a mid 1.16 time on the SS in Q3 with everything turned up. Only Ferrari know why they decided to use their soft set. Looking at the RedBull and what pretty much everyone said, is that the difference between the soft and the SS was marginal around this track under those conditions.

Perhaps people should stop making the 0.4mm change responsible.

Yes, during the race, it seemed Mercedes dominated, but that could easily be down to fuel saving, something that was already evident in Winter-testing and at Melbourne this year. Even throughout the other 3 races, it seemed Mercedes had fantastic pace during the race, although some of it was masked by running behind a Ferrari in traffic and dirty air.

[TAG]

Apparently Ferrari invited crying Kimmy kid back this year as their guest. Next year, let him stay home. The kid's obviously cursed.



Or invite Alonso kid.

[Phil]

I think Kimi is cursed either way, sadly. I can't wrap my head around that just about every fault involves his car.

[Sieper]

Two turbos poof in one weekend, Kimi is on a bad luck streak. And also, Vettel Pitted in lap 18 (two stopper for Ferrari) but I am unsure how long Ferrari would have kept Kimi out (blocking both Verstappen and Ricciardo at the time of turbo poof).

Also, a small side note, the way Kimi made room (instantly) after his turbo went poof is just class.

[MtthsMlw]

Two turbos poof in one weekend, Kimi is on a bad luck streak. And also, Vettel Pitted in lap 18 (two stopper for Ferrari) but I am unsure how long Ferrari would have kept Kimi out (blocking both Verstappen and Ricciardo at the time of turbo poof).

Also, a small side note, the way Kimi made room (instantly) after his turbo went poof is just class.

I don't think it was a turbo issue in the race, they said this problem had nothing to do with the problem in FP.

[MrNoo]

The first one I have watched this season, wish I hadn't bothered to be honest. The FIA really need to get a set of rules together that allows racing, close racing at that. It is just a procession at best, tyres/aero/fuel/engines need sorting out in my opinion to enable drivers to race, race hard from the start, after all that is what a motor race is, is it not??

[Phil]

Motorsport is inherently processional, especially a model that has the fastest car starting at the front.

Yes, Barcelona was rather dull (if you can't enjoy or appreciate genuine racing), but people should appreciate that at least we have a wide variety of racing. We've had 3 races that were heavily influenced by safety cars and that saw lots of overtakes due to different strategies and at the same time, we had some races that usually produce little overtaking and entertainment. In my opinion, it's a great balance.

[Sieper]

I heard that last year the only on track overtake between Hamilton and Vettel (the P1 and P2 WDC contenders) was here in Spain (1 overtake) and even that was actually upon pit exit.

I have to say that I do feel that is a bit of a shame.

[Phil]

I am pretty sure that overtake was not on pit exit, but a lap or two later. Upon pit exit, Vettel nudged Hamilton slightly off circuit (Vettel came out pretty much side-by-side, perhaps a bit ahead if I recall correctly) and then he fell behind, but then he could make the move stick a lap later using DRS I think.

[Sieper]

Ah, OK, thanks for clarifying that Phil, I just casually saw the moment in the background during a F1 talkshow. But if we have such a clear clash between 1 and 2 I would like to see some more actual battling going on, 1 overtake (and then apparently again DRS assisted) is so littel. But the risks of doing so are almost unacceptable these days (if you fail all hell breaks loose).

[TAG]

I heard that last year the only on track overtake between Hamilton and Vettel (the P1 and P2 WDC contenders) was here in Spain (1 overtake) and even that was actually upon pit exit.

I have to say that I do feel that is a bit of a shame.

You heard wrong. There was at least one real overtake, Hamilton on Vettel for the lead in the US GP. Vettel had beaten him off the line and into turn 1 at the start.

[dans79]

I am pretty sure that overtake was not on pit exit, but a lap or two later. Upon pit exit, Vettel nudged Hamilton slightly off circuit (Vettel came out pretty much side-by-side, perhaps a bit ahead if I recall correctly) and then he fell behind, but then he could make the move stick a lap later using DRS I think.

This is all correct.

[vanburin]

Ah, OK, thanks for clarifying that Phil, I just casually saw the moment in the background during a F1 talkshow. But if we have such a clear clash between 1 and 2 I would like to see some more actual battling going on, 1 overtake (and then apparently again DRS assisted) is so littel. But the risks of doing so are almost unacceptable these days (if you fail all hell breaks loose).

I believe the lack of overtakes between first and second places is more-so due to the dominance of the leading car in each race, rather than being related to weighing the potential risks of an overtaking. If first place could be had by the second place driver, they're going for that spot. It also doesn't help when safety cars in the past races shake up the tp spots either.

It was said earlier in this thread that there was a number of overtakes (or at the very least, close on-track battles) throughout the midfield during this race. The trouble is the racing directors at times seem to ignore anyone beyond the top 3 teams unless there is a significant incident.

To be completely honest, I actually enjoyed this year's race more-so than previous Spanish GPs. This race is notoriously dull, but there was at least some action this year that kept the viewer engaged (it just so happened to not include the leader). IMO it was a better race to watch than Australia was as well.