2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

[nirvaand]

I never did, I've consistently rated Vandoorne as a slightly faster driver than Button, and the results reflect that. I put Norris amongst the likes of Riccardo and Hamilton, he could definitely give Alonso a run for his money.

You didn't, but everyone else did. It's the same thing. Stoffel was the real deal before he came into F1, now it's Lando. You thinking Lando will give Fernando a run for his money is hypothetical and absurd, you haven't even seen the guy race in F1. There is no point trying to compare Lando and Stoffel, only McLaren know who's better.

I've seen them race in the same car, I don't know if you remember a certain 24h race in the middle of Florida.

We're talking F1 here not endurance racing, and do you even have the timings to compare Lando and Fernando from Daytona? Anyways, the point I made earlier still stands.

[godlameroso]

Yep it's all archived on the IMSA site. Who cares what they're driving, they're in the same exact car with the same exact setup on an aero dependent car. It's the perfect place to make a comparison. I'm sorry you disagree, but it's no reason to act annoyed.

[nirvaand]

Yep it's all archived on the IMSA site. Who cares what they're driving, they're in the same exact car with the same exact setup on an aero dependent car. It's the perfect place to make a comparison. I'm sorry you disagree, but it's no reason to act annoyed.

I'm not acting annoyed, I'm just stating facts, while you are basing your argument on hypothetical situations. F1 and Prototype cars are completely different, they require different types of driving skill, so no, you can't make a comparison between the two series. Anyways, are you comparing Fernando and Lando based on their fastest lap times during the race? Instead, you should compare their lap times over a full stint, average it out and then see who's faster.

[Joseki]

Endurance racing is strange and different, unless you believe that Alonso would give less than 1 tenth to Nakajima in race trim or be even slower in quali trim (6h of Spa data).

The car has to be balanced in such a way that there's a baseline good for all drivers, they have to be all equally fast.

[godlameroso]

In race trim he was the most consistent driver, maybe he didn't have the best outright pace over one lap, but over a stint he was nearly untouchable. Alonso himself has said he doesn't have top one lap pace, but he is the most complete driver, his pace is relentless, rarely makes any mistakes, and capitalizes on every opportunity. It's the overall picture that sets him apart.

[godlameroso]

I'm not acting annoyed, I'm just stating facts, while you are basing your argument on hypothetical situations.

"F1 and Prototype cars are completely different, they require different types of driving skill, so no, you can't make a comparison between the two series."

Not a fact. Countless drivers compare LMP cars to open wheel cars the only difference is the LMPs are heavier and have less power, but they don't lack downforce. I'm also not comparing F1 to IMSA P2, I'm comparing two drivers in the same car with the same setup setting similar times over a stint with Norris being slightly faster in some instances. The third driver is a gold rated driver and he was no match for Norris or Alonso despite being a regular in that car. This isn't opinion it's facts, the data is there for you to see on the IMSA site, it's not my job to fetch data for you.

[Andres125sx]

I don´t think that´s a good comparison, only because in LMP1, as Fernando said himself, traffic plays a huge role, they can´t do two equal laps because they find traffic on everylap, but at different points each lap, so they must adapt to the circumstances.

Fastests lap may be the lap where that car found less traffic, not the fastest driver.... or not, who knows, but unless we see onboards of each driver fastest lap we can´t know for sure

[ALO_Power]

It's official:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mcla ... i-1040100/

(oops I think I'm a bit late)

[mwillems]

It's official:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mcla ... i-1040100/

(oops I think I'm a bit late)

But it's the first time I read that Mclaren have stated that the purchase has no connection to his sons racing career.

[mwillems]

Re Lando, Stoffel and Jenson. Button had a strong connection with fans, PR and marketing which helped his longevity. I think Stoffel is doing Ok in the car, his performance v Alonso is similar to Buttons. Unfortunately he's dull as dishwater and that i think is part of the reason some people are having this conversation. He just wouldn't be missed too much.

[ME4ME]

"F1 and Prototype cars are completely different, they require different types of driving skill, so no, you can't make a comparison between the two series."

Not a fact. Countless drivers compare LMP cars to open wheel cars the only difference is the LMPs are heavier and have less power, but they don't lack downforce. I'm also not comparing F1 to IMSA P2, I'm comparing two drivers in the same car with the same setup setting similar times over a stint with Norris being slightly faster in some instances. The third driver is a gold rated driver and he was no match for Norris or Alonso despite being a regular in that car. This isn't opinion it's facts, the data is there for you to see on the IMSA site, it's not my job to fetch data for you.

If we change the question into: Do you expect Norris to match Alonso in Formula 1 in Norris' first year? Personally I think that's very unlikely. Thats why I suggested to park him somewhere else, if possible.

It leaves the question if it's possible to find a driver to match Alonso in the short term anyway. Other than maybe Ricciardo, I don't think there's a driver available that will do that. So if nobody can, we're back to: would anyone do better than Vandoorne currently does, or will do in a potential 3rd year?

As for my personal opinion, I don't think Norris will match Alonso in his first two years, if ever. Just as Vandoorne wasn't able to. What I do think is that Magnussen would be a slight upgrade over Vandoorne, he's more of a fighter and gets stuff done. I would put him in the car and let Norris do a year in Super Formula to mature a bit further.

[flmkane]

I'm gonna make a possibly unpopular prediction

No new driver will match Alonso, Hamilton or Vettel, UNLESS they've spent a year or more in a lower tier team first (STR, Force India, Sauber etc)

The ONLY reason Ham and Seb were competitive from the get go, was because of massive experience with TESTING F1 cars in season.

In season testing, is mostly banned. No way for a new driver to come in prepared.
Lando, Vandoorne... doesn't matter. They are starting from a huge disadvantage.
The only reason Max and Dan are so good is because of their STR experience.

On a side note, I dont think Lando is a new Hamilton. To match Hamilton, Lando would not only need similar race pace to Alonso, he'd also need to be faster than Alonso in qualifying. That's just not going to happen.

[godlameroso]

If you're fast you're fast in anything, power wheels or F1 it doesn't matter.

[McHonda]

Lando had to deal with wet weather in the 24hr so the averages wouldn't do him any favours there anyway but their dry laps were at least similar from what I remember. But as has been pointed out it doesn't really point towards anything useful in terms of single seaters because you set the car up to be the best for all 3 drivers, not towards your own preference. If Alonso could go 4ths faster with a certain set up it still wouldn't be implemented if it cost the other two to be further away from their base line and vice versa. That's not an issue in single seaters.

Hartley is a world class prototype driver, he isn't in single seaters. Alonso is world class in single seaters, Conway has been faster than him in both their prototype races thus far, never mind Lando.

It's doesn't mean anything in regards to any F1 matchup., I wouldn't fancy Conway's chances there either.

[marmer]

If you're fast you're fast in anything, power wheels or F1 it doesn't matter.

Experience counts you wouldn't expect a DTM driver to jump into and F1 car even if he was the best driver in the field and beat a top F1 driver. Equally Kimi was not that good at rally so it works both ways