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This was something that completely baffled me as well at first, then I realized that a crane had come onto the track and it seems the default mode for the FIA now is that if a crane comes on the track, throw a VSC..
Ah, that explains it. I missed that detail in that case and in that case, I guess it was the right thing to do. I did notice something though - the VSC ended on lap 16, so there really wasn't a lot of time to decide to come in. It would be interesting to know on what part of the track Hamilton was when the VSC hit and how much time Mercedes had to react. He was quite a bit ahead of those that pitted!
The thing for me was a) the mistake and b) not reacting to it. Everyone knew it was a mistake once he carried on and everyone else pitted apart from them. Bringing him straight in the next time round would have still be better. At least some of his stop would have been under VSC. I'm not sure how far into lap 16 the VSC ended so it could well have been all of it.
I'm half-hearten to say they should have been more prepared for this than anyone. It was there own car that gave up to cause it and they would have known there car was stopping on track before anyone else. No one seemed to use that extra 10-20 secs wisely.
Wow from hero (Saturday) to zero (Sunday), what a bummer…
Can't believe that we had such a dismal performance...
2 questions:
Merc didn't test with the soft during FP, correct? As Lewis' pace was horrible on it.
And the 'softer' tyre (SS) seemed fine: so weird… I hate these damn tyres. Always inconsistent...
Secondly, even if Lewis had stayed in front, he would have lost out to the pack due to his poor SOFT tyre performance, no?
I hope we can bounce back strongly in Silverstone. They really need a 1-2 now!
ps: also not entirely ok with vettel's overtake, he nearly ran Lewis off the track it seemed...
Remember when Lewis used to do the same to Nico and everyone used to be like you need to be ruthless to be a world champion LOL.
It was hard also, but this was a step too far. If you look again, vettel was lucky that they didn't lock tyres...
No it wasn't. I am not a Vettel fan at all, I feel he is way over rated by his fans but no, Lewis used to push Nico off the track and he did it a lot of times. This wasn't step too far.
Mercedes took a gamble upon their superior partymode, to combine with a faster setup, taking benefits of running in clean air after a 1st row qualifying. That is the reason they were scared to get stuck behind Danny or Kimi of one of those would stay out.
If there had been no VSC, it would have been an easy victory - drive to half way of the GP, manage the gap to the front and safely get to the end of the race.
Secondly, even if Lewis had stayed in front, he would have lost out to the pack due to his poor SOFT tyre performance, no?
Difficult to say, really. In my personal opinion the soft would have worked just fine if the race went according to plan. However, it didn't and a angry Hamilton was suddenly in fourth. I think he simply ruined the tire and was overdriving the car.
ps: also not entirely ok with vettel's overtake, he nearly ran Lewis off the track it seemed...
That's an absolute load of bullshit. It is actually something you should blame Hamilton himself for, considering he forced Vettel onto the grass. Dirty tire means less grip, and thus a longer braking distance.
Bullshit, your reply perhaps?
Take a look at 4.33, vettel goes wide himself! And then almost pushes Lewis off (hooked wheels nearly) at 4.35. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNmfS9PSeYg
Mercedes AMG + Hamilton => dreamteam!
If you can't beat'em, call Masi!
Mercedes lost the GP the moment the VSC appeared and Hamilton wasn't in the pits, and the competition was. there was no way out.
They should have done damage control and immediately sent Hamilton in afterwards, that way the amount of 'time' lost would have been as less as possible. The amount of laps they left Hamilton out left the competition to gain on him. 10 laps, wasn't it? Hamilton came out 4th, right? i'm pretty sure that had he pitted right afterwards, he would atleast have had 3rd, possibly close behind 2nd.
He would have been more motivated, and in the same 'flow'. I'm sure he also would not have called for more power as he felt he needed something, but that happened right after he was overtaken.
That in itself then could have been enough that Lewis never asked for that extra power which was without a doubt at the very least a catalytic element for his Merc to give the ghost, just as Bottas' Merc killed itself.
The threat from DannyRic solved itself, only Raikkonen and Vettel stayed. Sure, Vettel overtook Lewis, but that being said, Lewis was mad not in the mood to be any way conservative, and one can only wonder what effect Lewis' wake would have had on Vettel/Raikkonen if he was right with them.
Hamilton was fully right, that there was no way he could overtake Ferrari. The hot wake paired to the hot track and weather killed any chance, no matter how much power they could have pulled from the engine. But at that same time, Lewis' wake surely would have influenced that of the Ferrari's too. I'm pretty confident the 'flow' or 'momentum' of the race would have helped Lewis, whereas pitting 10 laps later completely threw Lewis into a whole different momentum and position which quite frankly, was in all ways impossible to come back from.
In all honesty, they should have left Lewis with nothing extra and simply needed him to finish 4th. That would have beem a LOT better than what he ended up with today.
And on top of that, Mercedes never was going to be as strong @ Spielberg anyway.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"
Mercedes lost the GP the moment the VSC appeared and Hamilton wasn't in the pits, and the competition was. there was no way out.
They should have done damage control and immediately sent Hamilton in afterwards, that way the amount of 'time' lost would have been as less as possible. The amount of laps they left Hamilton out left the competition to gain on him. 10 laps, wasn't it? Hamilton came out 4th, right? i'm pretty sure that had he pitted right afterwards, he would atleast have had 3rd, possibly close behind 2nd.
He would have been more motivated, and in the same 'flow'. I'm sure he also would not have called for more power as he felt he needed something, but that happened right after he was overtaken.
That in itself then could have been enough that Lewis never asked for that extra power which was without a doubt at the very least a catalytic element for his Merc to give the ghost, just as Bottas' Merc killed itself.
The threat from DannyRic solved itself, only Raikkonen and Vettel stayed. Sure, Vettel overtook Lewis, but that being said, Lewis was mad not in the mood to be any way conservative, and one can only wonder what effect Lewis' wake would have had on Vettel/Raikkonen if he was right with them.
Hamilton was fully right, that there was no way he could overtake Ferrari. The hot wake paired to the hot track and weather killed any chance, no matter how much power they could have pulled from the engine. But at that same time, Lewis' wake surely would have influenced that of the Ferrari's too. I'm pretty confident the 'flow' or 'momentum' of the race would have helped Lewis, whereas pitting 10 laps later completely threw Lewis into a whole different momentum and position which quite frankly, was in all ways impossible to come back from.
In all honesty, they should have left Lewis with nothing extra and simply needed him to finish 4th. That would have beem a LOT better than what he ended up with today.
And on top of that, Mercedes never was going to be as strong @ Spielberg anyway.
If they had pulled him in right away would he not have come out with Mag?
He would have shot his tyres just catching up to the top 4.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.
Driver-oriented fans having to face the harsh reality that F1 is a team sport. If a bad strategy call (a dubious suggestion) inspires temper tantrums and in-cockpit pouting to the extent that the car breaks, that's not necessarily the fault of the engineers or strategists, but the driver's. But I don't think that's what happened. Is there evidence to suggest that safety cars and pit stops caused mechanical failures in both cars?
"We..." Five WDCs, five WCCs, and... one bad weekend?
Yes. The man has screwed up on so many occasions but the speed of the car has been masking it. He is only getting exposed now that the pack has caught up.
That stupid rainbow circle of his never works either. I say get rid of it too.
Last edited by PlatinumZealot on 03 Jul 2018, 07:12, edited 1 time in total.
Mercedes lost the GP the moment the VSC appeared and Hamilton wasn't in the pits, and the competition was. there was no way out.
They should have done damage control and immediately sent Hamilton in afterwards, that way the amount of 'time' lost would have been as less as possible. The amount of laps they left Hamilton out left the competition to gain on him. 10 laps, wasn't it? Hamilton came out 4th, right? i'm pretty sure that had he pitted right afterwards, he would atleast have had 3rd, possibly close behind 2nd.
He would have been more motivated, and in the same 'flow'. I'm sure he also would not have called for more power as he felt he needed something, but that happened right after he was overtaken.
That in itself then could have been enough that Lewis never asked for that extra power which was without a doubt at the very least a catalytic element for his Merc to give the ghost, just as Bottas' Merc killed itself.
The threat from DannyRic solved itself, only Raikkonen and Vettel stayed. Sure, Vettel overtook Lewis, but that being said, Lewis was mad not in the mood to be any way conservative, and one can only wonder what effect Lewis' wake would have had on Vettel/Raikkonen if he was right with them.
Hamilton was fully right, that there was no way he could overtake Ferrari. The hot wake paired to the hot track and weather killed any chance, no matter how much power they could have pulled from the engine. But at that same time, Lewis' wake surely would have influenced that of the Ferrari's too. I'm pretty confident the 'flow' or 'momentum' of the race would have helped Lewis, whereas pitting 10 laps later completely threw Lewis into a whole different momentum and position which quite frankly, was in all ways impossible to come back from.
In all honesty, they should have left Lewis with nothing extra and simply needed him to finish 4th. That would have beem a LOT better than what he ended up with today.
And on top of that, Mercedes never was going to be as strong @ Spielberg anyway.
How vettel got the DRS on Lewis was down to the awkward pit entrance. On his entry to the pits Ricciardo had to slow on the apex so that backed Lewis up into Vettel and the rest was history.
I think Vettel's move was definitely unfair. It was a clumsy attempt to hang hamilton out to dry which is sort of unecessary because Hamiton was alongside on corner entry. Not the place to close tye door. You do that on corner exit when the other guy is slightly behind. They could have easily crashed out if Hamiton didnt have his wits about him. Vettel is so awkward when it comes to wheel to wheel.
"We..." Five WDCs, five WCCs, and... one bad weekend?
Yes. The man has screwed up on so many occasions butand the speed ofhe the car has been masking it. He is only getting exposed now that the pack has caught up.
That stupid rainbow circle of his never works either. I say get rid of it too.
Are you sure it's not a case of only noticing someone when something goes wrong? When they're doing their job well, they're invisible.
If I remember correctly gaps between Hamilton and the rest of the followers stayed almost the same from lap 15 to 25, so he would come behind Ricciardo and in front of Vettel anyway.
When Vettel was overtaking Hamilton it looked like "don't you even try to think getting position back". It showed how much better race pace had Ferrari over rest of the field. If Kimi wouldn't make mistakes he would have easily won.
Five WDCs, five WCCs, and... one bad weekend?