2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

[Juzh]

It seems it's going up while breaking.

Yes it does. By about the 20%? It’s about a 3 second stop so that’s about 360 kJ. Which might suggest full scale is in the region of 2MJ. that would be consistent with the 10second full power if the ES was supplying both K and H.

Aren't those lights on the top-left of the steering only DRS-related? I'd imagine the battery is shown on the actual LCD. You can see Bottas has the same setup. When DRS is available that one light comes on and when they activate it, the rest come on. Or in another setup, the higher engine mode seems to light them up.

I would also think it's the battery except after his overtake, under braking, the lights don't come up (unlike when he brakes before the overtake), so they're not related to any sort of recharging.

Just speculating.

No one's talking about drs lights. Discussion is about the gray vertical bar on the lcd display.

[bonjon1979]

I'm not sure how much it has been commented on here but Merc, or Hamilton at least, seemed to have far superior race pace, which was really surprising to me. All the talk and data over the weekend suggested Ferrari would be further ahead in the race, as they were in Spa (compared to Q2 which looked really close on raw speed). I know there's the caveat of what could Vettel have done, but Kimi was on good form this race and must have been highly motivated as he was leading. I doubt Vettel could have gone significantly faster. But Hamilton was under a second behind for the majority of the race, even through most corners, which suggests far superior speed - it felt more like the days when Merc still had a good buffer over Ferrari.

Toto did say Merc made a good step from Spa to Monza in terms of both engine and chassis - I wonder if they unlocked more from their engine after assessing it during spa, as Ferrari did with one of their previous engine upgrades a few races after it was initially introduced. It does make me think how far Merc could be ahead if Ferrari didn't come up with this electrical boost trick around Austria/Silverstone time. It looks like the engines are very similar again now and that's after Ferrari doing a big boost for engine 2 and engine 3, plus the electrical trick. If their engine upgrades had of been relatively minor then Merc would be far up the road. It also makes you wonder if Merc have always had performance in hand with their engine after such dominance and simply go conservative with their upgrades for reliability reasons. Maybe this time they have unleashed the beast so to speak and we're seeing what they're truly capable of. Imagine if Merc work out how to get the extra electrical energy between now and the end of the season!?

Of course the other factor is tyres, which still cease to amaze/confuse me. All the talk is that Ferrari are kinder on their tyres, but I don't buy this - it used to be the case, but this season there have been many examples of Merc being better. At the start of the season in certain races, e.g. China comes to mind, I felt Ferrari had a big pace advantage but had to be more gentle on their tyres than Merc. In more recent times at Germany Ferrari seemed better on the supersoft (or it may have been ultra) but then when they switched to the soft tyre (which Hamilton had ran for a huge amount of laps with good pace) they were destroying them very quickly and didn't look comfortable. In Hungary the exact opposite happened where Vettel looked more comfortable than Merc on the soft, but Hamilton did a brilliant opening stint. Something similar happened in Spa whereby Ferrari looked better on the soft, and then in Monza Merc were just better on both tyres. One thing is for sure, there is not a massive difference and it very much depends on a given track layout, for a given weather condition, for a given tyre.

Finally, the 30 point lead Hamilton now has looks to be quite crucial in the championship battle. If my math is correct, I think Vettel could win 5 of the remaining 7 races and come 2nd in the other two, whilst Hamilton could win two races come 2nd in three and 3rd in two (which seems very plausible), and win the championship by 3 points.

Singapore is critical because at all other tracks (even Mexico) I cannot see RB troubling Merc - RB seem to have fallen behind; even in Hungary RB didn't look a realistic threat in the dry or wet. If in Singapore Hamilton can get ahead of the RB then he is guaranteed 3rd position, and Kimi doesn't tend to go too well at Singapore so maybe even 2nd. I feel if Hamilton manages to get 2nd or 3rd at Singapore then assuming he doesn't have any reliability issues or crashes (a big 'if' I know) then he should win the championship.

Good analysis. Seb needs to win at Singapore. There's no two ways about it. I still think that there's going to be a reliability twist in this tale somewhere. Hamilton can survive one calamitous day but Vettel really can't. Seb got very lucky yesterday in that the safety car allowed him to not lose a lap on the pack. Had there not been a safety car then he would have struggled to get much more than 7th place.

Ferrari strategy has to share a great deal of the blame yesterday. Firstly, they should've brought more softs so they could get some running on them in practice. Second, they should have given Seb the tow in qualifying (although maybe this wouldn't've made that much difference as Seb had a two from Hamilton instead. Thirdly, they should've worked out their race strategy more clearly. Seb should never have been trying to overtake Kimi where he did. His focus should've been on keeping hamilton behind for the first few laps. After it settled down they could've swapped Kimi and Seb at their leisure. Some very strange decisions going on from the team/Seb and i wonder if it's the pressure telling on them.

Overall though, one must credit hamilton. He was incredible yesterday, not just in the overtakes he made but also the fast laps he was able to pull out when Kimi pitted. He was pretty much matching the ferrari shod on brand new tyres with tyres that were twenty laps old. the pace he showed at that point in the race forced Kimi to mess up his soft tyres and effectively won hamilton the race. Brilliant Grand prix to watch.

Hamilton also did his fastest lap of the race (a 1:22.4) on lap 30, which at the time was about a second quicker than what Kimi was able to do only a few laps before, and I'm not even sure that Lewis was pushing as much on that lap as Kimi was during the pit crossover period, as whilst he'd want to catch Kimi it wasn't as critical as staying in the lead was for Kimi. It just looked like the Merc was on fire on race day and had quite a lot of pace in hand for some reason.

I wonder if it has something to do with it being a shorter lap? If Ferrari's power advantage is down to their ability to harvest and deploy more electrical energy. Perhaps, this only really comes into effect on the longer tracks as the merc is depleted at times when the Ferrari isn't. Around monza, that effect is nullified? Just throwing it out there as a possibility, not sure if there's anything in it.

[Juzh]

Hamilton also did his fastest lap of the race (a 1:22.4) on lap 30, which at the time was about a second quicker than what Kimi was able to do only a few laps before, and I'm not even sure that Lewis was pushing as much on that lap as Kimi was during the pit crossover period, as whilst he'd want to catch Kimi it wasn't as critical as staying in the lead was for Kimi. It just looked like the Merc was on fire on race day and had quite a lot of pace in hand for some reason.

Pretty much this. Raikkonen was doing 1:23.5 - 1.23.8s laptimes after pitstop, while trying to prevent overcut, so pushing at 100%. Hamilton 8 laps later was doing 1:22.4, 1:22.7 and 1:22.8. So yeah, no doubt mercedes was vastly superior troughout the race.

[TwanV]

So overall a very interesting race, I was rooting for Kimi but Ferrari really didn't get the tire strategy right unfortunately.

Unsurprisingly Max was back to his old tricks of trying to run others off the road. The penalty was well deserved and the petulant radio conversation very entertaining.

I don't think Max did it on purpose though. Either he did not see Bottas coming, or he thought he left a one car width. Still rather foolish, but it happens.

Bottas was quite lucky he did not suffer damage there. His front wing could have been lobbed off, his suspension could have been broken, he could have been launched into the wall,... . Max, please be a bit more careful next time .

I used to give him the benefit of the doubt but he just keeps doing these stupid pincer moves on other drivers - clearly he has amazing skills and pace. That said he is prone to misjudging things and crashing all on his own eg Monaco.

yeah I agree he screwed up this time.. 10 cm more space and it wouldn't be a problem, I'm sure he will agree after seeing the replay. Bottas had half a meter of green pavement to spare but you can't blame him for not taking that room at corner entry. VES had no need to go so aggressive too, Bottas could never really commit himself to at least be completely side by side braking into the corner
It's a shame, I read some comments here that there was no merit in keeping Bottas at bay, well I don't agree. Keeping a Merc at bay for a podium in Monza in a RB would be masterful. Sadly he went over the red line a little.

[Sieper]

I was wondering if Ferrari could have put Kimi on a different strategy, because he was the first to come in. Could they have seen it coming that Kimi would have come out behind Bottas and thus lose tremendous amount of time behind him? First I thought Merc was hesitant towards pitting Lewis, but I think they were looking at the severity of the rain that was falling. Either way, Merc still could have had the upper hand with 5 laps fresher tires towards the end. It was just pure smart racing by the team and just Lewis on his best imo.

I don't think Kimi lost so much time behind Bottas, the main problem for him was that he came in first. Hamiltons SS were still in good enough condition to put in "blistering" fast laps whilst Kimi had to at least match that pace (to prevent the overcut) on his fresh set of softs. This burned up his tires, he just had to push to much on fresh softs and as a result they blistered early in their potential lifespan. We have seen the same happening for other drivers on other tracks (most noticeably Austria). The only way Kimi would have had a chance yesterday, is as you said, if they used a different strategy and kept him out longer. Hamilton was just to fast/ to good.

[marvin78]

I don't think Max did it on purpose though. Either he did not see Bottas coming, or he thought he left a one car width. Still rather foolish, but it happens.

Bottas was quite lucky he did not suffer damage there. His front wing could have been lobbed off, his suspension could have been broken, he could have been launched into the wall,... . Max, please be a bit more careful next time .

I used to give him the benefit of the doubt but he just keeps doing these stupid pincer moves on other drivers - clearly he has amazing skills and pace. That said he is prone to misjudging things and crashing all on his own eg Monaco.

yeah I agree he screwed up this time..

... and on many other occasions.

[tranquility2k4]

I have to say I was disappointed in Max's reaction to his manoeuvrer on Bottas. It strikes me that he's still incredibly immature or too arrogant for his own good in his reaction to being told about the penalty. I don't see how he can become world champion with this attitude. Look at Vettel - he's costing himself points with certain mistakes and I feel Verstappen in the same situation may do this even more often on current form. I thought he'd got over this kind of behaviour after the early season shenanigans.

On another note if Vettel's mistakes do cost him the WDC then this is arguably the 2nd in a row he will have lost (although last year there were mechanical issues too). Surely some people at Ferrari must be thinking if Alonso was there they would have won, or would have been much closer. This may sound ridiculous, but if Vettel messes up again over the next race or two, could we see Ferrari make a dramatic U-turn and sign up Alonso to be his team mate for 2019? If not next year then surely if Vettel doesn't deliver in 2019 they would consider him for 2020?

[F1NAC]

I have to say I was disappointed in Max's reaction to his manoeuvrer on Bottas. It strikes me that he's still incredibly immature or too arrogant for his own good in his reaction to being told about the penalty. I don't see how he can become world champion with this attitude. Look at Vettel - he's costing himself points with certain mistakes and I feel Verstappen in the same situation may do this even more often on current form. I thought he'd got over this kind of behaviour after the early season shenanigans.

On another note if Vettel's mistakes do cost him the WDC then this is arguably the 2nd in a row he will have lost (although last year there were mechanical issues too). Surely some people at Ferrari must be thinking if Alonso was there they would have won, or would have been much closer. This may sound ridiculous, but if Vettel messes up again over the next race or two, could we see Ferrari make a dramatic U-turn and sign up Alonso to be his team mate for 2019? If not next year then surely if Vettel doesn't deliver in 2019 they would consider him for 2020?

Because of chaotic environment that Alonso brings, Ferrari shouldn't do that. Promote Leclerc, he has a lot more potential for them (on long terms). I just cannot think how Ferrari must be mentally demolished after Sunday. All ITalian journos are firing from all fronts at them.

[dfegan358]

As a Ferrari fan I think it managed poorly on the strategy front.

They should have been aiming for Vettel to get pole on Saturdays and hope Kimi gets second. If Vettel was pole he would driven off in the distance.

I’ve huge respect for Hamilton, he just has so much raw pace to pressurise Kimi into wrecking his tyres that was the difference. Ferrari strategy really was out the window after vettels spin.

Vettel needs to win Singapore and get help from red bull. No more mistakes. Hamilton’s consistency is building a lead a deservedly so.

The Cars are so closely matched down to strategy, teamwork and driver errors being minimised.

[saviour stivala]

Monza was a race that FERRARI has lost, gifted to Mercedes. Both the FERRARI SF71H as car as well as the 062 FERRARI engine has a clear advantage over the Mercedes car and its engine.

[sosic2121]

Because of chaotic environment that Alonso brings, Ferrari shouldn't do that. Promote Leclerc, he has a lot more potential for them (on long terms). I just cannot think how Ferrari must be mentally demolished after Sunday. All ITalian journos are firing from all fronts at them.

As a huge Ferrari fan, there's nothing I wish more than Fernando come back!
I believe he would be WDC this year and last year. I don't even care which driver Ferrari would replace. Maybe even both of them.

I feel both Ferrari and RB dropped the ball with Ricciardo. Especially RB when they chose that wrecking ball over him.

[TAG]

Particularly interesting was Hamilton being able to 'Hammer Time' for several laps and then still managing to stretch the rubber into getting a decent offset. He was running in mostly clear air but I think that's still pretty impressive. It was also important for Hamilton to best Vettel on track. He takes the idea of being a better racer than Vettel pretty seriously and Vettel schooled him hard at Spa. This result should stop any further undermining of Hamilton's ego (for now at least) and Hamilton appears to be a driver strongly influenced by such things.

A series of poor decisions from Vettel but I think it shows that Ferrari weren't planning to swap them for the lead. I say that because otherwise Vettel wouldn't have compromised himself trying to dive up the inside. Anyway, error 1) Why dive up the inside there? He's faster than Kimi and faster than Hamilton. Why not just wait for the start finish straight and breeze past? Error 2) Why fight Hamilton at all? He's faster than Hamilton, why not let him past then breeze past on the start finish straight? Even if you can't pass him there, you've then got Hamilton trapped between two faster cars so you'll definitely nail him during the stops. Error 3) Vettel could not afford a DNF and yet took that risk unhesitatingly. It amazes me that teams and drivers don't seem to game out these situations beforehand so they can make a logical decision away from the heat of the moment.

You're able to see that Hamilton has a weakness, let's call ego as you did but that's your word. Yet, you're unable to see Vettel's problem even though you're writing down the very answer to the question you're asking yourself.

In Spa there was no schooling, it was a superior car running away with it. We've seen it from Mercedes for a few years now, It should have been a Ferrari on Pole but it wasn't. The result on Sunday was what it was going to be. Yesterday however you saw Vettel drive as he's driven on many occasions. Impulsively, with ham fisted attempts and without any rationale. The red mist... what you call a series of poor decisions that started when he wasn't allowed pole yesterday.

Vettel winding up sideways attempting an overtake is something that he's done plenty during his career.

[Jolle]

Particularly interesting was Hamilton being able to 'Hammer Time' for several laps and then still managing to stretch the rubber into getting a decent offset. He was running in mostly clear air but I think that's still pretty impressive. It was also important for Hamilton to best Vettel on track. He takes the idea of being a better racer than Vettel pretty seriously and Vettel schooled him hard at Spa. This result should stop any further undermining of Hamilton's ego (for now at least) and Hamilton appears to be a driver strongly influenced by such things.

A series of poor decisions from Vettel but I think it shows that Ferrari weren't planning to swap them for the lead. I say that because otherwise Vettel wouldn't have compromised himself trying to dive up the inside. Anyway, error 1) Why dive up the inside there? He's faster than Kimi and faster than Hamilton. Why not just wait for the start finish straight and breeze past? Error 2) Why fight Hamilton at all? He's faster than Hamilton, why not let him past then breeze past on the start finish straight? Even if you can't pass him there, you've then got Hamilton trapped between two faster cars so you'll definitely nail him during the stops. Error 3) Vettel could not afford a DNF and yet took that risk unhesitatingly. It amazes me that teams and drivers don't seem to game out these situations beforehand so they can make a logical decision away from the heat of the moment.

You're able to see that Hamilton has a weakness, let's call ego as you did but that's your word. Yet, you're unable to see Vettel's problem even though you're writing down the very answer to the question you're asking yourself.

In Spa there was no schooling, it was a superior car running away with it. We've seen it from Mercedes for a few years now, It should have been a Ferrari on Pole but it wasn't. The result on Sunday was what it was going to be. Yesterday however you saw Vettel drive as he's driven on many occasions. Impulsively, with ham fisted attempts and without any rational. The red mist... what you call a series of poor decisions that started when he wasn't allowed pole yesterday.

Vettel winding up sideways attempting an overtake is something that he's done plenty during his career.

Don't forget, Hamilton now is the fast one lapper in qualifying and superior efficient during races with a grip on himself when it comes to tactics and waiting for an opportunity instead of bluntly trying to win the race on the first corner, but he wasn't like this in the early years of his career... the self restraint only came after his second WC. At the moment his only weakness is the reliably of his car, especially now he's got a good and compliant teammate.

[GrandAxe]

...
On another note if Vettel's mistakes do cost him the WDC then this is arguably the 2nd in a row he will have lost (although last year there were mechanical issues too). Surely some people at Ferrari must be thinking if Alonso was there they would have won, or would have been much closer. This may sound ridiculous, but if Vettel messes up again over the next race or two, could we see Ferrari make a dramatic U-turn and sign up Alonso to be his team mate for 2019? If not next year then surely if Vettel doesn't deliver in 2019 they would consider him for 2020?

Ferrari is in deep crisis with drivers. Kimi is approaching the end of his career, while Vettel's mistakes cost them the title last year and could do so this year as well.

Its not impossible that Leclerc might actually be coming in to both replace Vettel and be tutored for a year by Kimi. The reason for that suspicion is that in the last few races Ferrari has let go of aggressively using Kimi to back Vettel, letting them race instead, even when it could be costly (like last weekend). It almost looks like they are wanting to see how an unfettered Kimi would do in a fair fight with Vettel.

Maybe its a long shot, but who knows?

[GrandAxe]

Merc deliberately trolled Ferrari with their formation lap at Monza, Ferrari acted with similar over the top celebrations after Silverstone.
The FIA should consider reigning in such behaviour before weaker minded fans take it as cue for hooliganism.